# Looking to replace stage floor.



## echellis

I have read most of the posts regarding this issue, but I am looking for people professional opinion on what to do. We have an 11 year old stage floor, either pine or spruce, that needs replacing. Gafe tape pulls up pieces of the floor and it's just plain failing. We paint the floor black, so we aren't opposed to putting down a different product like MDF or plywood. 

What we I would like to know is what are people using in there theater for flooring? We do 1 musical a year and just about everything else we have come in are dance studios. 

We were thinking of putting down an MDF floor and buying a marley dance floor for the dance studios.


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## Footer

MDF or Masonite is the standard, masonite being more common. There are a number of good threads on laying a maso floor, take a read at them. Marley for the dance for the studios is a must. There is also plenty of info on that round here. Any reason you are not wanting to sand/seal your current floor? It can help with the pulling up of pieces.


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## echellis

Footer said:


> MDF or Masonite is the standard, masonite being more common. There are a number of good threads on laying a maso floor, take a read at them. Marley for the dance for the studios is a must. There is also plenty of info on that round here. Any reason you are not wanting to sand/seal your current floor? It can help with the pulling up of pieces.


 
We did this 5 years ago. When the floor was first installed it was never sanded, just painted over. So we have had problems from the start with it. All the tungs on the boards are splitting up.


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## ruinexplorer

I know that I seem to be in the minority on CB, but I prefer tongue and groove hardwoods over hardboard (which I would disagree as being the "standard"). I also prefer staining to painting the floor (which of course works better with wood than hardboard). I'm surprised that they had used such a softwood for your floor in the first place. Hardboard would probably be much cheaper for you to replace your floor with since you could likely lay it directly over the current stage floor (exceptions for entryways or other surfaces where the added height might impede due to height difference).


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## soundmsam

We just got our stage floor replaced last summer. It was a plywood stage floor that began rotting after 30 years. Our new floor consists of a lot of hard work and material. It starts off with 1 layer of plywood, then we had hard foam cubes put in with 2 layers of plywood and a layer of masonite on top. We love the sprung floor that is created with the foam cubes. We mainly do dance shows in our space, and already our dancers love the feel of the floor. Depending on what your budget is, this could be a good option if you do mainly dance shows.

Any questions about it feel free to PM me.


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## SteveB

We replaced our 50+ yr. old original T&G floor 3 years ago with the same, Oak 3/4 T&G over plywood.

In our case we filled in a trapped floor section as well, then used the original 2x4 sleepers embedded in the concrete subfloor, adding 1/4 rubber padding, then 2 layers of 3/4 ply, then the 3/4 oak T&G. It raised the floor by about an inch and we had to add aluminum ramps at 3 doors and the loading door, as well as re-set all limits on the pit elevator. 

This is a road house and we do a lot of dance, thus wanted a bit of bounce. We added an extra layer of 3/4 ply to handle the 2000lbs JLG self-powered lift as well as other heavy gear that comes in (Cats on tour scissors lift, as example) that would have exceeded the capacity of a floor with a single layer of 3/4 ply.

We do not paint the floor and have very rigid requirements as to layers of plastic and canvas drop cloths, etc... for when the Dept. of Theater starts using the space twice per year for 3 years starting in Oct.


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## born2run

I'm not sure if I am repeating myself, but here it goes.

I am trying to design a stage flr for a new HS auditorium. Right now, I have 1/4" MDF, primed and painted matte black, on 2 layers - 3/4" OSB on 2 x 4 wood sleepers on neoprene rubber pads.

Any suggestions?


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## Van

born2run said:


> I'm not sure if I am repeating myself, but here it goes.
> 
> I am trying to design a stage flr for a new HS auditorium. Right now, I have 1/4" MDF, primed and painted matte black, on 2 layers - 3/4" OSB on 2 x 4 wood sleepers on neoprene rubber pads.
> 
> Any suggestions?


 
Thing to dbl chk / look at:
What are the sleepers centered on ? Do you have them running at a 45 to the centerline or parallel? < they should be at a 45> Are you using a T&G OSB ? What is the reasoning behind 2 layers of topping material but only one underlayment? Doest the Neoprene act as a vapor barrier ? 

A standard floor floor install for me would be to lay a "tar paper" underlayment then lay your sleepers in at a 45 degee angle 16"OC minimum. one layer t&g OSB, 1 layer paper, one layer 3/4ply at 90 degrees to osb layout, then top layer of 1/4" MDF.


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## born2run

Van said:


> Thing to dbl chk / look at:
> What are the sleepers centered on ? Do you have them running at a 45 to the centerline or parallel? < they should be at a 45> Are you using a T&G OSB ? What is the reasoning behind 2 layers of topping material but only one underlayment? Doest the Neoprene act as a vapor barrier ?
> 
> A standard floor floor install for me would be to lay a "tar paper" underlayment then lay your sleepers in at a 45 degee angle 16"OC minimum. one layer t&g OSB, 1 layer paper, one layer 3/4ply at 90 degrees to osb layout, then top layer of 1/4" MDF.


 
"Van,
Was originally going to run parallel to stage centerline, will turn on 45 @ 16 OC per your suggestion. The neoprene pads are approx. 3" x 3" and act as a shock absorber that is commonly used for dance/gym floors. We will have a 6 mil polyethylene VP.

How thick should the T&G OSB be? Cost is an issue for us. If I can eliminate 1 layer of 3/4" plywood/OSB, that would be great. Please let me know as soon as you can.

I'm kind of new at this. Thanks for the help."


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## Van

Most sprung floors I've seen have been 2 layers of 3/4 ply laid at right angles to each other then the top layer of Masonite or MDF over the top of that. You might be able to get away with a 3/4" T&G OSB then a 1/2" sanded shop grade ply ontop of that , but the OSB gives you a general "tie together" of the floor, the Plywood gives you bursting strength. OSB has a much lower PSI bursting rating than Ply does. Having a "solid" underlayment beneath the ply drives the rating up even more. Perhaps someone else can weigh in, but without my engineers book in front of me I can't give you exact numbers.


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## Footer

Van said:


> Most sprung floors I've seen have been 2 layers of 3/4 ply laid at right angles to each other then the top layer of Masonite or MDF over the top of that. You might be able to get away with a 3/4" T&G OSB then a 1/2" sanded shop grade ply ontop of that , but the OSB gives you a general "tie together" of the floor, the Plywood gives you bursting strength. OSB has a much lower PSI bursting rating than Ply does. Having a "solid" underlayment beneath the ply drives the rating up even more. Perhaps someone else can weigh in, but without my engineers book in front of me I can't give you exact numbers.


 
Added to that OSB by itself does not take screwing/drilling/etc as well as the ply. OSB is fine for the lower layer, but it tends to get kicked up a bit if its on an upper layer what is really taking the abuse. Go ply on top, your going to need it.


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## JVV

I am also looking into replacing the hardwood floor in our theater which is full of splintered sections and just years of abuse. For those of you that have done this, did you use a local contractor or was there a specific theatrical flooring company you brought in? I do not need a sprung floor, but I would like a Masonite surface which I can paint and replace every few years. It would be great to use a company that gets why I need the sheets to have the seem run along Plaster Line and down Center. I'd also like a company that can create some Pit Plugs that are easily removable by a student crew. Any one with a Central NJ contact?


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## shiben

ruinexplorer said:


> I know that I seem to be in the minority on CB, but I prefer tongue and groove hardwoods over hardboard


 
It looks a lot nicer and sounds a lot nicer for an orchestra, but holy crap do you notice it when you screw into it. Also, "fixing up" from one show to another is re-painting the floor with another coat of black paint on maso, on hardwood its a major project for the theater to make the deck look nice again. If your doing dance and music mostly, go hardwood. If your doing theater or have a lot of scenic pieces, go maso. Thats my view on it.


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## Footer

JVV said:


> I am also looking into replacing the hardwood floor in our theater which is full of splintered sections and just years of abuse. For those of you that have done this, did you use a local contractor or was there a specific theatrical flooring company you brought in? I do not need a sprung floor, but I would like a Masonite surface which I can paint and replace every few years. It would be great to use a company that gets why I need the sheets to have the seem run along Plaster Line and down Center. I'd also like a company that can create some Pit Plugs that are easily removable by a student crew. Any one with a Central NJ contact?


 
Any good contractor should be able to handle this without issue. Most of the time people are just covering hard wood with maso and they do it with their own crew. That is the way most theatres I have worked at did it. What is your current floor? Are you looking to build up above it before you cover in maso? Is your current floor level without pits?


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## Blacksheep0317

I am lucky enough to have two of my venues (one a high school stage from 49' and the other a music venue dating back to 17') that have 4" softwood T&G decking with a 2" T&G oak under deck. We have to sand and seal the top layer every two years, but its awesome that the floor is self healing floor. Also, the soft wood has no signs of rot, holds well to temp change (big deal in buffalo), and has a natural bounce to it already. Great stuff..sad that they dont use it anymore really.


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## NHStech

We were going to replace our floor about five years ago - we were in the same situation with the pine. Instead, they went the cheap route and used wood filler and then painted with a black flat latex. 
I have thought about taking a suggestion in a different post some time ago and putting down masonite over the pine. The problem is that our stage floor is actually a combination of hardwood and softwood. From the stage edge to about 6' in is hardwood - much like a gym floor. From there to the back of the stage it is pine. 
Van, you mentioned you do installs. I am a little far away from you, but on a stage with a proscenium 40' wide (figure another 15' per side for wings) and about 30' deep, how much would something like the install you would do run? Also, is the install you mentioned something for primarily dance, or for multi-purpose use, like a high school auditorium


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