# UNCSA vs Columbia College Chicago vs...?



## LightingManEvan (Apr 25, 2011)

Hey everyone....

Need some input here. I am a high school senior interested in Lighting Design/Technology and I have applied to a few schools. I have narrowed it down to North Carolina School of the Arts and Columbia College of Chicago.

UNCSA is very well known for the students they put out, and the reputation is not quite there for Columbia College of Chicago. I was very interested in the opportunities and college life feel that was at Columbia. UNCSA left alot, for me, to be desired in the areas of dorm life, food, surrounding town, etc. I wanted to have the options of studying abroad, interning at a local theater and other things while in college. Chicago has a large theater scene so it would be easier to intern while in school with everything available right there. 

I really like the feel of Columbia, but the students that UNCSA is able to put are very, very good. I just want to be able to go to a school that feels right for me, and I know the decision will ultimately come down to me...but can anyone help me? What do you think? Is having more opportunities and a, possibly, more fun and exciting college life (because of the opportunities available) worth having over a school that is known to put out better students/has a better reputation?

Thanks so much in advance!


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## derekleffew (Apr 25, 2011)

I'm not sure you could have picked two vastly different schools if you tried. Have you read http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...q-recomendations-about-college-education.html ?


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## LXPlot (Apr 25, 2011)

derekleffew said:


> I'm not sure you could have picked two vastly different schools if you tried. Have you read http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...q-recomendations-about-college-education.html ?



How so? They're both highly esteemed Theatre conservatories. Sure, one is a sector of a University while one is a stand-alone private group, and one is in the middle of nowhere while one is in Chicago, but other than that as far as I can tell they're the same.

Something to note is that Columbia Chicago kids will need to compete with Depaul Theatre School kids for the same kind of internships, in addition to competing with pros for actual work. Columbia has no graduate theatre program, while UNCSA has one but no graduate lighting focus. Something to note is that while UNCSA has a generic lighting program, Columbia instead has a tech program and a design program (I don't think you can do both), but nothing more specific than that. I guess if you definitely want to do lights and are positive you won't want to move to another field UNCSA wins in this area.

I'm not sure if either actually has all that much of a better reputation (don't take my word for it), but even if UNCSA has a better rep, Columbia Chicago is in the city and this will help you greatly in developing connections.

In the end though, my opinion is that you should focus more on which you'll enjoy more, because both of these will only be what you make of them.


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## Footer (Apr 25, 2011)

A few things: Studying abroad and a theatre education don't always go together. Its hard to leave college for a semester and not have missed something. Many people do summer programs or immersions abroad and that tends to work well. As far as internships go... with an internship or summer work you want to get the hell out of dodge. The point of internships is to make connections outside of your sphere of influence. I have friends right now in Chicago who are struggling finding work... all from top tier schools. You don't want to lock yourself up to one theatre scene. 

And as far as the town goes... odds are you won't leave the "bubble" of your university anyway. And with that... all bubbles are the same.. you have off campus house parties, maybe a bar or two within the bubble, and thats about it.


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## len (Apr 26, 2011)

Can't speak to the education, but there's tons to do around Columbia. You're just south of the loop, and the food, cultural and entertainment choices are vast, all within walking distance. Plus, Chicago has a pretty good public transit system for people to get in and out of the loop, so getting around the rest of the city is easy.


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## millamber (Apr 26, 2011)

As an Alumnus of NCSA, I can tell you that the education one receives there is top-notch, and the hands on experience cannot be beat. The faculty are also working professionals in their fields, the amount of contacts available are legion, and the placement rate is something like 90 percent out of school. Top companies like ETC, Vari-Lite, Martin, Strand and others bring the latest equipment to NCSA and let the students try it out. The school does close to 200 performances a year throughout all the different school disciplines, and the ability to work across different fields really lets you decide what you prefer to do, ie plays, musicals, opera, modern dance, ballet, etc.. There is a reason so many success stories come out of the school.

That being said, the intensity and dedication required to attend NCSA (They added the U after I graduated) is different than any other school in the country. It is a Performing Arts college, not a college that has a Performing Arts major. The emphasis is strictly on making its students the best artists available, and the class structure reflects that. My general studies requirements for graduation was 1 Math OR Science class. In 4 years. But I also was required to take Advanced Theatre Technology (think trigonometry for the performing arts) Motion Control, Welding, Drafting, Drawing, History of Decor, History of Theatre, Lighting Design, Stagecraft, Lighting technologies; the list goes on and on.

Your free time is very limited at NCSA. A typical Tuesday/Thursday goes like this: 

8am-10am general studies classes
10am-1pm Arts Classes
1pm-2pm Lunch
2pm-6pm Arts Classes
6pm-7pm Dinner
7pm-11pm Crew (set building, Costuming, lighting, prop making, etc)
11pm-3am homework for all of tomorrow's classes

Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays, Crew starts at 2pm and goes to 6pm. If its a show week, or load-in week, you might have a double 2pm-11pm. On weekends during a show week It could be a triple 10am-11pm. Crew is one of the most important aspects of the school. It is one of the things that determines whether you are asked back next semester. Yeah, each semester the faculty reviews each students' performance and votes on whether to keep them or not.

As you can expect, the turnover rate is huge. My class started with 17 lighting majors; we graduated 7. My wife's class started 8 scenic artists, she was the only one to graduate. The school exists to make professional artists and does not sugar coat the fact that this business is tough. Those that make it through are simply some of the best people I have ever worked with. 

If you want to do anything else besides performing arts, like say Economics or Banking, NCSA is not your school. It doesn't give you much as far as a backup plan goes, but what it does give you is the confidence (or arrogance depending on who you talk to) and ability to be an amazing artist.


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## BanditRO (Nov 4, 2011)

millamber said:


> As an Alumnus of NCSA, I can tell you that the education one receives there is top-notch, and the hands on experience cannot be beat. The faculty are also working professionals in their fields, the amount of contacts available are legion, and the placement rate is something like 90 percent out of school. Top companies like ETC, Vari-Lite, Martin, Strand and others bring the latest equipment to NCSA and let the students try it out. The school does close to 200 performances a year throughout all the different school disciplines, and the ability to work across different fields really lets you decide what you prefer to do, ie plays, musicals, opera, modern dance, ballet, etc.. There is a reason so many success stories come out of the school.
> 
> That being said, the intensity and dedication required to attend NCSA (They added the U after I graduated) is different than any other school in the country. It is a Performing Arts college, not a college that has a Performing Arts major. The emphasis is strictly on making its students the best artists available, and the class structure reflects that. My general studies requirements for graduation was 1 Math OR Science class. In 4 years. But I also was required to take Advanced Theatre Technology (think trigonometry for the performing arts) Motion Control, Welding, Drafting, Drawing, History of Decor, History of Theatre, Lighting Design, Stagecraft, Lighting technologies; the list goes on and on.
> 
> ...


 

Second!! NCSA is in the "middle of nowhere" and it matters not a whit! Anyone who gets in won't actually have any time to do anything anyway!!!

I started in, what was at the time billed as "the largest ever accepted class of lighting people" (27? I think) and graduated with only five of us left. HIGH rate of attrition.

As an Alum, I would recommend it only if you want to subject yourself to what I called, "Boot camp for theatre."

Loved it and would do it all again.


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## shiben (Nov 8, 2011)

len said:


> Can't speak to the education, but there's tons to do around Columbia. You're just south of the loop, and the food, cultural and entertainment choices are vast, all within walking distance. Plus, Chicago has a pretty good public transit system for people to get in and out of the loop, so getting around the rest of the city is easy.


 

BanditRO said:


> Second!! NCSA is in the "middle of nowhere" and it matters not a whit! Anyone who gets in won't actually have any time to do anything anyway!!!
> 
> I started in, what was at the time billed as "the largest ever accepted class of lighting people" (27? I think) and graduated with only five of us left. HIGH rate of attrition.
> 
> ...


 
I applied at Columbia, but I already live in the Chicago area, so I can live at home and take the train in (I live on the UP-W Metra line, so having a giant railroad near me is a major advantage. Go figure.). Both programs will give you excellent education. I like Chicago a lot, and you will compete for internships, but there is a lot of stuff going on around here. As for a college being a Theater Boot Camp, thats what all the pros I know personally consider touring. They all recommend touring for a few years if you want to be a top-notch technician. Just what I have heard as I work on my educational goals.


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## gafftaper (Nov 17, 2011)

Note: While thoughts on universities will no doubt be helpful to others in the future, the original question was asked back in April. So his decision has no doubt been made by now. 

Shiben: I really like your decision because it's more economical. It drives me crazy to hear students planning to go to expensive out of state private schools for theater degrees. Unless your family has a lot of money to pay for it, you will be poor for a very long time. Possibly so poor you can't afford to work in theater. While others are struggling to pay their massive student loans you will have money in your budget to occasionally purchase fresh fruit and protein (instead of just ramen and mac n' cheese).


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## josh88 (Nov 17, 2011)

I went the Shiben route as well. I went to a smallish fairly local to me state school. The program wasn't the best when I started, but there were maybe 15 of us going for the tech degree and so we had small classes faculty that really cared and we got to shape a lot and get out of it what we wanted. It still wasn't perfect but we left a legacy of change and they just opened a new facility for the department and it will be a really great program in the next year or two.

Also it was relatively cheap so I managed to graduate with no debt whatsoever. Then I moved half a country away and I've got $100 in my account, but I'm surviving. wouldn't be able to be doing this if I also had to pay off loans.


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