# Load rated carabiners



## LavaASU (Feb 20, 2012)

I'm wondering if there are any sort of load-rated auto-locking biners that are intended for overhead lifting/rigging? A google search hasn't yielded anything useful. I'd prefer the kind with a dual or triple lock to eliminate the possibility of it inadvertently getting opened. I'm looking for something with a SWL of 400# or greater. No, this is not for flying people. It's to replace shackles in a couple of specific instances where shackles and the loose pin are a royal PITA.

That said, what's the consensus on using climbing gear for rigging (assuming at least a 5:1 safety factor is employed)? I know PERSONALLY I'm perfectly happy to have stuff hanging over my head on properly used/loaded climbing hardware.


----------



## avkid (Feb 20, 2012)

Have you tried mousing the shackles?


----------



## LavaASU (Feb 20, 2012)

The trouble isn't the pin coming loose the trouble is installing a shackle while in an awkward position. A couple of venues I work in involve dead hangs. I can easily install a climbing carabiner with one hand, a shackle, not so much. I could reasonably easily throw a climbing biner (or even just a standard non-locking as there would still be ropes on the truss/pipe/whatever at this point) on there temporarily to hold everything while I place a shackle I suppose then remove the biner (and I would in any sort of situation where it didn't meet a 10:1 safety factor once fully loaded). But that's an extra step to fool with while in the air.

So I guess the question is really is climbing gear OK for rigging. My gut is yes, as it's designed for a life-safety application, but I've never heard of it being used for that.


----------



## avkid (Feb 20, 2012)

LavaASU said:


> So I guess the question is really is climbing gear OK for rigging. My gut is yes, as it's designed for a life-safety application, but I've never heard of it being used for that.


 All I can say here is ask the manufacturer.


----------



## FatherMurphy (Feb 20, 2012)

Latch hooks such as those used for chain motors and cranes might be appropriate here, they would be rated for hoisting materials, operable with one hand, and the latch would prevent accidental releases. Check with the manufacturer about specific use, though, as they try the 'not for overhead' exclusion, given you'd have people underneath.

Duty cycle might be something to consider, climbing gear might get used a couple hours a day, once or twice a month. A speaker cluster would be a continuous load 24/7 for months on end. Also, rigging equipment tends to be drop forged steel, climbing equipment tends towards aluminum alloys, and the two materials will handle stress and abuse differently. I'd be hesitant to use climbing equipment in a permanent setting, myself.


----------



## 65535 (Feb 20, 2012)

One of the major reasons I wouldn't touch climbing hardware simply because it's aluminum and will wear against steel components until it fails.


----------



## LavaASU (Feb 20, 2012)

These are for one offs. As in 12 to 72 hours use. Not months. I would use a shackle for permanent. I think I've got it sorted as I found 5000# rated steel tri-auto locks.


----------



## MPowers (Feb 21, 2012)

LavaASU said:


> These are for one offs. As in 12 to 72 hours use. Not months. I would use a shackle for permanent. I think I've got it sorted as I found 5000# rated steel tri-auto locks.




So, just for the edification of the rest of us, what is your source for the "tri-auto locks????


----------



## kicknargel (Feb 21, 2012)

I have seen aerial riggers use 'biners, but they typically insist on steel vs. aluminum.


----------



## LavaASU (Feb 21, 2012)

Thinking this: eBay - New & used electronics, cars, apparel, collectibles, sporting goods & more at low prices

Amazon.com: Liberty Mountain Steel Heavy Duty Key Oval 3-Stage Auto Lock Carabiner: Sports & Outdoors

Though I'd prefer a larger gate... trying to find a 1" version. Going to play with a couple of climbing ones tomorrow and see what size gate opening I really need.


----------



## Footer (Feb 21, 2012)

Look for a firemans hook. 

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk


----------



## willbb123 (Feb 21, 2012)

I keep a couple of these in my workbox to use for simple stuff. 
<font face="arial">1/2" Std. D NFPA Screw-Lok<br>Part # OP12S55LNFPA</font><br>


----------



## avkid (Feb 21, 2012)

Two MSA 10089207 carabiners live in my workbox.
They're not cheap, but they are traceable and tested.


----------



## porkchop (Feb 21, 2012)

Rock-N-Rescue shows two carabiners (one double locking the other triple locking) that are NFPA G-Rating 1983 (2006) and ANSI Z359.1 (2007) strength rated. Although neither of those standards are directly related to rigging with this equipment it does tell me that it's good equipment that will hold up to what it's rated for. The two they show are both rated at 40kn which is roughly a minimum breaking strength of 9000 lbs, derate by your chosen safety factor (I recommend 10-1 or more) to find SWL. The website doesn't mention if they are actually load rated or not so that's something to look further into. There are a few other carabiners that conform to slightly older standards that are steel rather than aluminum which would certainly take ware and tear better. These guys website isn't the greatest, so if you choose to go with them (which I suggest) I'd call them and talk to a professional about what you really want.


----------



## Wood4321 (Feb 22, 2012)

Here is what I would suggest.
ATM Flyware 1/2" Carabiner
These are steel locking carabiners, and they are rated for overhead use.

That being said, the 1000 working load limit is only a 5:1 safety factor, Depending on your use, you man want to derate it to 500 pounds.

In any case, I would be hesitant to use any hardware that is not "rated for overhead lifting" 

(Yes I know about CM Chain hoists, I didn't say I wouldn't use them, Just that I would be hesitant.)


----------



## avkid (Feb 22, 2012)

What's the pricing on that?


----------



## Wood4321 (Feb 22, 2012)

http://www.fullcompass.com/product/341408.html
$52.50 from Full Compass.
Enjoy !


----------



## What Rigger? (Feb 29, 2012)

65535 said:


> One of the major reasons I wouldn't touch climbing hardware simply because it's aluminum and will wear against steel components until it fails.



I use climbing equipment from time to time for overhead lifting. But you have to know (stop me if you've heard it before) how to properly use what you have. Yes, steel vs. aluminum as a general rule is not a good idea. But nothing exists in a vacuum, and sometimes it can be done. 

Wow. I was really vague there.


----------



## What Rigger? (Feb 29, 2012)

porkchop said:


> Rock-N-Rescue shows two carabiners (one double locking the other triple locking) that are NFPA G-Rating 1983 (2006) and ANSI Z359.1 (2007) strength rated. Although neither of those standards are directly related to rigging with this equipment it does tell me that it's good equipment that will hold up to what it's rated for. The two they show are both rated at 40kn which is roughly a minimum breaking strength of 9000 lbs, derate by your chosen safety factor (I recommend 10-1 or more) to find SWL. The website doesn't mention if they are actually load rated or not so that's something to look further into. There are a few other carabiners that conform to slightly older standards that are steel rather than aluminum which would certainly take ware and tear better. These guys website isn't the greatest, so if you choose to go with them (which I suggest) I'd call them and talk to a professional about what you really want.



I found SIX carabiner's like this a couple years ago, at Sport Chalet. Black, steel, double lock, 50kn, AND ANSI Z359.1 stamped. 
Somebody blew it, and mislabelled the price. 
All six in stock became mine for the low, low price of $15.95 each. I kid you not.
I made mention to a buddy in Chicago, and suddenly everyone I knew across the country was blowing up my phone to go back and buy more. Alas, I got the last 6, and when they restocked, they fixed the pricing error.
I still have them in use for industrial climbing, and other rigging activities.


----------

