# Foot Lights?????



## gmff (Nov 15, 2011)

Oh what to do! We are working on the performance venue of an 1880's opera house. The footlights were updated somewhere in the mid 50/60's, the Department of Historic Resourses has been very restrictive about what we can and can not do. 2 weeks ago a kid fell into the footlights pit (no bulbs so he was ok). Now we need to do something about them. I want to restore the lights to make them work, put in some small led or florecent bulbs to please the history people, than cover them with heavy duty plexi that is walkable. Has any else had experiance with dealing with this problem.


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## MPowers (Nov 15, 2011)

This sounds like a restoration job, i.e. on a commercial level. PM me if you want to start a formal connection on this project.


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## Van (Nov 15, 2011)

Foot light pits ? Typically footlights are at the level of the stage. they are only below the deck when they are not being used or are being stored. Have you got a picture ?


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## avkid (Nov 15, 2011)

Yeah, pictures would be helpful.
Might be able to send someone over from one of the MA shops I work with.


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## gmff (Nov 15, 2011)

The word I should have used instead of pit is trough. The apron is a half round and the trough goes most of the way around the half circle.


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## derekleffew (Nov 15, 2011)

gmff said:


> ...I want to restore the lights to make them work, put in some small led or florecent bulbs to please the history people, than cover them with heavy duty plexi that is walkable. ...


Will this meet the approval of "the Department of Historic Resourses"? It doesn't sound very historical to me. Will the light sources be dimmable and controlled from the stage lighting console?

derekleffew said:


> ... A show here in Vegas had ACL s and striplight s under the deck. The ACL holes were 8" diameter single-layer 1/2" or 5/8" [Lexan], and the slots were 12" x 8' lengths, 1/2" or 5/8" double thickness. The show had a horse, elephant, assorted tigers and lions, and even dancers. ...


My college theatre, built in 1969 but boasting features of the most modern 1920's venue, had a footlight trough with removable covers, similar to very shallow traps. R40 strips lived in there. The stage also had a deeper and wider cyc trough, again with R40 striplights. The trap lids were steel framed, filled with a total of 2" of pine, and ridiculously heavy.


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## Les (Nov 15, 2011)

Footlights being that old will be full of asbestos wiring, so they'll need to be completely dealt with either way (rewire). It seems that Altman has discontinued their line of "disappearing footlights", which would have been an excellent solution. It basically rotates under the stage (strong, finished wood cover on the back side) when not in use. Perhaps there is some other product that is similar, though it will most likely be a special order. You could also do a temporary groundrow of modern R40 striplights (which double as footlights), which may fit in to the trough with some modification. I'm just addressing replacing the current strips at this point, because they do need to be replaced or rewired given their current age. As for the safety aspect, it is possible that you could be permitted to do away with the trough and add the R40's and some decorative scalloped masking (sometimes called "dental") on a temporary basis. Heck, the masking could be a permanent feature and at least a physical (albeit small) barrier at the lip of the stage. 

My theory is that the fact that the kid fell in to the trough is bad, but not as bad as it could have been. Had the trough not been there, he would have probably fallen off the stage, which would have been worse. Stages are just dangerous and people need to watch what they're doing. The simplest thing I can think of in lieu of all the suggestions above would be to route out a groove just in front of the footlight trough and recess a line of ropelights. I've seen this done on a lot of high school stages, and at the very least it says "Hey, something changes beyond this point! Notice me!"


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## jglodeklights (Nov 16, 2011)

I believe I know what you are talking about. There is a trough with a metal "reflector" running around the stage, with light being provided by E26 or E27 bases mounted in a way that makes the bulbs horizontal? 

I don't like plexi. It will be somewhat easy to cut to shape, but will wear relatively quickly due to scratching and even possibly warping. The theater I worked at this past summer had 3 options for covering the MR16 strip light Foot Light trough: 1/2" ply, plexi and extruded steel grid. Most of the time the extruded steel grid was in place. If foot lights were desired, easy enough to make sure they were patched, but no one was going through and output from the fixtures remained high rather than being diffused EVERYWHERE.


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## Les (Nov 16, 2011)

jglodeklights said:


> Most of the time the extruded steel grid was in place. If foot lights were desired, easy enough to make sure they were patched, but no one was going through and output from the fixtures remained high rather than being diffused EVERYWHERE.



The grid is a good idea. I'd prefer it to the plywood for two reasons:

1) The plywood may blend in too much and not make enough of a "do not walk here" statement.
2) If the lights are inadvertently left on while covered, this would be a substantial fire hazard.


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## museav (Nov 16, 2011)

gmff said:


> Now we need to do something about them. I want to restore the lights to make them work, put in some small led or florecent bulbs to please the history people, than cover them with heavy duty plexi that is walkable.


At least in my experience changing the fixtures and lamps and covering the 'trough' with plexi may not 'please the history people'. I've been involved in several historical preservation/restoration projects that included aspects of undoing earlier changes and modifications. Unless they consider the changes made in the 1950's/60's to be historic elements then what you may want to do is focus on figuring out something that better reflects (no pun intended) the original footlights. That will likely mean doing some research with which the historical preservation folks may be glad to help. If they see that you are trying to work with them rather than against them they may be much more willing to work with you.

Just a guess, but if the trough is original then I would not be surprised if it had reflectors that would have made it less of a safety concern.


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## shiben (Nov 18, 2011)

gmff said:


> Oh what to do! We are working on the performance venue of an 1880's opera house. The footlights were updated somewhere in the mid 50/60's, the Department of Historic Resourses has been very restrictive about what we can and can not do. 2 weeks ago a kid fell into the footlights pit (no bulbs so he was ok). Now we need to do something about them. I want to restore the lights to make them work, put in some small led or florecent bulbs to please the history people, than cover them with heavy duty plexi that is walkable. Has any else had experiance with dealing with this problem.


 

I like the idea of putting a rope light in there as a warning line... You can also put some LEDs or something on there as well, every 10 feet or so to make them less visible to the audience. In my old school's historical renovation (1880s theater structure as well, less large) we had to deal with the footlights, and we had our EC put a Green LED at CL, and Blue LEDs every 5 feet or so along the stage edge, all wired into the safety light circuits, so always on and hooked up to the backup genny, so that should the power die people caught on stage would have a clear delineation of the edge. Never had a problem after that, this seems to me to be a place for the good ole "dont fall off " lessons, similar how rigging tends to require you to learn not to drop things, if your on the stage you need to recognize it and not fall off things. I like the idea of marker lights, but having a hard surface will just be a problem later and then someone is off the stage edge, potentially into a pit or front row, and thats even worse. Perhaps the floor can be textured a foot or so from the edge? Ours switched to some form of metal about that far as part of the original trough, so thats how we did it. As for the history people being a PITA, just work with them. Often you can accommodate their wishes and make your space better, it just takes some time and effort. At least you dont need to put a FoH lighting position into a solid ceiling of your historic venue. That gets interesting.


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## museav (Nov 18, 2011)

shiben said:


> As for the history people being a PITA, just work with them. Often you can accommodate their wishes and make your space better, it just takes some time and effort. At least you dont need to put a FoH lighting position into a solid ceiling of your historic venue. That gets interesting.


This is where it may be important to understand that to those people, as well as to Architects and Interior Designers, terms like preservation, restoration, renovation and adaptive reuse are describing distinctly different things. Knowing which you are actually dealing with can really help in understanding what may be possible or accepted.

An Architect that specializes in historic projects once explained to me that they saw three ways to try to address new technology in historic spaces. The first was to try to make it look like it had always been there, which can work well but people know that some things weren't part of the original space and so if it not done extremely well that tends to become very apparent. The second option is to try to hide anything that is not original, which can work well but often requires solutions that may conflict with other goals. The final option is to face that it is being added and simply let that fact be obvious. I've seen all three approaches successfully, and unsuccessfully, applied but this is another aspect where it may help you to know the perspective of the people with whom you are dealing.


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