# Touring with Fixtures



## Capi (Jan 1, 2008)

I'm interested in how you pack lighting instruments for transport, namely a touring show. They would be in a box truck. Do you use road cases or another method? I hope it is clear enough what I am asking. Let me know if I need to clarify anything. Thanks for any insight.


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## sound_nerd (Jan 1, 2008)

We use roadcases for all of the touring gear. 8-way truck pack cases for the ERS fixtures and the fresnels, two way cases for the movers. The only fixtures that aren't in roadcases are the par bars/acl bars, which get put on a rack that holds 9 bars. The lenses for the ERS fixtures live in another 8-way case in the event we need to swap lenses out.


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## Pie4Weebl (Jan 1, 2008)

Meat racks are the way to go for large amount of conventional lighting fixtures and dual flight cases for movers. 

Also, don't search for meat rack on google image search, there are just some things you can't unsee.


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## Eboy87 (Jan 1, 2008)

I never thought I'd get a chance to use this, but, in light of Pie's post:




That is all.


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## Capi (Jan 1, 2008)

sound_nerd said:


> We use roadcases for all of the touring gear. 8-way truck pack cases for the ERS fixtures and the fresnels, two way cases for the movers.



What's an 8-way case? Maybe a link...


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## Footer (Jan 2, 2008)

Will you be pre-rigging anything? If you are going to be going the unistrut pre-rig route, meat racks made for that are your best bet. I personally don't like conventionals in cases, I prefer meat racks (or swing truss if you have some cash....). Few things of info would be helpful... how many fixtures... are they hung in clumps or all over the place...


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## Techiegirly (Jan 2, 2008)

Pie4Weebl said:


> Also, don't search for meat rack on google image search, there are just some things you can't unsee.



Oh that was great...I'm almost tempted to do a Google search though now. Any one else feel that way too?


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## Les (Jan 2, 2008)

Not to continue hijack but... Once I did an images search on Annie because I was designing the show and I wanted to see the set. Google has a dirty mind!!!


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## Capi (Jan 2, 2008)

Footer4321 said:


> Will you be pre-rigging anything? If you are going to be going the unistrut pre-rig route, meat racks made for that are your best bet. I personally don't like conventionals in cases, I prefer meat racks (or swing truss if you have some cash....). Few things of info would be helpful... how many fixtures... are they hung in clumps or all over the place...



First of all, this is a summer tour that has gone out the last couple years. The last two years it was Godspell and this year is Joseph. Anyway, the way they had it last year, and I assume it will be done the same this time, is they had, IIRC, 4 S4's on a pipe (bolted to it) with a Gator Clamp at each end of the pipe. This was then attached to the truss when they reached the venue, and the truss was then flown out. I think they had probably 20-25 lights for front light hung this way. They we had a S4 pars in shop-built box trusses and a few other fixtures upstage, but I'm not sure how.

In the past, transportation went like this: They had two or three 4x4 beams with angle brackets on each end spanning the width of the truck. The pipes with the S4's were then set on the beams with the fixtures hanging down. There were some problems with this. 1) The lights were free to move around and hit each other, the wall of the truck etc. 2) Occasionally, this caused the nuts to come off the bolts leaving the unsaftied lights dangling. 

I plan on doing some things different this year. (If you haven't guessed, I was not on the tour last year, but I heard stories from my friends and room mate) This year, if we go the same route, I'm going to make sure every light is either double nutted or use lock nuts, make sure everything is saftied, and use blankets between the sets of lights and probably strap them to each other, if not also to the wall.

I am interested in any other ways transportation, or any other tips I can garner. Thanks.

BTW: My curiosity got the best of me and I Google Imaged "meat racks". Didn't really get anything that shocking....maybe if I turned the Safe Search function off... But I don't think I will.... Thanks for all the advice.


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## Footer (Jan 2, 2008)

ship said:


> Meet BK Broiler (Big Kittie, Bunnie Killer amongst other names for him) - a roadie of one tour experience (accident but adopted by that local crew also) and who loved to walk the truss. And his sister Carlie Simon. BK was the best shop cat ever and my cat about the shop. Here they are one night at my desk while I stayed late in inspecting lamps. Could type away all night on the keyboard, he wouldn't care thus she wouldn't. BK would let you know if you offended him such as with a camera flash. Beyond that telling you about it nothing mean - no biting or other stuff. Not a mean bone in his body for humans - his best friends and all were no matter who - he loved people and especially liked nothing better than me carrying him about the shop in one hand.
> Poor BK was also a hunter of local renoun in catching from snakes to baby bunnies and one morning after spending the night locked in the shop got out. The car that slowed down to let me cross never saw him running out. Poor thing died in my arms = one of those situations one still cannot believe actally happened but did. Best cat I ever met. all including his sister still miss him. His ashes now live above my desk - his home in the shop, and many still visit him in missing the big orange hunter.
> Don't think there is any photos of him or either of them walking the truss but he especially loved walking out on stage while a designer was designing or across a truss being prepped for a show. This cat was a great roadie.



I have had one of those type of cats, loved being onstage, would usually try to follow me up a ladder. One day I had a wall unit flown in for a focus, got done with that piece and went to rail to take it out, had the piece about 10' off deck when I saw the cat jump off and run off stage... that cat never go on any scenery again.


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## derekleffew (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi said:


> ...4 S4's on a pipe (bolted to it) with a Gator Clamp at each end of the pipe...


By Gator clamp, do you mean what I call a "Clancy Clamp"? Can't find a picture at the moment. But it was first sold by JR Clancy and then I think sold to Rosco. Or did you mean Gator Clamp?


Capi said:


> They we had a S4 pars in *shop-built box trusses* and a few other fixtures upstage, but I'm not sure how.


NO, NO, NO! "Shop-Built" trusses are NEVER acceptable, unless that shop is JTE, Tomcat, Global, or select other professional companies having the engineering and manufacturing certifications behind them.


Capi said:


> ...In the past, transportation went like this: They had two or three *4x4 beams* with angle brackets on each end spanning the width of the truck...


Commonly called "Loadbars."


Capi said:


> ...I'm going to make sure every light is either double nutted or use lock nuts, make sure everything is saftied, and use blankets between the sets of lights and probably strap them to each other, if not also to the wall...


Good ideas always when on tour.



Capi said:


> ...BTW: My curiosity got the best of me and I Google Imaged "meat racks". Didn't really get anything that shocking....maybe if I turned the Safe Search function off... But I don't think I will.... Thanks for all the advice.


A "meatrack" is almost always a custom built item. Originally designed by R&R lighting companies to hold (8) 90" long, six-lamp PAR64 can, PARbars, in a cage with exterior dimensions approx. 4'w x 8'l x 5'h. Building such a "meatrack" for your, probably, 5' long (4) Source4 bars, would speed your load-ins, but take up more truck space--I guessing last year the S4bars were up high and allowed room underneath. Here's the second item Google returned for me, which led me to this PDF. However, they will be cost prohibitive for you. So have the same people who built the truss, build you a meatrack. Just don't let them build anything over my head.


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## soundman (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi said:


> What's an 8-way case? Maybe a link...



Something like this- granted this design does not fit into a standard truck pack plot it gets the point across. Something like this is great for positions that only need a fixture and it would be impractical to make bars for them. Like pipe ends, two fixtures way off stage. If you leave color and any gobos in them and label the yoke with position, distance from center, and channel number hang and trouble shooting will be a breeze.


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## Capi (Jan 2, 2008)

derekleffew said:


> NO, NO, NO! "Shop-Built" trusses are NEVER acceptable, unless that shop is JTE, Tomcat, Global, or select other professional companies having the engineering and manufacturing certifications behind them.




My profound apologies...these trusses don't fly at all! They sit on the ground and, I think last year, provide side light, as in shinbusters, etc. They are just basically long steel boxes (1" square tube) that sit on end with horizontals for about 8 lights (top and bottom hung) Sorry I didn't explain that one. As for the clamps, I can't find an example anywhere online. They are lighting clamps, but the bottom jaw is hinged so they weight of the load closes it. If I ever figure out the actual name, I'll let you know.

Thanks for the tip about the meatracks, but I think it is indeed a space issue in the truck.


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## SerraAva (Jan 2, 2008)

The 8 way lamp cases I use are very packer friendly. They hold 8 lekos, or 16 S4 Pars. There are also 2 slots down the one end of the case for dimmers, gel frames, safeties, bases, etc. You can stack them too. They fit two high on a 26 ft truck and 2 wide long ways. Next time I have them out, I'll snap a picture of one for you Capi. I haven't been using them much because I have been using the Houdini’s lately. They are just a huge case that also go 2 wide on a 26 ft truck, but can hold many more fixtures. Problem is no dividers, so the lights get banged up way more.


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## derekleffew (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi: Ah, no problem. Didn't mean to snap at you, just overly cautious. I call those "Sidelight Towers." Best I have seen were from Production Arts, but I think all 4 of the big NYC shops had their own version: Vanco, Four Star, Bash, and PA.

I'm pretty sure we're both talking about the same clamp, amazed that I cannot find a picture of it on the web. Aha! Found it! Buried in Rosco's site, the Sure Clamp. JR Clancy did sell it to Rosco. Great for touring, as needs no tools, but too expensive to use on every individual fixture. Many tours use this clamp to hang the Unistrut onto which fixtures are permanently attached. I've never seen it used for R&R, they use PARBar Hangers, or Swivel Cheeseboroughs.


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## Capi (Jan 2, 2008)

Yup, that's the clamp! And I understand being overly cautious...I wouldn't want any "shop-built" trusses over my head either!


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## sound_nerd (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi said:


> What's an 8-way case? Maybe a link...



I'll try and find a link.....but an 8 way case is divided into 8 sections on the inside, each able to fit a Source Four sized fixture with the clamp attached. Fits two cases wide in a truck, or four cases wide if they're spun the other way.


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## Footer (Jan 2, 2008)

Tyler said:


> There are many ways to pack lighting, it all depends on your budget and how they are hung. We've had many big productions come through our theater. Cats just did their load-in today for the week. The 1st electric truss was all prehung. The truss sections came apart and stacked on top of each other for travel. Other shows have racks of lights. For movers, unless prehung, the only way I've seen is in road cases. I wouldn't suggest any other way for those. Road cases are probably your best bet.



Meat racks for movers are starting to become pretty popular, especially for shows that are out for long periods of time. Cirque is now doing this with all of their shows, and it saves about a trucks worth of space and makes ins/outs much faster. Downside being is that each rack has to be individually made for your type of fixture, so you can not mix and match. Have fun with cats... and don't go running around with an open blade...


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## JD (Jan 2, 2008)

So nobody uses pre-hung anymore? (pic from 1983) All the lights were mounted on raceways inside the truss. For transport, the raceways lifted in. For show, the lowered down. each position locked with safeties. Plug in 4 VEAMS, and a 40 foot truss was up and running. (Not visible in shot, but yes, there are 1/8 cable safeties on each fixture) 

(End of (long) night shot, USA network "Hot Spots" show)

EDIT:
Trusses were designed to stack 3 high in truck with lights inside, wheels indented and fit into each section.


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## Capi (Jan 2, 2008)

That's pretty cool, John. I didn't even know they made such a thing, although I should have guessed it. Last year we had portable dimmer packs (Lightronics) for everything. These all went a distro which was fed off a small gas generator. Since most of the venues we tour to are smaller (churches mostly), we don't have the benefit of tying in anywhere. I'm hoping that this year we will be able to either rent or buy a dimmer rack with Socopex (Socapex?), and get a more industrial genny, since the one we had last year kind of sucked for various reasons. That way we could leave everything circuited and just run the Soco to the breakouts, instead of running individual cables to each dimmer pack from the distro. Each pack only has four circuits, so that is a decent amount of cable. Here's hoping!


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## soundman (Jan 2, 2008)

JD said:


> So nobody uses pre-hung anymore? (pic from 1983) All the lights were mounted on raceways inside the truss. For transport, the raceways lifted in. For show, the lowered down. each position locked with safeties. Plug in 4 VEAMS, and a 40 foot truss was up and running. (Not visible in shot, but yes, there are 1/8 cable safeties on each fixture)
> 
> EDIT:
> Trusses were designed to stack 3 high in truck with lights inside, wheels indented and fit into each section.



Prerig is still popular for getting 60K upstage and 60K downstage but I have seen some mover prerig to http://www.jthomaseng.com/mltruss.htm I prefer working with swing wing though, often time getting the lights to lower correctly is a pain and can require calling over 'knuckles' to hope around on them. The disadvantage to swing wing is the cables are not protect as well so when the top section is getting lowered on it can pinch cables.

Square tubing, was that back in the day of garage built truss?


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## avkid (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi said:


> get a more industrial genny, since the one we had last year kind of sucked for various reasons.


You want diesel, a Whisperwatt of some kind would be ideal.


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## Capi (Jan 2, 2008)

Well, since diesel is no longer cheaper than unleaded last time I looked, what makes diesel better? Are there industrial generators that run on unleaded gasoline? 

Just FYI- I have no purchasing power. Most of this is to satisfy my own interest.


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## JD (Jan 2, 2008)

soundman said:


> Square tubing, was that back in the day of garage built truss?



If I recall, I purchased these from the old BML lighting in NJ. They had about 40 tours out with the stuff, you could drive a truck on it! The 80's were in some ways still the stone age of lighting. I don't think any of the aforementioned trussing companies even existed yet.  Good stuff though. Had that set for about 10 years before a bad back drove me out of touring.


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## Brilliant2007 (Jan 2, 2008)

I can't stand the drop down type of pre-rig for MLs. Swing Wing is the way to go! The stuff is expensive, but worth every penny if you need quick load-ins and outs!!


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## Van (Jan 2, 2008)

I could have sworn that I posted a drawing of a meat rack on here a while back but I can't seem to find it. I'll search my archives later on. We used to use two different types of meat rack. One was for transporting conventionals, the other transported 4-bars and 6 bars. The cool thing about the meat rack for these guys was that it was laid out in such a manner as to accept any length of bar, without having to re-configure the arms. 

What was that other stuff called? Captive truss? Made by Thomas? Had wheels built in, accepted the 4-bars, then they just slid up into it. You could line up 3 in a row, scouch them together so that thier wheels caught on each other then tilt the whole thing over Viola' instant stack of three high truss, perfect fit for the back of the semi.
Loved that stuff when using it, hated prepping it.


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## derekleffew (Jan 2, 2008)

Van, I believe you're referring to PRT, Pre-Rigged Truss. Still around with 6-lamp bars of PAR64 or S4-PARs. 26"H (not including casters, 30" W, and 8' Long. Doesn't work well for theatre, as Lekos are too long to fit. I agree with the above that Swing Wing is the best, based on Morpheus Flip Box Truss. PRG's version is okay, but I don't like having the stanchions loose.


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## SteveB (Jan 2, 2008)

FWIW, my recollection of all the pre-hung, meat rack, square truss dance tower stuff was it was all invented by Production Arts, with our very own Steve Terry one of the prime designers and inventors (if not the primary creator). 

Lot's of this stuff was designed (if memory serves) specifically for the Bus and Truck Broadway show market - the production company whose name escapes me, as a major move to make the multi-day load-ins of such tours happen in 8 hrs. 

Thus you got multi-cables, 6 lamps pre-hung on a Kindorf bar with Clancy clamps, single and double width, stack-able pre-hung vertical dance lighting towers, etc... 

I seem to remember that this stuff was a bit earlier then the Thomas style, 6 lamp, pre-hung Par bar. 

Steve B.


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## avkid (Jan 2, 2008)

Capi said:


> Well, since diesel is no longer cheaper than unleaded last time I looked, what makes diesel better?


This should explain it:
http://www.generatorjoe.net/html/genfuel.html

The price of diesel will be coming down once the low sulphur infrastructure is paid off.


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## Logos (Jan 2, 2008)

Can I pick on your spell checker again Van huh Can I please.


Van said:


> ... Viola' instant stack of three high truss, perfect fit for the back of the semi.
> Loved that stuff when using it, hated prepping it.



So the musical instrument created an instant stack of three high truss. "Voila"

You know I'm being a bit picky aren't I.


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## len (Jan 2, 2008)

The answer is: it depends.

If you're doing venues with no fly system you'll be bringing your own truss, motors, rigging, etc. That means that most fixtures can't ride on the truss, unless you get pre-rig. So everything should be in its case, which means more assembly and strike times.

Cases are/should be designed to fit snugly across a 99" wide semi-trailer. They'll be either 1/4 pack (4 across), 1/3 pack (3 across) or 1/2 pack. But a box truck could be a little smaller so that could present a problem. 

If you're hanging stuff on the theater pipes, then most tours that plan for that will just get 6' pieces of unistrut and assemble all the instruments on to that, and attach all the cable, safeties, etc., to each 6' section. Then those are hung in meat racks and ride in the truck that way.

Make sure you have plenty of load straps that are rated. The typical hardware store ratchet strap isn't DOT rated, and will fail at the only time you need it not to. 

If you're renting stuff, the rental house should be able to help you with all this as well. They're just as interested as everything coming back in one piece as you are.


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## Footer (Jan 2, 2008)

Pre-rig doubled par bar truss is still out there, and it is soooo cheap to rent. I have seen it used a few times in theatre, but usually for a show that requires that look, its kinda hard to hide that stuff. Swing truss is by far the best, and fastest out there. Oh.. and heres a meat rack drawing that I had around... Now.. off to bed... have a 8am in tomorrow 2 hours away....


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## len (Jan 2, 2008)

JD said:


> So nobody uses pre-hung anymore? (pic from 1983) All the lights were mounted on raceways inside the truss. For transport, the raceways lifted in. For show, the lowered down. each position locked with safeties. Plug in 4 VEAMS, and a 40 foot truss was up and running. (Not visible in shot, but yes, there are 1/8 cable safeties on each fixture)
> (End of (long) night shot, USA network "Hot Spots" show)
> EDIT:
> Trusses were designed to stack 3 high in truck with lights inside, wheels indented and fit into each section.



Pre-rig with pars is pretty rock and roll. We usually see double hung. It's fun stacking those 20.5" box truss 4 high. 

NOTE: THE FOLLOWING IS DANGEROUS AND SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED BY AMATEURS OR ANYONE WHO IS NOT INSANE:

Easy way is to tip each truss on end so that all 4 are nesting, but vertical. Pre-rig truss usually has permanent caster wheels on it. Then get a couple hands to push them over, and a couple to catch them as they come back down. Risky, but done quite often and way easier than trying to stack 4 high.


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## soundman (Jan 2, 2008)

len said:


> Pre-rig with pars is pretty rock and roll. We usually see double hung. It's fun stacking those 20.5" box truss 4 high.



Not to nit pick but most double hung prerig is 30"X26" unless its super duty than its 30"X30"


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## derekleffew (Jan 2, 2008)

Correct soundman on the dimensions. Here's a picture of standard PRT and on the page is a PDF with all specifications. Here's Total Structures Moving Light Pre-Rig. Still not as nice as Swing Wing. Before James Thomas Engineering, in the 1970s, I believe Bob See, Bill McManus, James Moody, and ShowCo and HiLights well all building their own truss with lights that rode inside.


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## Charc (Jan 3, 2008)

derekleffew said:


> Correct soundman on the dimensions. Here's a picture of standard PRT and on the page is a PDF with all specifications. Here's Total Structures Moving Light Pre-Rig. Still not as nice as Swing Wing. Before James Thomas Engineering, in the 1970s, I believe Bob See, Bill McManus, James Moody, and ShowCo and HiLights well all building their own truss with lights that rode inside.



McManus, as in McManus the theatrical supply store (rental place too?), based outside Philly? Or is it possible there are two McManusi (Is that the plural? ) in theatre?


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## derekleffew (Jan 3, 2008)

McManus Enterprises. Bill McManus. One and the same. A pioneer of rock & roll lighting, Bill passed away 01/12/2005. For many years he lit all the HBO Boxing matches, with a PAR64 based R&R system, saving HBO time and money over 2K/5K Fresnels and other "Video Lighting." He was also one of the first to have dimmers in the truss, in the same raceway the lights hung from. This is still being improved upon in products like ET's Intelligent Raceway.


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## len (Jan 3, 2008)

soundman said:


> Not to nit pick but most double hung prerig is 30"X26" unless its super duty than its 30"X30"



True. Although I do see some people cramming double hung S4 bars into smaller sizes.


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## avkid (Jan 3, 2008)

charcoaldabs said:


> McManus, as in McManus the theatrical supply store (rental place too?), based outside Philly? Or is it possible there are two McManusi (Is that the plural? ) in theatre?


It would be McMani, duh.


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## avkid (Jan 3, 2008)

derekleffew said:


> McManus Enterprises. Bill McManus. One and the same. A pioneer of rock & roll lighting, Bill passed away 01/12/2005.


Didn't they recently liquidate by auction?
Uh oh, Derek has invaded http://www.roadie.net
To the shelter!


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## SerraAva (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, Bill's wife sold everything, and I mean everything. She didn't want to try and run the business any more. That was about two years ago now when she sold it all. I can remember going there and some of the crazy, interesting toys he had in that warehouse.


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## Charc (Jan 3, 2008)

Most of our gear came from McManus. The version of events I was told was that the 1KL6s were being tossed, or were going DIRT cheap (I believe this was some time before his death), and we picked up all that we could.

Jason filled the theatrical supply void by opening PTS (Philadelphia Theatrical Supply), a couple blocks north of The Gallery (Market East Station, etc.).


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## SerraAva (Jan 3, 2008)

Starlite in Cherry Hill also picked up quite a bit. Their warehouse is about double what it was before McManus closed. They also just picked up a ton of Vari-Lights and some more consoles like another Grand MA and a Road Hog I believe.


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