# Rope Work Within the Theatre



## PrescottJr (Aug 22, 2011)

What knots do you use in the theatre? Rope work in the theatre is something I don't hear much about. What do you use when tying knots, what kinds of rope, and in what application?


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## chausman (Aug 22, 2011)

And to add to. That, where do/did you learn how to tie said knots?


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## ScottT (Aug 22, 2011)

Just a few:
Bowline
French Bowline
Running Bowline
Toggle Hitch
Square Knot
Carrick Bend
Sheet Bend
Blackwall
Cat's Paw
Mooring Hitch
Clove Hitch
Two Half Hitches
Timber Hitch
Figure Eight Knot


Check the wiki, there should be an article on this.


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## Footer (Aug 22, 2011)

If you can tie a bowline, your shoes, and a cloves hitch 99 percent of the knots you will use on deck are taken care of. 

...... Something involving tapatalk.......


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## rochem (Aug 22, 2011)

I'm sure others will have many more application than I, but I end up using ropes in theatre quite a bit. I end up hauling cable/rigging hardware up to the grid with ropes quite often. It seems like we end up needing to build new lighting positions fairly often, so I'm using rope to tie off a boom to the grid, or to haul up a chain hoist, or to deadhang a pipe, or even to build a simple hemp set/spot line for scenery or lighting positions that need to travel. It's also a godsend for hanging FOH positions, or anything in a black box type theatre. I just hung a show not too long ago with 5 Mac 2000s in a FOH catwalk. Rather than comically try to get 5 roadcases up to a tiny cove and hold the lights out over a ~60' drop, we just rigged a sheave to the pipe and dropped a line from the cove, and hoisted them up one at a time. I've never done it personally, but I believe venues without a loading bridge sometimes use a line with a block and fall to haul out overweight linesets before reweighting. I've had shows where we left lines tied to the offstage ends of a batten to breast it around scenery when it needed to come in for maintenance. 

In most of these hauling situations, the bowline is my go-to knot. It makes a loop that you can use, it's easy to undo no matter how much weight you put on it, and it's easy to show someone. A figure eight is a very important knot when using a sheave or a block - it just creates a wider part of the rope so it won't accidentally run back through the sheave and fall. A toggle (that's what we call it, but I don't know if that's standard - anyone else?) is also useful - its really just bending the rope in half and passing the two ends through the loop. It's useful for hanging drops from grommets, supporting a cable run along a wall, or lots of other scattered places. When tying tie-line, I use kind of a modified clove hitch with a half hitch stopper - just a normal half hitch, except with the line run around the batten twice, but usually not passed under the loop like with a clove hitch unless the head electrician specifically wants it. It helps keep the weight of the cable from loosening your knot, and it doesn't tighten the knot as much so it's easier to untie at strike. This is pretty standard for tie-line, but I don't actually know if the knot has a name. Those are what I use most often, but every stagehand should know those and a few more as well. You never know when you'll get a call into a hemp house and need to tie a belay knot, a prussic knot, a trucker's hitch, and a sunday all in a few minutes.

I learned to tie most of these more basic knots on the job, from more experienced guys. I've found that virtually every stagehand loves to teach knots and compare ridiculous names and different methods they all have for the same knots. I learned things like the trucker's hitch and the sunday at school in a Basic Theatre Technology class. Short of that, most theatre books (Backstage Handbook, Gillette, Parker & Wolf, Ashley Book of Knots) will all have a pretty good knots section - particularly the Ashley book. Beyond that, there a hundreds of websites that give you videos and illustrations of how to tie any conceivable knot.


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## PrescottJr (Aug 22, 2011)

Thanks for the awesome reply! Have you ever heard of a Klienhiest Knot? it might suit some Prusik applications better, cause it is designed with downward or upward force in mind? And which type Bowline do you use, Portuguese, Double, Eskimo, or standard?


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## PrescottJr (Aug 22, 2011)

Add to that:
Double Bowline
Truckers Hitch
Taught Line Hitch


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## PrescottJr (Aug 22, 2011)

The Complete Guide to Knots and Knot Tying is a great book and you can find it on the internet in pdf


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## GBtimex (Aug 22, 2011)

O how I love me some knots.

Almost all the ones that I require my crew to know have been said:

Bowline 
Clove hitch
two Half Hitches
Truckers Hitch (The figure 8 version not the over hand knot version)
Square knot 
Double Sheet bend
Larks head (a basic coke for the rigging folks) 
And the Rolling hitch for sundays on the fly rail.


The ones I recommend for theatre work and I use often (but dont require) are:

The pole hitch (really handy for wood and poles DUH)
The Highway man hitch (Great for strapping things to your belt or when it needs to be removed quick) 
The figure 8 (by itself almost useless but it can be made into a loop stronger than a bowline, a bend better than Fisherman's knot, ties off pin rails and makes the truckers hitch many times stronger and easier to use) 
The monkey's fist (no theatre is complete without one and it can be used to throw rope a distance) 
A mariners coil 


There are TONS of good books on knot tying but the key is to figure out what are you are going to be doing with them. There is one knot which I have never used before but always wanted to called the icicle hitch and its used for hanging something off of a smooth pole. 

Icicle Hitch (Loop Method) | How to tie the Icicle Hitch | Climbing Knots


Best of luck to ya and keep tying knots!

GBTimex,


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## derekleffew (Aug 22, 2011)

rochem said:


> ...A toggle (that's what we call it, but I don't know if that's standard - anyone else?) is also useful - its really just bending the rope in half and passing the two ends through the loop. It's useful for hanging drops from grommets, supporting a cable run along a wall, or lots of other scattered places. ...


Larks head, although also called a choke. A toggle is an internal framing member or type of switch.
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Animated Knots by Grog. (No relation to CB member Grog12.)


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## Robert (Aug 22, 2011)

PrescottJr said:


> What knots do you use in the theatre? Rope work in the theatre is something I don't hear much about. What do you use when tying knots, what kinds of rope, and in what application?


 
Two knots will do most of the work you come across in Theatre. A clove hitch and a bowline. The hitch will tie things off and the bowline will do the lifting. I guess an overhand knot (like you tie your shoes) is also important for tieing up drapes and the such.

I learned all of my knots in Scouting. Being able to tie knots got me my first job at an outdoor ampitheatre. Just goes to show you never know what skill you will need to get that first job.

Most places I used the rope on hand. Poly-pro or plastic rope does not hold knots well, so avoid those. Sisal and multi ropes are very common in theatre. It is important to learn how to tell rope is getting old.


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## DuckJordan (Aug 23, 2011)

So is it Bowline or bowlin, Ive heard both, and my professor who teaches a basic rigging course calls it bowlin.


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## ScottT (Aug 23, 2011)

DuckJordan said:


> So is it Bowline or bowlin, Ive heard both, and my professor who teaches a basic rigging course calls it bowlin.


 
Bowline. Check your copy of the Backstage Handbook. But who knows, it might be a regional thing


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## rochem (Aug 23, 2011)

DuckJordan said:


> So is it Bowline or bowlin, Ive heard both, and my professor who teaches a basic rigging course calls it bowlin.


 
Always spelled bowline. But more often than not, I hear it pronounced as "bowe-linn", but the spelling is still the same. Might be a regional thing.


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## shiben (Aug 23, 2011)

rochem said:


> In most of these hauling situations, the bowline is my go-to knot. It makes a loop that you can use, it's easy to undo no matter how much weight you put on it, and it's easy to show someone. A figure eight is a very important knot when using a sheave or a block - it just creates a wider part of the rope so it won't accidentally run back through the sheave and fall. A toggle (that's what we call it, but I don't know if that's standard - anyone else?) is also useful - its really just bending the rope in half and passing the two ends through the loop. It's useful for hanging drops from grommets, supporting a cable run along a wall, or lots of other scattered places. When tying tie-line, I use kind of a modified clove hitch with a half hitch stopper - just a normal half hitch, except with the line run around the batten twice, but usually not passed under the loop like with a clove hitch unless the head electrician specifically wants it. It helps keep the weight of the cable from loosening your knot, and it doesn't tighten the knot as much so it's easier to untie at strike. This is pretty standard for tie-line, but I don't actually know if the knot has a name. Those are what I use most often, but every stagehand should know those and a few more as well. You never know when you'll get a call into a hemp house and need to tie a belay knot, a prussic knot, a trucker's hitch, and a sunday all in a few minutes.


 
The bowline has a lot of good things about it... If you are in a situation where you need to clear the rope, a bowline unties without any knot left in the rope (whereas a figure 8 leaves a knot, potentially fouling the block if your forget to untie it, so that really depends on what the application is...). Also its possible to tie one using only one hand, making it useful if you need to put it on while holding something. One last thing, figure 8s weld into the rope, while bowlines will not. I also end up using the sheet bend a lot. Its used to attach two lines of different sizes together. It will also hold slick lines where a square knot might not (useful for water skiing and poly-pro ropes). I end up using a taught line hitch a lot for towing speakers. I just bow tie line to hold cables to pipe if I am forced to not use e-tape for that... 

To whoever argued that figure 8s are not terribly useful, I disagree. You can quickly put a bite on the rope that wont come undone, and its useful for climbing. 

I dont remember what the knot for tying off to a cleat is called, but its useful to know that, as a ton of things can be treated as cleats (and they get installed a lot to hold various things flying in not on battens). Its easy to tie, and can hold a 100' yacht, so it ought to work for most things if using properly sized rope and cleat. 

+1 or 5 or whatever on variations of the trucker hitch. That Icicle hitch looks awesome. If I recall correctly from my wilderness camping days, simply wrapping a rope 5 times around something is considered a knot of some sort. Not acceptable in theater, I would imagine, but if you need to hold a tarp up because its raining and you want fire and your hands are frozen to the shape of a paddle grip (yay hypothermia?)


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## MarshallPope (Aug 23, 2011)

rochem said:


> Always spelled bowline. But more often than not, I hear it pronounced as "bowe-linn", but the spelling is still the same. Might be a regional thing.


 
We use the -linn pronunciation down here as well, for what it's worth.


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## tjrobb (Aug 23, 2011)

I heard "bowline" came from its use in archery. Anyone know about this?


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## erosing (Aug 23, 2011)

This is a great topic, and a very important one.

I dug out some old things from college and part of the stagecraft final exam consisted of knowing the following knots.

> Overhand Knot
> Figure Eight Knot
> Bowline
> Square Knot
> ...



However, the knots I actually use on a regular basis consist of the following.


> Figure Eight
> Figure Eight Loop
> Larks Head ( also known as - Cow Hitch, Girth Hitch, choke, Cobra's Hood/Hitch)
> Bowline
> ...



And these are the knots that I use occasionally.

> Overhand
> Double Overhand Stopper Knot
> Square Knot
> Sheet Bend
> ...



I've only used an _actual_ Truckers Hitch a dozen times, usually we roll with a slightly modified approach. 

[rant]
Knots are very, very important though; nothing irks me more than when I see a college kid that can't tie a half hitch, or a clove hitch (which saddens me greatly because I, usually, know a few of the professors that taught these students). It also bothers me when someone (a professional, in this example) stands there fumbling with the line trying to tie a bowline. A professional should know how to tie knots that are relevant to them, as should students. But more importantly, they should both know just to ask a question or say they don't know how (particularly students and young professionals). I've certainly not been able to recall a knot or two, it's simple, just ask, no one's going to laugh. Once I was even asked to tie a different knot because that's what the house used. 

My big secret is that I don't like working with people who can't tie (at least) simple knots and don't bother to ask how or say so. Instead they either sit there fumbling, or tie something completely different, usually a mess of overhand knots. That is not acceptable, so, if you don't know how to tie it (or how they want it), ask! 
[/rant]

Now, the other big topic here is splicing, I have a book or two on it, but never could get into it. I've also never really had the urge to because I've only seen it done a few times, at least two of those times it was not necessary, but still nice. The other part of this is that the only time I've seen it done is by [-]old guys[/-] those that have a significant amount of experience in the old ways. How many of you are still splicing on a regular basis?


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## sk8rsdad (Aug 23, 2011)

In the theatre I use these regularly:
constrictor
prusik
klemheist
reef (square)
alpine butterfly
sheet bend

In Scouts, add these (including slip variants where applicable):
bowline (also left-handed, one-handed, and bowline on a bight variant)
double figure eight
truckers hitch
double fishermans
turks head
taut line hitch


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## Toffee (Aug 25, 2011)

A bowline, overhand knot, a bow, Prusik, half hitch and a clove hitch are really what I use on a day to day basis. I learned almost all of them in Scounts or working in the theatre at my old college.


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## derekleffew (Aug 27, 2011)

See also the thread http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...ears-pick-lines-grid-who-has-good-design.html .
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As for type of rope, while traditionally manila has been used, there are many synthetics available today with none/few of the old problems. Stage-Set X is popular, as is Multiline II. If black rope is desirable, there's ShowBraid, among others.
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If my hands know how to tie a shoelace knot, clove hitch, and bowline, I'm happy.
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tjrobb said:


> I heard "bowline" came from its use in archery. Anyone know about this?


Not according to that most authoritative of sources, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowline :

> The bowline knot is thought to have been first mentioned in John Smith's 1627 work _A Seaman's Grammar_ under the name *Boling knot*. Smith considered the knot to be strong and secure, saying, "The _Boling knot_ is also so firmly made and fastened by the bridles into the cringles of the sails, they will break, or the sail split before it will slip."[6][7]
> Another possible finding was discovered on the rigging of the Ancient Egyptian Pharaoh Khufu's solar ship during an excavation, although this has not been proven in fact to be the bowline.[8]


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## mstaylor (Aug 27, 2011)

I use the bowline, clove hitch, half hitches, tautline hitch, lark's head and what we call a theatre knot. That is really just a modified shoetie that allows you to hide the pipe you are tying drapes to. Some call it an opera knot, just depends where you learned it. I occasionally use a square knot and a sheetbend. I know many more but I just don't use them much. I learned most of my knot tying from other riggers however I have been a merit badge counseler for years for scouts.


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## Aerial (Aug 27, 2011)

GBtimex said:


> O how I love me some knots.
> 
> 
> There are TONS of good books on knot tying but the key is to figure out what are you are going to be doing with them. There is one knot which I have never used before but always wanted to called the icicle hitch and its used for hanging something off of a smooth pole.
> ...



Thank you for that link, I've never been able to get that one to work correctly. I also never had a need for the knot, but it is awesome.

As I say "Yes there _IS _a knot for everything"

I learned 'em all in the Boy Scouts, the ones I use often are:
Clove hitch
2 Half Hitches
Taughtline
Bowline
Alpine Butterfly (my favorite knot of all)
Square Lashing
Daisy Chain (at least I'd consider it one)

It definitely shouldn't be used as common practice, but knowing how to tie my own harness has proved useful in the past.


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## GBtimex (Aug 27, 2011)

It definitely shouldn't be used as common practice, but knowing how to tie my own harness has proved useful in the past.[/QUOTE]


I was once shown how to make the swiss seat. Is that the harness knot you are talking about?


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## MPowers (Aug 27, 2011)

I know a lot of knots but the ones I use most are:
Bowline
Prussic
Clove Hitch
Overhand
Timber hitch
I use a lot of other knots as the situation requires, but those are the day-in/day-out knots.


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## MarshallPope (Aug 27, 2011)

I would say that my most commonly-used knots in theatre are the clove hitch, bowline, and shoe bow. Just today, while at a community theatre workday, I used (and taught) bowlines, clove hitches, square knots, and sheet bends.


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## What Rigger? (Aug 29, 2011)

This is all good stuff gang (from a guy who uses more rope in a day than I'd like to admit).

Couple things:
Remember that a knot always takes away some degree of strength in your rope. 

For example, a Figure 8 on a bight (not "bite") results in about 20% efficiency loss. In other words, if your rope had a safe working load of 100 lbs. before tying the knot, it has an 80 lbs. safe working load after tying the knot.
A bowline will reduce your efficiency by _*27% to 33%!!!*_.

(My source for these numbers is Skala/Ropeworks, who have trained me in rope access. Just thought I should say.) So knowing knots is half the equation, knowing the application of knots is the other.

My other favorite thing lately is seizings as well. I hate frayed, nasty, shredded ends on ropes. Eeeeesh.


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## Chris15 (Aug 30, 2011)

What Rigger? said:


> My other favorite thing lately is seizings as well. I hate frayed, nasty, shredded ends on ropes. Eeeeesh.


 
Is that what I would know as whipping the end of the rope?


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## mstaylor (Aug 30, 2011)

What Rigger? said:


> This is all good stuff gang (from a guy who uses more rope in a day than I'd like to admit).
> 
> Couple things:
> Remember that a knot always takes away some degree of strength in your rope.
> ...


In a related subject, remember that knotting anything has the same deratig situation. So do not tie any rigging element such as span sets. I do a lot of touring acts so I use rachet straps on a daily basis. I have no idea why anyone would tie a knot in a rachet but I see it all the time.


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## Dionysus (Aug 31, 2011)

Awwe too bad I am late into the discussion (things have been crazy with this tornado!).

I made a collaborative Wiki article on this AGES ago(here), and also made wiki entries for many of the most common knots. Never finished them all.

I agree that the primary knots you need to know are the:
Bowline
Clove Hitch (properly cinched of course)
Bow (shoelace)
butterfly
Sheet Bend (or Double)
Prusick 

With these (and knowledge on how to use a cleat, etc) you can do just about anything that requires a rope.

I loves me some rope


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## What Rigger? (Sep 1, 2011)

Chris15 said:


> Is that what I would know as whipping the end of the rope?


 
Yes, sir. You caught me getting sloppy on my terminology.


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## Vandrig (Sep 2, 2011)

So many knots! 
Keeping in mind that most of us work in theatre there's also the side of rope or rigging as scenery.
I've used Cat's Paw, Monkey's Fist, Traditional Noose, Cartoonishly Large Cleat Hitch, Circus Knot and some other (probably named, but I don't know them) knots such as a traditional kimono sash knot in shows for the visual effect.
I learned the basics of knots from sailing.


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## HLlovesPyroLX (Jul 28, 2014)

Hey all, was wondering what your preferred knot is for trying off a boom to the grid


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## Footer (Jul 28, 2014)

HLlovesPyroLX said:


> Hey all, was wondering what your preferred knot is for trying off a boom to the grid


Whichever side is easier... Bowline on one side, truckers hitch on the other.


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