# Your opinions of Cordless Drill-Drivers



## ship

What cordless drills do you use?

I have a curiosity to inquire about.
Cordless drills are about a very standard tool used in building scenery now. There are lots of different models on the market too. Unlike in past years when they were called Makita’s because that was the only cordless drill worth using. (The mid 1980s)

What do you use at home and what does your school use? What do you think of the cordless drills/screw guns you have available or have tried and what do you think of them?

Since at one point most of you will be looking to buy your own cordless drill, having a data base of comments on them might be very useful in figuring out what you want to buy. You want the best screw gun for your money, but also the one that will live up to your expectations for it’s use. People feel strongly about the drills they own and get to use. It get’s political fast, (people feel strongly about their tools) but all the politics on cordless drills usually doesn’t give reasons for buying one over another or help people in choosing one over another. Magazines like Wood, Consumer Reports and American Woodworker have a home owner base of readers and as such what they recommend isn’t always the best tool to be recommended to someone that makes their living using their drill. What your school has might be a compromise in cost and brands they are authorized to be buying. While that might have a large impact on what you buy, it’s not always the best tool. By the way, saying this drill suckes, without saying why doesn’t help anyone.

If possible in a reply note the brand, style, voltage and model number of the drills you have and have used and comment about them good and bad. Such things might help and guide other towards buying the best drill they can. 

(You will note, prices change every year and the more you shop around especially for sales, the better your prices are. So mentioning a specific place to buy them and a price like Amazon/Tool Crib of the North $99.00 isn’t really much help beyond giving a general idea of what it might cost. I bought my favorite drill for $245.00 back about 8 years ago from Home Depot. Not much help now - they don’t even offer it. Citing specific places that carry such tools is only good if you live locally to the person writing citing mail order sources, many times is frequently cheaper but what you save in cost in buying by mail you will loose in shipping charges. Buying used tools is often an option. Don’t buy E-Bay type tools, you don’t know who abused them before you, but many times the tool brand’s authorized service centers will have re-furbished tools that are sold at a discount and still carry the full warranty. Also look into what is being discontinued. Look at if the manufacturer is offering an improved battery for the drill, this would be a good indication of if when it’s time to replace batteries you will be able to get one in the future. Also if your drill has been replaced with a new line such as I cite below with the DW991K line verses the DW983K-2 line, it might become harder to get parts for it. The Skil Top Gun for instance is discontinued and for the most part, you cannot get parts for it anymore so the tool once broken is not fixable.
In getting parts for example 15 years ago, before Makita had a good foothold in the US, you had to wait weeks for parts. This might be and is a problem with tools such as Royobi/Tim Allen/Craftsman - usually all made by Royobi where they don’t have the parts in this country although they might have more parts now. Hitachi, Metibo, Freud and Fein would definitely have this problem. In some cases such as a 3x21" belt sander, there is no huge difference in design between the Bosch, Skil and Royobi sanders other than specific parts inside them. You can send your Royobi sander to a Skill/Bosch service center and they might even be able to install the higher quality parts in the tool for a price. Just be careful, often service centers in general will swap out what ever part they feel they want to and charge you for it. Send it in for a cleaning and chuck change and they might change out and charge you for a new plastic casing for it. Make them call you to get permission before they do any major replacements and if they should change out the housing, make sure all tags are still on the tool including it’s serial number or if it’s lost you will not have that anymore. Don’t be afraid to take your tools back and send it elsewhere.)

Here are some brands for example: DeWalt, Makita, Bosch, Porter Cable, Metibo, Panasonic, Hitachi, Skil, Black & Decker, Milwaukee, Royobi, Tim Allen, Craftsman, Master Mechanic, Chicago, Wagner, Freud, Fein (did I miss any?)

Voltages are less than 7.2v, 7.2v, 9.6v, 12v, 14.4v, 18v, 24v and other voltages.
Style of guns can vary in ways like: Grips can be of the T-Handle style or Pistol Grip style and with cushion grip or plastic grip, batteries can be of the magazine or mushroom style.

Than if possible mention your drill’s model number so we all can know specifically what it is you comment about. Perhaps one of us can compile a list of links to the companies above mentioned.

In making such a data base so everyone can read about drills, we might see if there is a standard drill used in woodshops in the industry that you can use in helping your school choose it’s next line of drill and also you will be able to see what the best drills are to buy for your own personal use when you are ready to buy one.

(Also by looking into this, and especially if your theater is slow and your are looking for something to do, you might go around the shop and copy down the brand, model number and serial number of all the tools in the shop or your personal tools. Keep the info in two very secure locations and separate from each other. Might also take photos of them. This way if anything is stolen or lost, you can use the info for the police report and for insurance purposes. Who knows with a serial number, you might even get your tools back one day. Also use an engraving tool to scribe your theater name and phone number on the tool. This will make it even easier to get back if lost and prevent many people from taking them and making it harder for you to do your job. A final thought is in security. Watch who is in your shop and where they go. I used to work in a shop that was near a gathering place for bums. Actually a few shops in those areas. Occasionally they would wander in off the street and even help people carry stuff around the shop. Who would suspect the new employee that’s obviously helping carry stuff around would be a thief? They would help a while, than wander into the tool room and help themselves to some tools, than walk right out the door. Once the tools are gone, it makes it harder for you to get your job done and it’s all the less cash you theater will have to buy more toys with. Every night after you are done in the shop, one person should be assigned to the tool room and they should inventory the tools and ensure everything is returned. If not, nobody goes home until the missing stuff is found. Who knows who will be in the shop when you are not around with sticky fingers or who might cut their hand off when playing with something they are not trained with. Than that tool is both gone and if someone hurt themself with them, you won’t be able to use it either. I have heard of many high schools that don’t allow students to used cutting tools much less climb ladders. The students cannot even possess a utility knife. You might also get the school to budget in getting the tools in for cleaning and a service call once a year or at least every other year. Otherwise, your warrantees will be void and any dirt and grit in them will tear up the drill from the inside out. The more you use a tool, the more it needs to see service and professional service at that.)


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## ship

*cordless drillls, more stuff*

Here is some base data:
A T-Handle drill is the most popular drill to be using because it doesn’t take any real training to use properly and is easy to use. However with proper training in holding a pistol grip drill, it is much easier to use one handed and places your hand in line with what you are drilling thus it is more accurate. That’s given your hand is big and strong enough to hold one properly. Otherwise, it’s not an easy drill to use.

Synthetic padding on the handle of your drill will make it more comfortable to use. Ergonomics are a large factor in buying a drill and the more expensive drills will frequently have better ergonomic designs and harder more damage resistant plastic making it up.

Voltage is a large factor. Drills should have removable batteries and be of at least 12 volts to best balance battery life and power with cost and weight. A 12 volt battery in your drill is in most cases sufficient to do most shop work, but when you need to go away from the shop, a progressively larger battery might be useful. A 12v battery has sufficient power for about an hour’s worth of use. That’s fine because most chargers need an hour to charge them. A 14.4v battery will give a bit more torque and be usable for about 2 hours. If you are out working in a professional setting where you get break time every two hours, it’s easy to swap out batteries at that point. This is also about the heaviest drill you want to be carrying around all day long because a 18 volt drill will get really heavy really fast if you use it all day long. So the 18v battery will last about 4 hours or more. If you are out in the woods, without any power, than this drill is ideal especially for high torque situations when you cannot get a corded drill. More power isn’t always the best ideal when buying a drill. On the other hand, with the old 9.6v Makita magazine batteries, they were light and easy to carry even in a rifle’s magazine pouch.

At one point I had (10) 14.4 batteries, and I worked with 4 other carpenters with the same drill. Between us, we had 18 batteries available for 4 people. In addition to this, our 14.4v drills could use a 12v battery in a pinch so we never ran out of power. Standardizing your personal tools with that of what your co-workers use has it’s advantages as is considering what other tools are available using the same battery. For instance, I have two drills, one saw, one flash light, and one right angle drill using the same battery. Makes it easy to swap between them. 

Options: most of today’s drills have upwards of 15 torque settings, two or more speeds and various other things available like hammer drill settings. I for instance frequently install electrical boxes in brick and block so my hammer drill comes in very handy. That option however for a carpenter for the most part isn’t much use you don’t drill into masonry much, it’s not extremely valuable especially since the blows per minute and force of the blows on a cordless tool isn’t sufficient to drill thru many surfaces such as concrete. A corded drill especially a SDS type will do the job much better. The more speed your drill has, the more fasteners you can drive per minute but the more torque in general you trade off in it’s stead. For instance, a 12v drill might not be able to drive in a 3" drywall screw in dense wood after it’s first half an hour or when the battery gets old. It certainly cannot in high gear. A 14.4v drill can do this in high gear for about an hour when you need it to. However, speed is a concern on any drill of any voltage. Drill bits are designed to work at certain speeds depending upon what they are coated with and are drilling into. Going at the wrong speed can dull them and make it take longer to drill into surfaces. Even beyond this, if your drill is putting in a 1.5/8" drywall screw that’s a normal loading on it and it should work properly no matter what speed you have on the drill. A drill with top speed of 800rpms, puts in less than half the screws of a drill with a top speed of 1750rpms. For clutch settings, think I have seen them go all the way up to 28 settings. How many do you really need? In most instances, you only use 6 settings for your drill yet the more settings your drill has, the bigger selling feature companies market your drill at. Clutch settings isn’t a large selling point of any drill, just makes it more confusing as to what to set it at. Some drills come with bubble levels and even flashlights. Nice features to have, but you can do the same with a stick on level in most instances and can install velcro on your drill for your flashlight given your mouth isn’t a good enough flash light mounting bracket.


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## ship

*cordless drills, what I have used*

Okay, this is getting long, but I'm going for brownie points and to skip skill levels. Havn't been called a newbie or actor grade tech person in years.


By the way, here is a new term for all of you, "Bi-techual" that means a person that is both actor and competent tech person. ha ha. No I'm not an actor, but have met my share of them that can act and build stuff.

So what do I use and have used to start this off?

My favorite drill is the DeWalt #DW996K. It’s a pistol grip 14.4v very fast hammer drill with a ½" keyless chuck and lots of cooling vents on it. As I said, I install stuff in masonry walls so I need a hammer drill, but beyond that, I bought the drill for two reasons. 1) It at 1,750 rpms was faster than a standard 1,400 rpm drill and thus could drive more screws per minute. 2) I was raised with pistol grip drills and was instructed how to hold them properly in the palm of your hand and drilling with a index finger not your trigger finger. The T-handle drill given this was always off center in balance and drilling to me. This drill given it’s high speed isn’t as powerful as a T-handle drill at a lower speed but the 14.4v makes up a lot for that, and if I need more torque, I can just grab a corded tool. Balance for me is perfect. When I am not using it, and it’s not in my shoulder holster, I balance the drill in it’s neutral setting (as all drills should be stored in to prevent a accident of fire) on it’s trigger from what ever is nearest. This drill balances exactly on it’s trigger, you can hang it off a extension ladder rung, pipe, or what ever and with it’s weight, it is very stable and won’t fall. With it’s ½” chuck, I don’t have to use step down bits in it also.
Disadvantages of my drill would be that if you are not trained in the proper way to hold it and have small hands, it’s an awkward tool to use. Also it’s keyless chuck - and Jacobs makes most of the chucks used on most of the drills on the market today, doesn’t hold drill bits as tight as they need to be. A drill with a ratcheting keyless chuck would be much better. At times, I even miss my keyed chuck. A keyless chuck featuring a key lock that can be used to make it extra tight or loosen a stuck bit would be very useful. Another problem with this drill is that if you drop it just right, it will split the plastic frame from forward/reverse to trigger - and expensive and necessary repair. That’s why I use it when not on the ground with a lanyard attached to it. This drill cost about $245.00 at the time.

I also own a DW991K. It’s a 14.4v T-Handle drill and in my view about the best drill in the industry for a carpenter to own as their personal tool given they use T-handle drills. It has plenty of torque to spare and a good amount of speed. It’s also very rugged - takes a licking and keeps on ticking. It’s not the fastest drill on the market, but 1,400 rpms isn’t bad. 
Drawbacks of this drill for me are that it’s a T-handle and thus awkward, slow comparatively, and doesn’t have as good of a balance for storage though it will stand up on it’s battery. I say it’s awkward because I tend to choke up on my drills in trying to put it’s balance or the palm of my hand as close to the center of the axis of the drill bit as possible. Having something with a seam where my hand is trying to be can get annoying. This drill had at the time cost about $200.00

This drill has also been upgraded to a newer style the #DW983K-2. I bought one for the shop after the shop manager took the only shop screw gun with him on a show and I got tired of loaning out mine. Not that the second drill did any good, last month he took both drills and did not bother saying anything so at least I could bring in my second drill. Anyway this upgraded drill is very nice. It’s maximum speed is 1,800 rpms which is faster than my pistol grip - I’m pissed, and it has a ½" chuck. That’s very nice, but it’s a heavy drill - those extra ounces add up fast. This drill have three speed settings which is nice and highly improved torque over the older models. It also features that ratcheting chuck. This would be the tool I would buy to replace my T-handle were I to replace it. Just wish it were available in a pistol grip hammer drill. Granted this drill cost like $245.00.

Unfortunately, the drill I bought was not using the same battery as the original shop screw gun. The shop manager actually had a 12v drill, and he forgot what tool he actually had that I was trying to match. This means, that the 12v drill only has it’s original two very old and weak batteries to it because the extra battery I also bought was 14.4v and you can’t use the new drills batteries to power it up. Or at least you should not be able to - they are supposted to have slots that prevent a higher voltage battery from working in lower voltage tools. For some reason, our shop drill fits the 14.4v battery - probably broken latch in it allowing you to fit the larger battery because you should not be able to fit a larger battery in it. Shop manager loves how much more powerful the 12v drill is with the larger battery. Don’t follow his lead. 
Consider what happens if you have a Christmas tree string of lamps and install a lamp from a 100 lamp string into a 50 lamp string. Burns really bright before it burns out and takes the string down with it unless you have the shunt type lamps. You can however install 50 lamp string lamps in a 100 lamp strings of lamps. This will at least double the lamp life if not extend it by many more times. 
(The effect of voltage on a lamp will cause a significant change in lamp performance. For any particular lamp, light output varies by a factor of 3.6 times and life varies inversely by a factor of 12 times any percentage variation in supply. For every 1% change in supply voltage light output will rise by 3.6% and lamp life will be reduced by 12%. This applies to both DC and AC current. Most standard line voltage lamps are offered at 130v. Since most line voltage power is applied at 120volts, the result is a slight under voltaging of the filament. The effect of this is substantially enhanced lifehours, protection from voltage spikes and energy cost savings.)
When ever you install a higher voltage on a tool or lamp rated for lesser voltage, you burn the tool or lamp out much faster. In this case, the motor is rated for 12v and using the extra power cell in it is going to burn the motor out within say a year of use.

The old shop tool is a DeWalt #DW972K-2, 12v T-handle drill. This is in my opinion the standard shop cordless drill in the industry - and I have seen it used in a lot of other scene shops. It has almost as much torque as a 14.4v drill, and the same speed. With it’s 12v battery, it’s good for most applications of not having to constantly change the battery out and it’s grip is the ergonomic cushion type. It’s also very light. This is a very cost effective drill to buy for a shop tool, it balances torque and speed with price very well and is very rugged. That’s given your school does not have a problem with theft.

If your drills disappear before they wear out, than I wold suggest buying the lesser DW953K version. It has less torque and speed but uses the same very easy to get 12v battery. It’s a rugged tool that is not as comfortable to use but costs a lot less. One of my scene shops bought into them to replace their aging Skil Top Guns right after I left. They haven’t had problems with them other than not being as powerful as the more expensive guns. Most of the shop carpenters had their own guns anyway so this was not a big deal. It was more of a question of providing drills for those temporary workers that needed them since they did not have their own. Within the first year of getting out of college and becoming pro, you will be unofficially expected to provide your own cordless drill. Shops provide them and cannot force you to buy one but it is now becoming an industry standard that in other than Union shops you provide your own hand tools and this is a personal hand tool. You will find that many if not most union crews won’t provide much of their own electric tools still. Providing them for use is still the norm. The point is, you will be needing to buy a cordless drill in addition to other tools and there is a large difference between what the shop buys and what is the best tool for you to buy.

Other drills I have worked on or used in the interest of starting a good base of a debate:
DeWalt used to offer the pistol grip ray gun #DW942R. The one I worked on had very warn out gears or clutch. It didn’t have much power, had a lot of slack in it’s trigger between when the drill was on and off - it’s variable speed dimmer if it had one was very warn out and it’s clutch was blown so it could not drive 3" screws. It’s early ergonomics were not comfortable and it’s balance was off.

This drill was very similar to the first cordless drill I ever bought and under threat by my own high school’s technical director were I to buy anything else. Makita doesn’t offer this tool anymore but it was the standard for the industry and one of the most rugged designs of cordless tool ever designed. I bought the #6012HDW. It was 9.6v with magazine type batteries that were shaped like rifle magazines and fit completely into the tool instead of being a mushroom shape. This tool lasted me happily for years, I even bought the cordless saw and flashlight to it. Granted the saw was only good for 1x4 lumber and it’s 14.4v Dewalt saw can cut 2x4 lumber without a problem. 
The 6012HDW was only two speed and 5 clutch settings without a variable speed but what a wonderful tool. Very dependable even if you had to stick it in the freezer at times to cool it down when overworked. By today’s standards, this drill is slow and lacking in power, but this tool with it’s keyed chuck was the workhorse for the industry back when screw guns were first coming on the market and nothing was better or had more torque. You could abuse it day after day and it would always work without a problem very dependably. You could use it so hard that it burned your skin as you touched the housing as long as you serviced it’s grease, it worked the next day. I finally killed mine off using a 5/8" auger bit on it while drilling like 30 holes in a 6" thick beam - that after using it all day long. Could have fixed it but replaced it instead. Wonder what ever happened to my old drill? Trigger switches and clutches were the only things that ever went wrong with these tools. The trigger switch being an arcing on/off type just wore out and the clutch had grooves that developed in it necessitating replacement every few years. Overall it was a very good drill and it’s motor could take a lot of abuse.

This drill was “improved” by other cordless drill styles by Makita, and the second generation of drills by all brands based much of their abilities off this drill as a base. The #6093DW was the improved version of the HD. It featured a electronic brake to save against wear on the motor and get the bit in the drill to stop at the same rotation as when you shut off the drill. This electronic brake is a good thing. Ever notice how many times your cordless drills will with a Philips bit, stop at the same orientation as the screw which did not move while the drill was running down? With this little feature, you don’t have to twist the drill to re-insert it into a screw to drive it further. Problem was with these “improved” drills they had a “overload protector”. This feature was short lived on premium cordless drills but might still be found on lower end products to protect the motors. In practice, if you continue using a drill when the motor gets too hot, it will burn up and be very costly to repair. Problem was in this early technology, when the motor got hot, it triggered a thermostat switch that shut the motor down while you were using it. Now there is a good way of pissing off a carpenter - having his drill click off on him while in mid-screw. This problem was compounded with the fact that once it clicked back on and was cool enough, all too frequently it would click back off during use saying “Oh, I’m too hot again and I’m lame.” You could be on your first screw after the gun got cool enough to use again, and the gun would just click off on you again... wait a minute, drive the screw further than “click”, the gun is back off. Not a way to build scenery. This drill just was not a good industrial tool and the auto shut off to my knowledge has never been re-introduced since than even though technology has advanced a lot since the 80s. Makita, was once the leading edge of power tool design, this was long before DeWalt became a large national product with it’s industry standard second generation technology that I still use. They for a while were the only company developing new and very useful features and good tools. DeWalt and Craftsman now are in the same market of being innovative.

The new late 1st generation drills also had problems with the batteries. Really a bad idea that has become a myth today in bad practice. Someone decided to install a memory chip in the batteries to have them monitor how much the battery needed to be charged last time it was in the charger, and repeat it. Hello, what if you did not use it as much last time? So it was frequently necessary to completely drain the battery, not once but three times in ensuring that on this next future charging, it would again get a full charge and be usable for the proper period of time. Unfortunately, many less informed people with modern batteries continue to do this even though the more modern chargers sense how much charge your batteries need and give only that much. Note: if your drills are of an older design, it might still be needed to totally discharge the batteries to get a full charge out of them. Depends upon if the chip is in them. 

The only time you need to discharge your battery is if you are putting them into storage and do not plan to use them for about 3 months or longer. Since your battery will loose it’s charge over that amount of time if you use it or not, it’s better to drain it or it will loose some of it’s power. Also don’t leave batteries on a charger for more than a week without use - not good for them even if receiving an occasional boosting charge as they run down in power. If your theater has frequent phase harmonic problems such as you find that there are constantly exit and work lights burning out, it’s not a good idea to leave the batteries in the charger at all or they will also suffer from these problems and tend to die faster. In general however, most modern batteries are not harmed by leaving them in the charger and charging them even when not drained of power. I personally have a fresh-never charged battery for my home drill. I don’t use it much and so don’t need the battery. Probably don’t even need the new battery much less drill since what projects are large enough to necessitate me using the drill at home are large enough in notice for me to bring home a battery from work and not charge my emergency battery. Only reason I need a second drill is that when I was a carpenter, I frequently burned out or broke my main drill and had to send it in for a week of maintenance necessitating a replacement. I expect most of you won’t need a second drill much less 7 or 8 of them owned personally by you. The second drill is also useful when I have help in building shows but the help doesn’t have their own tools. Wait a few years before considering a backup drill however. You need to send your personal drills in for service at least once or twice a year, but buying a second drill if quality is a major investment. If you do, ensure it uses the same battery so at least you can use the extra batteries. Having extra batteries comes in useful as they get older and hold less of a charge. When you need a drill however, especially if you don’t own your own, remember to ask for permission to use a drill owned by the school. Borrowing a drill to install a picture in your bedroom, much less to help dad install a deck is considered theft and a good way to get you thrown out of your theater and suspended.

On other battery issues, it’s very possible for the amperage of a battery to start a fire when the terminals are arched together. Never just set a battery in a tool box with other metal tools unless you can ensure it won’t touch other tools or the terminals are recessed. When possible take the batteries out of your cordless tools when in storage or at least ensure that their locks or neutral – not off or on settings are engaged. Ensure your tool won’t work in the neutral setting. I have a cordless right angle drill that easily slips out of neutral and goes into gear without even pressing the forward/reverse. All drills worth buying need to have the neutral if not a locking mechanism. 

Here you are driving your car home after a full day of work and you hear from the back seat, your drill starting to run inside your tool bag as you turned that last corner... not good. (Okay, this is probably a few years in all of your futures.) Hmm, pull over and loose your pole position during rush hour traffic to shut off the stupid drill before it drills a hole in the side of the case, and drives you mad by a drill running without an operator or reach around and try to shut the thing off while trying to say on the road. (What happen to me, Na.) 
More importantly, a drill that is stored with it’s battery and should it go out of it’s non-run/safe position will run at a speed equal to the amount of pressure on it’s trigger (the weight of the drill or the tool leaning against it) until you shut it off. (This is where a drill with a thermostat would be useful.) Most frequently, this is not enough pressure to discharge the battery sufficiently and at a speed that the drill just runs out of juice under no-load conditions. Instead, the drill will run until you notice it and shut it off or it gets so hot that the drill burns itself out to say the least. In the case of a weekend without you going in to visit the drill, this could mean that the drill has been running all weekend long. Can you say a hot enough tool that both the battery and the drill get hot enough to start a fire? If you don’t want your theater to burn down and you to loose the fun of doing shows, I would say a least you need to verify that the drills are in their neutral settings and they cannot slip out into gear, if not remove the batteries when not in use. Another reason for one person to be in charged of the tool room and ensuring everything is put away when not in use and stored safely.

So let’s see, and back to the subject, I was speaking about various drills on the market and specifically about drills I had problems with or was given that didn’t poove very sound in day to day use engineering.

I recommend DeWalt cordless tools in general as they are the only ones I have play tested to date that are industrial, heavy duty and an industry standard. 12v for the work shop and 12v to 14.4v for you depending upon your needs. DeWalt tools also since they have encased motors and gears are not user serviceable constantly confounding me because I do fix a lot of tools. That says something about the tool, good or bad, I’m yet to know. Let’s say good, there are professionals out there much more qualified than I am even if I own T-10 security screw drives. But as I said, personal tools are very political and subject to personal observation. The motor housing to my DeWalt has gotten a few pits or rust on it after use in the rain, but it still runs as if new.

On the other hand, I have a love/hate relationship to Bosch tools. They are the best tools on the market in quality, but for a screw gun, if they are not properly maintained or get dirty, those fine tolerances in between parts will tear apart the drill from the inside out. Bosch makes some of the best products on the market. I own three Bosch tools and consider them the BMW of tools. One of my carpenters owned a 12v Bosch #3954VSRK drill. Looked like another ray gun. (Older people from the 1980s generation X will know what I mean by “ray gun”.) He never sent the thing in for maintenance and you could just hear the gears grinding against each other when the tool was used. Finally it seized up and the owner bought a DeWalt. On a Bosch cordless tool, the quality is there to an extreme, but like on a German gun, it’s tolerances are so tight, that if it is used in the field without proper cleaning, it’s not going to last. Because of the original experience with gears grinding more seriously than any other drill, and cost, I did not seriously consider such drills. The best in medium routers and drywall tools, in addition to medium belt sanders, but even their corded medium amperage hammer drills have problems with getting too hot and burning out. On the other hand, the Bosch “Bulldog” is the standard for the industry in being a very good heavy duty SDS hammer drill. If you don’t use your drill every day and for a living, a Bosch tool is probably equal if not better in my opinion in quality to a DeWalt drill. In that case, the 12v Bosch drill is possibly the best for you.

This is all during the 90s and a world away for most of you, but while my HD Makita, even T-handle DeWalt was in the freezer I frequently had the opportunity to borrow other Makita tools. They didn’t have the advancements of DeWalt at the time and had stagnated in quality. I had recommended as “TD” to someone to buy a 9.6v/12v Makita that could take either battery. Sorry. This early drill in features was no more than my HD Makita with it’s non-variable speed and lack of brake, only offering a extended life battery at the cost of weight and balance. The thing was just clunkie to use. Had the same rough gears as the HD’ and the same clutch problems that were not fixable. It was also not variable speed. This Makita #6011DW that anyone that who has seen it will know it instantly by description, was innovative for the market, and was not much of an improvement beyond like with the SAW machine gun taking dual feeding sources. Okay drill overall, but it was produced right before the next generation of drills came out, much like the M-60E3 machine gun with it’s front handle. At least it did not have the confounded thermostat if I remember right. Didn’t really burn out this drill, but came close.

Than again, I also got to use and burn out a new (at least at the time) Makita #6211D drill. It featured the new extreme output 12 volt batteries as compared to the 9.6v standard, and a dimmer controlled trigger and brake. It was a T-handle tool that was the basis of all second generation T-handle tools. This tool in my hands, in driving more screws per minute than most home owners, got really hot and thus it was fortunate it was not mine. Sorry, probably should have paid for it to be sent in for a re-lube. Than again the theater should have paid. Just not enough cooling vents or a lack of cooling fan for the motor - an early design but nice early design - very smooth in running.

Dad used Craftsman corded drills and I because of him was raised on them as my standard. That is until I started burning them out. Got to the point that Craftsman drills or saws would last about an hour in duration in the days of me burning out at least two power tools per year. Now they, especially the cordless tools are much improved in quality and innovation but still have the same warranty. No, on Craftsman power tools, that “take it back any time” for a new tool does not apply. (Sears didn’t at the time even make their tools, Skil and Royobi made them.) If you burn out your drill, you will probably have to pay to get it fixed. After burning out my first few Craftsman power tools, they gained a bad taste in my mouth and I now only buy their sockets and wrenches. I also frequently laugh at other Craftsman sold on tools people. I probably should give Craftsman power tools a bit more credit, they rate well in most trade magazine ratings, but I have also had a few of the older models of cordless tool in my hand that were not very well designed or that did not hold up to my or others abuse well. The new tools just might be good and industrial.

Craftsman at a product brand has a good following and lately has come out with many innovations - given the strap wrench doesn’t work as well as implied when used on multi-pin Socopex connectors and the laminated pliers tear up set screws to lighting fixtures worse than Channel Locks. Anyone in the shop or theater I catch using either tool instead of a C-wrench or ratcheting box wrench spends their days coiling cable and not using their tools until they buy the proper tool for the job. And a 8" C-wrench is the proper wrench to own in my opinion, anyone using a 6" or 10" wrench goes home for the day. (Am I mean, perhaps, but I was trained properly and have profit sharing with the company I work for. This means the more money I save the company, the more I make back at the end of the year. That in addition to being management.)

(Note companies such as Huskey, Klien, Ace, S&K and others have the same warranty and are just as easy to replace if not easier as Craftsman. Buy tools based upon your comfort and likings of them given the same warranty. You don’t have to buy just Craftsman hand tools to get the warranty even if the box wrenches are perhaps a bit better in quality. Klien tools are better in quality overall, and you don’t have to return them to Sears should they break. Any one that sells those brands of tools will replace them. Buy S&K from True Value, and Ace will take it back. At least in the case of Klien, they don’t break as easily as the Craftsman, why replace tools if they don’t break or strip out? That’s the idea of buying tools, getting the ones that are the most economical and ergonomic, but also the ones that will live up to your use. I never broke an Ace hardware box wrench myself much less a Stanley socket given the Stanley doesn’t have a warranty. I did break off the tip of a Klien screw driver when using it as a pry bar as I should not have been. Sears took it back and exchanged it for a different cabinet tip model even if they did not sell the square shank model and it was definite I did not buy it there - probably an Ace Hardware buy. Not sure if I like a cabinet tip replacement, but the point is that with a Klien hand tool, it does not matter where you bought it, it’s warranty also. These are all notes you should take when buying tools in your future. See what professionals use and buy similar products. Those people you really respect probably have put a lot of study into the tools they choose. My high school teacher also demanded I buy a Estwing 22oz waffle head hammer. I lost my first one and bought a 16oz since than in addition to my 22oz. But this hammer is the best for me and she was right. It’s even a veteran of Operation Desert Shield. My war hammer.) 



So where was I again? Oh’ yea, cordless screw drivers. 

One scene shop I worked for had like 30 of the Skil Top Gun. This early second generation 12v tool was economical considering they had a lot of theft, and for it’s era, a good amount of power.
Not a bad drill. Each drill as normal came with two batteries and thus we had a good amount of batteries for them even if in this case we used them in installing scenery and booths for City of Chicago special events uses where you were at times blocks away from your charger and a fresh battery and had to carry a few extra - like one or two per drill as opposed to the 14.4v XL DeWalt battery where only one battery was needed for two or three drills. That was until a city contractor tapped into a high leg of power and wiped out like half of the Skil, DeWalt and “guest” batteries charged for the install in a single day. Now there is an expensive problem to fix. “My battery does not work, and it did before I came here.” Talking about blowing the budget for a show, try replacing like 30 cordless tool batteries due to them shorting out or something like that from the same problem. Took some defiant sneaking in of purchase orders to replace batteries for that gig, and we got to be quickly over budget. 

By the way, if your dad or you own your own power tools, much less hand tools, you should not be using them at school. The schools’ insurance does not cover them much less if you injure yourself or others with them, and should there be a problem, you will be lucky if they are replaced, much less if you are not responsible for any damage caused by them. If you want to go to college, and you should, don’t put any liability claims or lawsuits on your parents. In the case of your professional - after you get out of school type work, you only get them replaced if your manager like me sees your problem as the companies fault and they are nice enough to replace them at company expense. Or in my case can provide enough tools that the company does not have and in my case buy the tools anyway, thus can replace your tools when they wear out. This is a management or very high level tech person type thing, don’t expect to get paid to keep up your tools on or off budget as I am right out of school. Any wonder most Union people are hesitant to drag out their expensive tools from their tool boxes? For now, use what is provided for you even if it seems ancient and less capable.

They (the Skil Top Gun) were also available with flash lights though we never bought into them. Flashlights, jig saws, circular trim saws, sawzalls, right angle drills, and who knows what else are all other tools available using the same battery, and to consider when buying a tool line. If you expect at some point to be up on a ladder installing trim and need a cordless jigsaw, it becomes a large consideration in choosing a line of tools. I think the Skil brand even came up with a cordless saw for it’s battery. Such tools are very useful given it’s a good tool to begin with and a good sized battery to do other jobs, buy them in multi-packs if possible with budget to save money given you can deal with having a few less batteries overall to power them off of. Hmm, Master Carpenter wandering around Taste of Chicago (a very large event) custom fitting stuff with a cordless saw, this at first made the management very worried until they saw how useful such tools could be in the field.

The Skil Top Gun had one basic flaw much similar to theat of the HD’ Makita, it’s clutch though different in mechanism wore out too easily, it also slipped out of gear too easily. This was easily corrected at least temporarily by going into the tool and squeezing the leaf spring controlling the clutch/speed control smaller as it stretched out, but wasn’t a permanent fix. Some novel carpenters even fitted a wooden block into the switch controlling the speed to prevent it from slipping out of gear. Very nice improvement, a small piece of wood would make the tool extra strong in keeping it running at the higher torque. They didn’t hold up well with professional use, but at least older drills were easy enough to fix temporarily. A few stolen, or in my case dropped off a roof during winter and one of the city’s worst and we needed to replace them badly. Hmm, have the master carpenter fix tools or direct things being built in the shop.... much more useful to have him supervise.

The Skil Top Gun, was replaced by the Skil Warrior series. Got to be hard to replace them and we eventually went DeWalt (much due to my pressure and staff carpenter demonstration). The Warrior series of 3rd generation drill didn’t share the same parts as the Top Gun and if we were to switch, it would not be worth the money as opposed to pricing out perhaps other drills. Since I was expected to be buying at least a few (30) in bulk - and this gives you the attention of any supplier, my local supplier sent me a test sample. That’s a note should any of you be charged with buying a new tool or light, get a sample to play test first. The Warrior was using even a lesser grade of plastic than the Top Gun and thus given it’s motor was even powerful enough, would mean it would rip itself apart from the inside out. Wouldn’t trade my Skil Worm Drive 7.1/2" saw for the world, it cuts thru steel like butter, but for a drill, there is better.
(Plus we were sold on DeWalt as a good dependable brand.)

To my tastes, in trying a Porter Cable cordless drill, it was heavy and very large in the hand. Nice drill, but not for me. Probably like a #9872 14.4v drill. Porter Cable is known to make the best in heavy duty routers and belt sanders, but on cordless drills, they are not the best in my opinion. They also make a great laminate trimmer, and random orbital sander, but for cordless tools, during the 90s I was not impressed given the weight and large size.

Tried one of the new line of Milwaukee drills, they were my second choice in drill especially with their extremely cool clip on flashlight. (Much more useful than the other major option of a bubble level considering it only measured one dimension and not diagonal perpendicularness to the surface you drilled.) We used drills in the dark a lot, city turned off the light in the booth on their own schedule not ours and frequently you would be in some large ticket booth tent that had no light at all. Based upon years of use with my Super SawZall, and it being the only brand of heavy duty drill I buy given Bosch has problems with burning out in high gear, I really wanted to be a believer in the Milwaukee cordless. Heck, my “birdie” or sort of right angle drill from them is one of my favorite drills, however I was never impressed with the 12v #0501-20 reversable battery pack drill. Pistol grip and flash light or not, a reversible battery pack means at all times one set of contacts are exposed to the elements. Even if there is no chance of them shorting out or shocking you, that means an extra set of contacts that will always get dirty and corroded. Since Milwaukee offered not protection for the exposed contacts, I was not impressed enough to buy. Good drill, good brand but a slight downfall in having a not well thought out option for my application. Very well designed tool for normal usage however and unlike Bosch, Milwaukee holds up in my opinion just as well as DeWalt in abuse. When I got to the new shop, one of the tech people had a Milwaukee Cordless tool - all be it, probably an older model like the #0502-20. It had never seen maintenance, but had never been up to my level of abuse either. By the time I got there, the drill was on it’s last legs and about to be replaced. Same normal problems of a early second generation drill- when it runs dry with grease and abuse due to over-use, it rips itself apart from the gearing outward. Given the user can handle a pistol grip 12v drill, and it’s not been later improved this 0501-20 drill with it’s flash light and reversible battery pack, still seems to me to be a really good design even if the exposed contacts might be of concern to me.

Panasonic makes great low voltage cordless screw drivers - even manufacturing them for brands such as Milwaukee. They also manufacturer the batteries for many cordless tools thus given good drill engineering, would make a good tools. (There are only a few manufacturers of batteries, Panosonic and Makita are a few known for good quality an innovation.) Major disadvantage for me early on was being laughed at for owning a Panasonic drill and thus not a “name brand” and having over 20 clutch settings. Since than Panasonic has mad a really good and dependable name for themselves as a good dependable tool and while you might get a few snickers with what tool you buy, in my impression, it’s a good brand even if you don’t need all those clutch settings.

I have two of their cordless 3.6v screw drivers at work, much superior to other cordless screw drivers on the market.

On the other hand, the Black & Decker with it’s Versi-Pack system is crap in my opinion. Sure you can put a few batteries in a single tool to power it up, and there is a lot of tools you have available to buy, but what happens if one of those batteries you put in isn’t as good in holding a charge or is not charged to full? What happens to a flash light with one good and one bad battery? Had a TD once that bought into the Versi-Pack system, he was not happy even doing the most simple of operations, the battery packs simply did not hold enough of a charge.

With Black & Decker on mind there is the “FireStorm”. This drill is a direct copy of the DeWalt (Black & Decker owned) drill with lesser parts making it up. Do not buy this drill. When this drill was coming to market, I was considering buying 20 or 30 of them but my Black & Decker/DeWalt service center reps specifically told me not to purchase it because it was a home owner - occasional use grade of tool not meant for use by professionals and that it would burn up. It even has less powerful, non-XP batteries on it. The plastic making up the housing was not as strong, and it’s motor was weaker. Had a good experience with the industrial line of compound miter box being just as good as the DeWalt, but than again, the first Jigsaw I bought was a Black & Decker and it lasted about a month. Plus I did burn out a few of their corded drills. I was on the fence and liked the price before the sales people said it would not hold up to normal shop/professional usage. 

I once owned a Royobi 3x21" belt sander. Looked the same as the Bosch I was constantly using at work and was much cheaper. Unfortunately, it had an aluminum drive gear that kept burning thru drive belts when abused and the tool was a constant sink hole for money in keeping it working. Plus I went thru 3 switches in two years. Bought a Bosch later and never had a problem even many years later with it even if similar in design. The carpenters that bought into the Royobi line of tools had similar problems with them lasting once they got to using them. Even had an electrician lately who was given a Royobi drill as a gift, who a few months later, he found it could not even drive a 2" screw without the clutch slipping. A caution I would give perspective buyers is that you get what you pay for.

This brand of tool also makes the “Tim Allen” line of tool. Now why would someone buy an actor’s personal line of tool? Does the actor who once in a spoof on home repair show know anything about tool design, much less have any real impute into it’s overall construction? I’m not union, but I give a real good mocking laugh to buyers of such tools. You get what you pay for... The actor in developing the line of tools remarked that “he designed the tools as he would want them.” I go back to, now what does an actor know about tools? Now if Norm Abrams a person with real and demonstrated knowledge of tools ever came out with a line of tools, that would be products to watch. Until than, what he uses should be good enough for you, even if it’s primarily what his sponsors give him for free. Even Sears spokesperson Bob Via, doesn’t know what the heck he is doing - listen to people who know tools and building stuff. In one of his later shows in reference to installing tile board in a tub surround, his Master Carpenter apparently had enough of his lack of knowledge and corrected a stupid comment he made. “Guess you are using 2" drywall screws on this?” “No Bob, it’s 1.5.8". Anyone that has sorted a bucket of drywall screws can easily tell the difference between 1.5/8" an 2" screws. Bob once came to Chicago to construct a kiddie playhouse. His staff carpenters spent many hours in building such a thing, only for him to come on site for like a half an hour during filming to “lend a hand.” I know this because I was in charged of installing all the fencing and walkways to the play land and was there while he was there. Who do you think Tim Allen based his show off of? No, I’m not buying tools because of a spokes person, I’m more interested in how they actually last to abuse.

Finally, the shop I currently work for had a Wagner - sort of cordless drill. It was one speed and did not have a removable battery. Kind of reminds me of some of the 7.2v Makita drills I used in a real pinch but at a lot more weight and a much lower gear ratio. This drill was a major joke even for a electrical shop. Don’t know who swiped the drill, but I’m not missing it’s absence. Once the battery got old even a at a lower speed, it didn’t have much torque at all, plus you couldn’t get a fresh battery for it. Overall a useless tool.

Granted, many of these drills are 1980s and 1990s drills that’s about my personal experiences with them. What experiences do all of you have with cordless tools? Any of this help you think about what you are using or will eventually buy? Dispute my choices and views? Really like or dislike something for different reasons? Let’s start a large data base on tool types here starting with this cordless type first as it’s something about everyone will buy or use eventually. Since it will become a major personal investment, I would assume wasting money on it would be a bad thing. It’s also something everyone can comment on.


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## dvsDave

*I favor DeWalts*

I definitely favor my DeWalts.... DeWalts are usually made for construction use as opposed to "around-the-house" drills.... like Black and Decker. I have used DeWalts for 5 years and haven't had one break, bust, or wear out. On the other hand, I've also gone through 4 B&Ds and
3 craftsman. That's my experience with drills. I typically use 14.4v DeWalts because I like the way they balance in my hands.


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## Jo-JotheSoundDog

*drills*

Okay here is my 2 cents on the issue, but I'll try to keep my post shorter than Webster's Unabridged dictionary. I am personnally on my third cordless drill. My first one was a Makita 9.6 volt. I bought it at a garage sale 13 years ago and still works fine. A little under powered by todays standards, but indestuctable. My second was a DeWalt 12 Volt (you know to keep up with the times) After three years I retired it to a dumpster. The battery no longer seated correctly, the chuck would not lock, the brushes were toast, and when I got a repair estimate, I did not find it worth any more investment. I never actually was fond of the feel. And my third is a Bosch 14.4 Volt. I love the weighting and the feel, and I have had no problems with it.

Now here is where I think people should be careful. You have to go out and talk to people at the time you buy your tool. It is amazing how much can change in one years production time. 

My Makita rocked I knew somebody who had the same model, but two years newer and it was a piece of junk, they replaced the hard plastic chuck to a soft rubber. Great for grip, but it had been chewed up all to hell. And for some reason he was frying batteries with his. 

I worked as a TD at one summer stock that had just bought all new Bosch 14.4's about a year and a half before I bought mine. They bought 5 at the beginning of the summer after three months 1 motor was fried 3 chucks were shot and 1's battery wouldn't seat worth a damn.

The next scene shopI worked in had all new DeWalt 18 Volts after one season of use they were all replaced. All of the 7 had been sent in for repairs at least 4 times. Of course it was during that season that I purchased my Bosch after many talks with a sales rep. He told me how they had totally reworked the motor, the gears, the chuck...I was also given a month to give it a test drive. i loved it, I bought it, I recommended it. when the shop replaced all the DeWalts. They went with the Bosch 14.4. After a year only two are working and they have now switched to the Black and Decker Firestorm 14.4(I believe). they love them. They're cheap, but so far they have outlasted DeWalt and Bosch.

So it is very much a case of buyer beware. Company's have a tendency to put out a really good gun get a reputation and then cut back on expenses until people relate the name with junk. And then they start all over again.


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## Mattech

in our theater we use makita. We've used them for as longa as anyone can remember because their batteries are almost completly interchangeable between newer models and all the batteries no matter how old use the same chargers. This makes it easy at the end of the day when we just take out the batteries and put them in any charger. 

Oh and, ship, for people who act and are techies, we use the term "halfbreed" they call them selves "tactors" but thats to easly confused with "techtors" from the techie gosple.


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## TechDirector

Mattech said:


> Oh and, ship, for people who act and are techies, we use the term "halfbreed" they call them selves "tactors" but thats to easly confused with "techtors" from the techie gosple.



Tractor's? Terradactyl's? those are some interesting terms. lol j/p. I've never heard of those before though. interesting.


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## the_marching_penguin

Our crew here in American Fork had preciously been on 9.6v Makitas. While these drills still work they are slow and very frustrating to work with. 3 years ago we bought 4 new 12 v Dewalts. They are like miracle working machines. They could use some more power occasionally and we do have one 14.4 v which works great for that. I dont have a lot of experience on other models but I do know that the 12v DeWalts are wonderful drills and I would highly recomend them.


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## digitaltec

Great to have around the theater but be sure to have at least 5-10 spare batteries on the charger per drill for an 8 hour workday. Otherwise a having cordless drill becomes nothing but a hammer after you run out of battery power.


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## wolf825

digitaltec said:


> Great to have around the theater but be sure to have at least 5-10 spare batteries on the charger per drill for an 8 hour workday. Otherwise a having cordless drill becomes nothing but a hammer after you run out of battery power.



hehe...and when the battery butt is done being a hammer the whole thing makes a great boomerrang to throw in frustration...tho it doesnt return to you unless you hit someone with it and they hurl it back. 

Just got the new upgraded Makita and must say I LIKE its power and torque over my original 14.4 makita... I've had tooo many Dewalts die on me and have had problems with their gearings slip. Milwaulkee--nice tools...

-wolf


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## wemeck

When I started doing theater many moons ago the shops were all Makita shops. Since the late '90s a lot of shops have made the conversion to Dewalt shops. Now the dewalts do not like to be dropped or mishandles as much as the Makitas, but the dewalt made up for it with power.

With regard to battery life we use dewalt super chargers to speed up the recovery of the batteries.


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## miniwyo

In the home I use a Craftsman 19v drill it is ok but I am not really a fan of craftsman It is my our 3rd in 5 years but im not the one who buys it its all my dad. In the Theatre I use a Makita 18v and I love it. That is the most versitile tool I have ever used. Most People in the theatre preder the older thatn dirt Milwakee Corded drills but that 18v makita will do more than the corded drills in less time.

RJ
Rock Springs Wy.


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## soundman

I like new ones becasue the batters last longer Our theaters cordless drills are starting to age to the point where they wont take a full charge, now after you let them charge over night the drills are only good for 4 or 5 2.5 inch screws in tough wood so highly impractical. I like my uncles dewalts and my dads black and deker laugh all you want but it has a nice sold feel to it and it keeps up with a corded drill pretty well.


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## OnWithTheShow

We have 3 Dewalt 14.4v cordless drills similiar to this model:

http://www.homedepot.com/prel80/HDU...dckjgiikmicgelceffdfgidgmk.0&MID=9876&pos=t06

2 of them are 4/5 years old and one is 3 years old. We have never had any problems with them until recently. Both of the older ones now have problems. One always runs like it has a low battery even when the battery is fully charged. I am guessing it is a motor problem but I havent looked at it. The other one has its speed switch (on the top lets you pick the speed between level one and level two) slip out and end up in between which makes the drill run like your car does when it is in neutral. 

We have six batteries with three chargers total for the three drills. We have never had a problem with running out of batteries since the charge time is only an hour.


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## wemeck

I like the DeWalts the best. We have migrated to a all dewalt drill shop.


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## EPACsparkey

Never Use Makitas, I've had a lot of trouble with them. They use plastic gearing (from what I've learned) and they strip extremly easily. I agree wemeck dewalts are the best. But if you want the absolute best in power and durability, just use a corded drill.


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## ship

OnWithTheShow said:


> We have 3 Dewalt 14.4v cordless drills similiar to this model:
> 2 of them are 4/5 years old and one is 3 years old. We have never had any problems with them until recently. Both of the older ones now have problems. One always runs like it has a low battery even when the battery is fully charged. I am guessing it is a motor problem but I havent looked at it. The other one has its speed switch (on the top lets you pick the speed between level one and level two) slip out and end up in between which makes the drill run like your car does when it is in neutral.
> 
> We have six batteries with three chargers total for the three drills. We have never had a problem with running out of batteries since the charge time is only an hour.



It's very possible that your drills are fine - excepting the one with the weak gear shifter. You might look towards new batteries. In general any brand of batteries have a certain amount of charges they can recieve before they just don't hold a charge anymore. On a DeWalt gun, that's a life of about three years for me, possibly longer for others. The all need a service call but you should get about a 4 hour charge out of a 14.4v DeWalt battery for at least the first two to three years under average use.

Also, since your batteries no longer have a memory chip in them (a bad idea from Makita at one point during the early 1990s) and as uniformly stated in just about all manuals, do not run the batteries out. Or at least this is not necessary unless you are not planning to use them for a few months such as packing them up for the summer. While it does not do a lot of damage to the battery to run it out, it can damage the tool in doing so, and overheat the battery so it can't take the full charge. 

Another option to extend battery life is to get the NiMH batteries instead of the NiCad ones. They don't have the umpth of the nicad but have a longer lifespan and charge holding power. A further note is to invest in fast chargers such as the 15 minute chargers. For some reason on charging batteries, the longer you take to charge them up, the more it destroys the battery while doing so - probably also another heat issue.

In a nutshell, that's it, probably old batteries unless you have phase harmonics problems which is it's own story.

On the drill slipping between gears, I have that on my favorite drill at the moment. It's time to get it in for service. All tools for a school should see a service center at least every other year if you want them to keep working properly. For me it was once every six months as a carpenter and that's why I have the same drill from about 1993 plus a second drill to use while it was in the shop.

On batteries for two 14.4v drills, one flash light, one saw and one right angle drill, I probably have 4 batteries left out of like 16 in the last 10 years. They wear out granted at one point I had 10 of them at the same time.


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## Mayhem

Cannot argue that DeWalt are the cream of the crop. However, Black & Decker are actually made by DeWalt and I must admit that for their price, I have not been able to fault them. I have recently purchased the 14.4V Firestorm (Model # FSD142K-2) which has a really cool feature. 

The chuck is removable leaving a standard hex drive, which accepts most driver bits. This enables you to drill and screw without having to change bits. After putting up panell sections in the workshop I find it hard to imagine having to use 2 drills again. In Australia it came with 2 batteries, charger and case.

http://www.blackanddecker.com/ProductGuide/ProductDetail.aspx?PID=4522


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## HMOcidalmaniac

i have a 12v MAKITA, pistol grip and mushroom style batteries-
i have owned this bit of gold for nigh on 10 years now and it hasn't failed me yet-
it hasn't had to have any repairs at all and was about 200 dollars at a Home Depot in Salt Lake City Utah


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## Mayhem

Just thought that I would add to my previous post as I think that it wasn't as helpful as it may have been.

In essence, my choice (the 14.4V Black & Decker Firestorm) was based on price range, on different opinions of sales people in various shops (I tend to look for trends in advice) and options. There were a couple of drills that were all priced in the similar range and in the 14.4V category. The Firestorm also comes as an 18V drill, which was the same price as the 14.4V. However, the 14.4V came with a second battery. For me, this was a very attractive offer and with the removable chuck, was the selling point.

The removable chuck for me set the Firestorm above the other drills as much of the work I do involves drilling and screwing at the same time. Especially when you need to get something in place before drilling the remaining holes. Secondly, the extra battery was the basis for my decision between the 14.4V and the 18V version. I don’t know why it is (well I do) but undoubtedly, I will get half way through an important job and the battery will die. When I am just pottering and filling in time, the battery never dies! Anyway, now I can have one in the charger and one in the drill when I know I have a lot of work to do. I always use either my corded drill or my drill press for heavy drilling and so the cordless is only used for light work and driving screw or hex head self drillers (both wood and metal).

The other point is that I do not use my drill day-in, day-out and in fact, there are times when I don’t use it for days. So it comes down to what you want to do with it and obviously this differs from individual to individual.


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## wolf825

FWIW, I own the Makita 14.4 I purchased right when they came out, and now the new 18v... Both rock--and I love the feel and gearing on the 18v. The Dewalts my friends have I have used in the past have had problems--gears slip, batteries were good but the chucks sucked and slipped--but do not on the Makita's. While I like teh feel of the grip on teh Dewalts--I prefer the reliability I have experienced with the Makita's over the DeWalts. Thats my experiences...

-wolf


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## Will

I have a Ryobi 14.4 volt. has a nice balance. I have for years resisted going to 18 volt. They are good for carpenters who may be running screws through 2 bys but 14.4 is plenty of power for most theatrical applications. I have used 24 volts, but at this point, get out the corded and the extension cord, unless you're interested in building up your forearms and wrists.

Started out with the original Makitas, 20 years ago, but find the newer battery designs superior. Actually remember driving screws with a Yankee, if any of the old-timers remember that.


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## ship

Oh’ yea! Tanks for the memories... Had my own origional Makita 9.6v HD model, it’s still coming to mind as one of the best cordless tools ever produced, and it died the most glorious of deaths as a sendoff. Kind of whish I still had it today. Who needs variable speed, my finger on the trigger is just as effective. Plus their jiggsaw and flashlights that came out later were not that bad. But before that I knew the days before drywall screws and how to keep your fingers out of the Yankee - or at least learned how to. Thanks for the memories. Still I like my 14.4v pistol grip DeWalt Hammer Drill. Very used to it probably in being similar to a screw shooter type drill or the old Makita I moved up from. Pistol Grip drills are not the best for everyone however. Very different balance for starters. The drill does not stand up on it’s battery, instead you balance it on it’s trigger literally and you use your middle or ring finger on the trigger.

Given this, I’m glad to see more people’s impute on their tools. I have my magnetic/quick release 1/4" chuck adaptor for my keyless chuck thus don’t need to remove the chuck to swap between bits for woodwork. But still, the fact others attest to Black and Deckers, and Ryobi’s getting better says a lot to improvements made in the last 5 years which helps to keep me fresh on them. They might no longer be the low end gear I had thought they were on my posting before. Granted especially since the chuck on my DeWalt is about ready for it’s 3rd or 4th replacement in about ten years of use. That’s given heavy usage and normally on or rubbing up against steel these days however. At times it’s time to get out the Channel Loc’s to remove the drill bit, at least it’s not slipping at that point. On the other hand, give the new ratcheting chucks a try. Very nice, Hope they come in ½" size when I do replace it. As most hint at, play test well the tools you will buy unless you have the cash to sometimes get good stuff, other times get what won’t work out for you. Plastic gears are common to may tools, and you won’t know until the gear fails. That is if it fails, plastic has come a long way in the past years and can be just as useful as aluminum or steel gears you will also find that also strip out with abuse. Those attesting to their “low end gear” are making a statement that perhaps even the Low End has caught up to the “high ticket” gear while they were sleeping, and the differences might be slight these days. Might be the operative word and something each needs to play test and decide upon. Best tool for your money might be better phrased as best tool for your use of it. Hope it helps.


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## ship

I am not above correction, please do so we are all in the same boat. My opinions was based upon what I have read in articles about cordless drill battery chargers on the subject but would also tend to think that a slower charge is better for the battery given heat.


At the time I wrote these notes I was not steadily following citing sources but it's direct in quote in any case:

Battery Pack efficiency: 12 v. =1700 mA-h High Endurance. (Bosch Cordless, 1995 Cat. #45920)
Nickel Metal Hydride (Ni-MH) batteries are about to hit the open market also, they boast 30% longer run time than normal Nickel Cadium types and less weight.



The higher the Ah rating a battery has the more energy it can store and thus the more work it can do. 2.2 Ah NiMH is better than 2.0 Ni-Cad. 1.3 to 1.5 Ah Nicad batteries are common on low end and older model drills. 1.7 Ah is the standard to most cordless drills designed within the last five years, and 2.0 Ah is common to new drill designs or companies which specialize in or advertise their batteries as much as their drills. - . (American Woodworker 1999 Buyer’s Guide, “Cordless Drills” p 72-79) or 
(Wood Magazine, “12 Volt Cordless Drills” Dec. 1999 p.72-77)



Chargers are 1 hour , 15 and 12 minute in charging time. Note: Most Batteries no-longer have memory chips in them, so it is not necessary to “run the charge out of a battery” before charging it, unless the battery is going into storage for a few months without being used. Also the faster the charger the better or more potent the charge the battery will receive. Leaving batteries in a charger is also okay for frequent use purposes, in most cases, it will not hurt the battery, and will receive frequent charges to keep it at its maximum potential. There is also a backpack mounted battery on the market for those who never want to change batteries. Chargers are available in car charger and multi-bay types also. Most modern chargers will also charge any voltage of battery under the same brand name and style. Some chargers are marketed to charge any type or brand of battery, this could simplify things greatly in shops with many different brands and styles of batteries in use in that round pegs will hopefully not be put into square holes by novice carpenters any longer, given they are put in - in the right direction.
Batteries: Ni-Cad, & A-H Hi-Capacity with Power Display (Supposed to have 25% more capacity)




NiMH Batteries: Ever since the 1950s, nickel cadmium (Ni-Cad) cells have been the battery of choice for portable rechargeable applications. And over the years, Ni-Cad cells of the “sub C” size used in power tools have improved to the point where they can store about 2.0 amp hours (Ah) of energy. But only small, incremental improvements will come in the future. Because of this energy-storage limitation, as well as environmental concerns about cadmium, battery makers developed nickel-metal hydride (NiMH) cells about 
10 years ago. These batteries can theoretically hold about 40% more energy than NiCads, according to our sources at Energizer Power Systems, a U.S. based manufacturer of MiMH batteries. Our cordless-drill test included one drill with a MiMH battery pack with a 2.2 Ah capacity, but you will see mor NiMH batteries in the future. Several companies have hinted at having 3.0 Ah batteries soon. So why haven’t all manufacturers switched completely to MiMH? In a word, cost. NiMH batteries cost more than Ni-Cads, and manufacturers tell us their research shows that consumers may not be willing to pay significantly more for something as intangible as additional run time. (Almost 50% as much in price) to this end, which would sell better a $45 or $75.00 battery. Of course, with the proliferation of NiMH batteries, prices for them should come down. For example, cellular phones nad laptop computers used to be powered by NiCads, but now nearly all of them run on NiMH or lithiumion batteries. (Don’t expect lithium-ion batteries in cordless power tools any time soon; they store lots of energy, but dispense it in doses too small for power tools.) 
(Wood Magazine, “What’s With These New Nickel-Metal Hydride Batteries?” Dec. 1999 p.88)

Temperature and Ni-Cad or Ni-MH Batteries: the batteries are themselves not effected by temperature unless it is in the absolute extremes. They may run a bit sluggish on start-up when cold, but under use should warm up and be fine. In warm conditions, operating and discharging does not effect the battery the biggest challenge for either type of battery is in getting it to accept a full charge when it has been subjected to extreme temperature. Batteries charge best between 45 and 85 degrees to accept a full charge. If it has been in a temperature other than this let it cool down or warm up first. (Also be ware of “Rifle Sweat” problems when a battery or any really cold tool is brought into the warmth, and also the brittle ness of plastic under these conditions. In addition to extreme physical problems, the extreme temperatures of heat can be multiplied by the heat generated by a charging tool or running/working battery, and the tool and battery can suffer from melt-down easier in warm temperatures if dirty, (vents and cooling mechanism clogged, or over-used). Many of the current generation of chargers have thermostats which will prevent charging until the battery is cool enough. Otherwise if it charges outside the range, it will not accept a full charge. (American How To, May 1999 “Expert Answers”by Hal Handy. p.90)


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## __WWW__

I have a 12 volt black and decker, it works good, we have some other ones in the scene shop, a few Dewalt there good and a gray i think craftsman 12 volt but it dosent stop spinning when you let off the trigger and its so annoying when your trying to screw fast.


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## soundman

The shop I am at now is fairly cordless I think we have two corded drills total. The problem is today we took apart a bunch of hollywood flats so we werent moving that much and it was rather pointless to have cordless drills. The downside is the whole shop is only on one breaker that is in a hard place to get to so only one tool at a time.


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## sallyj

*Cordless Drills*

My shop uses DeWalt 14.4v, but we are about to change over to 18 volt. We switched from Makita in 1998, and these DeWalts have since been beat. We have replaced all the batteries twice, and at this point it will only cost two to three hundred more to just get new ones. After much discussion amongst ourselves, we have decided that we are ready for the heavier ones. The old ones are starting to need more TLC and maintenence (My carpenter usually does maintainence on them annually or if they break he fixes them. He is a good tool mechanic). I am used to the t handle type grip. My biggest complaint about the 14.4vs is that the batts are almost too big for me to get my hand around them to release them from the handle. I am a girl but my hands aren't that small. The 18v, which I own personally, has a different release design and it is not a problem for me. Our cordless system also includes the recip saw and a trim saw, both which work pretty well, considering how much we over- use them.
I do miss the old Makita 6012HD and..the other one with the brake. I own one of those as well, but my 12 year old batteries fianlly wore out. I may replace them someday.

SJM


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## sallyj

Will said:


> I have used 24 volts, but at this point, get out the corded and the extension cord, unless you're interested in building up your forearms and wrists.




I have this great vision that the voltages will get larger and larger til someday we willl be wheeling around a huge power source to power these tools, attatched with ...an extension cord!  Sort of like coming full circle.

SJM


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## ship

It's been a few years, but right about the time that belt fed automatic screw gun adaptors became available to mount of a DeWalt cordless drill so you never had to reach down to put another screw on the tip again, also came out the battery backup back pack. This allowed you to plug in a bunch of batteries into the back pack sufficient that you would never run out of power in a day. Duluth Trading used to sell it though I did not see it tonight any longer available.

What ever the case, just remember that even if you can better grip the battery of a 18v drill, those extra battery cells in the battery pack also add up to extra weight you are trying to hold up and carry around in a work day. I know a lot of people with them new fangled 18 and more volt drills that have this very complaint. 14.4v for me has worked in weight and battery life well over the years even given no matter the voltage of the battery you will still need to replace it every three to four years. This given I believe I'm on my 14th or 16th battery now for the ten year old DeWalt system granted I have the saw, a second cordless drill of a different version, a flash light and right angle drill for the system necessitating at least four batteries if not more to make the system useful.

In any case, the only reason I would go with 18v in my case would be to get the cordless jiggsaw or Sawzall. Since I already have both on a cord, and don't need to do much cutting off a ladder anymore, either with a cord suite me fine otherwise. Hope such thoughts about weight are useful.


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## EntRigger

*DeWalt*

to me the DeWalt or Hilti cordless drills are the bes i use my deWalt 18v all the time i use it to drill new holes in steel for toe clips to sscrewing wood or other matterials toghter. and the dewalt is very durriable. so students in a school or profissionals can use it.


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## sallyj

*Cordless Drills*

We might end up really hating the extra weight. But it is something both my boss and the shop have given alot of thought to. Being that I am more management, I don't usually hold a drill for long periods of time. We do use our trim saw and recip saw an awful lot although we do have corded ones. At strike, the more saws the merrier!  

SJM


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## rgsw

dewalt 18v no question


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## jorno67

I've had my Dewalt 12v for 9 years and all ever needed to do was replace old batteries once.


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## avkid

i have a black and decker 9.5 volt and a craftsman with versapak i think also 9, the former ld at school who also works at Sears bought a 19.2 volt combo pack with a drill, a huge flourescent lamp and a saw it is really powerful!


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## bigbaldhead

I've used quite a few different guns in various shops and theatres. Most of the 'equipped' shops that I've worked in use DeWalts primarily with a few random Makitas or B&D's that have been left behind over the years. I was really surprised when I went to work at my first commercial scene shop (where you are pretty much expected to bring all of your own tools) to find that there was no clear preference among the carps. While there were probably more guys with DeWalts than other individual brands, there were so many more brands out there and very few of the more experienced guys used DeWalts. I saw a lot of Bosch and Porter Cable guns as well as quite a few Milwaukees and Panasonics...and then there was the one guy with a Hilti. So, I got to use quite a number different brands and models, one of which was a Ridgid, of which I'd had very little experience and had heard next to nothing. I found that I liked the weight and feel of it very, very much, even more than the Hilti; the power and especially the brake were very impressive as well. I was nervous though about buying a brand about which I knew so little, so, in the end I gave myself three options (based mostly on local availability, price, and personal preference), all roughly the same price that I wanted to look into further (all 14.4v), the Ridgid(3/8"), the DeWalt(3/8"), and the Milwaukee(1/2") with the reversible battery. I really thought that I was going to go with the Milwaukee. The DeWalt was the easiest for me to exclude, based simply on the fact that I still work in primarily DeWalt shops and I wanted an easily identifiable gun. After I had pared it down to the two, and was standing in the store I'd pulled out the Milwaukee and was ready to pay, when a nagging feeling came over me. I had added the Ridgid to my list because I could find very little that I disliked about it. I had no problems with the Milwaukee, but I still liked the feeling of the Ridgid in my hand much more, so why was I going to buy the Milwaukee, because I thought that it was a more respected brand? I didn't actually know that it was. I just felt in my gut that the Ridgid was the right gun for me; and to make a long story only slightly longer, I bought the Ridgid and haven't been disappointed. It fits me, the control is great and the battery life is comparable to or better than any of the other guns I've worked with, and it can take a fall too. I'll have to wait and see about long term battery life, but after 8 mos., I've had no issues whatsoever. All around great gun.


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## ship

Cordless Drills
Welcome to the forum, where are you working - I used to be a Carp here for a few companies also.
Thanks also for the review on the Ridgid and Milwaukee tools, I am yet to play test the Ridgid thus for me at least it’s useful to know about the ergodynamics of their line. What model number was it and given 14.4v I assume it was a T-Handle type? I would assume a 400/1,400 variable speed rating as normal. Something further to study is if they are manufacturing the tool or having someone like Roybi make them for them. Craftsman used to or still has Roybi do this. Roybi makes a lot of other brands of power tool if not Skil another leader in making other people’s products. I know Ridgid and Home Depot are arm and arm just as True Value Hardware and Skil are arm and arm, just can’t remember what I read about the initial Ridgid table saw product launch/partnership with Home Depot. Funny, went to Home Depot looking for a Ridgid pipe wrench - a thing the company is known for in quality and could not find a one, yet they have the power tools. Will have rather’d the pipe wrenches as opposed to something with China as a brand but such is the downgrading of Home Depot’s offerings of late.

Of late, Home Depot for me is seriously going down hill in product offerings and quality in a way Builder’s Square did, than Menards followed once Builder’s was not in competition. Can’t wait for a local Lowes given some quality still on their part. I also question “home brands” in general with the exception of the Ace Hardware brand (Probably made by S&K or Allen) that has every bit the product support as Craftsman. I keep getting these broken ½" drive Huskey socket wrenches used for tightening truss bolts sent to me. We buy Craftsman, but on the road, crew chiefs buy what ever is available. In any case, they break but have a full warranty as normal to most brands of tool. Problem is either that model number which is breaking is discontinued or it’s constantly out of stock - something not unusual at Home Depot anymore in having empty shelves at my local branch. After you wait in line for exchange approval, you can’t exchange something Huskey unless it’s the same thus I have at least three wrenches in the trunk of my car waiting for the moment I can replace them. Can’t decide if it’s discontinued or out of stock, too many empty slots on the shelf. Constant empty slots and things they used to carry but no longer do. Used to have all kinds of Klien tools, now just a few at best and normally locked up.

In any case, I know what you mean about a almost randomness to carps having their own tool preferences. Haitachi along with Panasonic make some darned good tools I would say also. They were designed for the electronics industry in line use but have a definate home with the Carpenters. My largest selling point in figuring out what brand to buy besides at the time I bought into DeWalt it was the only brand on the market with now normal improvements was that given the shop was also DeWalt, or at least this was the main brand used. I bought into this system 10 or 12 years ago when DeWalt was the only one with fresh innovations in quality for a second generation tool after the Makita initial development most copied. In any case, with DeWalt I have found that if I run out of fresh batteries, I am not stuck without power because if nothing else, I could pop a shop 12v battery into my 14.4v drill and go at it if not borrow from any number of sources. Are you finding a lot of shops are sticking to the 12v battery DeWalt drills or have most gone up to 14.4v now? Not a huge amount of carps I expect at this point are using a larger drill than 14.4v - too much weight, or has this changed also? Been going on six years now since I was a Carp thus I don’t know what is the current trends. 

DeWalt early on - before the other brands also had lots of other tools I could use the same battery system for before other brands came out with similar products. I have four tools and at one point 10 batteries and five chargers for them. Now I have two batteries and two from the shop intended for my use. When I run out of power, I wander over to the carp/repair area and swipe some more batteries still. This is the advantage using similar brands has. Granted now the 14.4v system is with the exception of the new three speed T-Handle (an excellent tool) not coming out with anything new for 14.4v. No cordless jiggsaw on the market as could be useful, I think 14.4v is on it’s way out in popularity. Too many 18 to 24v home owners out there looking for more power. 

For the most part, this sharing of batteries was a major advantage to me in that there was lots of them around and they were easily replaced. Also each battery is stamped with a date meaning within a year if it goes bad, you don’t need a receipt to exchange it for a new one. There was one lot number of battery that had a improved design flaw about it which made them fall apart quickly. Easily replaced. Given how many dealers sell their tool, it’s also an easy replacement. I normally marked both my tool and battery so at the end of the day I could get back my own thus theft was not much an issue. On this issue of warranty, finding a repair shop that will do warranty work on Haitachi, Panasonic, Ridgid and other brands however can be a challenge. You might have to send it in for repair and maintenance if you don’t want to void the warranty.

Milwaukee was just bought out recently. Big question about if the company will remain in it’s high status or if it will become the next DeWalt in the industry. Their corded drills and SawZall is already an industry leader much like DeWalt’s heavy power tools were highly respected at the time Black & Decker bought them out. Defiantly something to watch. I always liked the Milwaukee power tool, had some concerns about reversible battery packs in contacts not in use being exposed to the elements, but they were very nice drills. Especially liked the clip on flash light for them as a major selling feature.

Here is the article if helpful:
By RICK BARRETT
[email protected]
Posted
Posted: Aug. 30, 2004
Milwaukee Electric Tool Corp., a maker of power tools for construction professionals, is being sold to a Hong Kong tool company as part of a package valued at nearly $627 million.


Milwaukee Electric Tool is based in Brookfield and has about 375 employees in the Milwaukee area. For now, at least, the company's Brookfield employment will not be affected by the sale, company officials said Monday.
Previously announced plans to transfer a small number of remaining manufacturing jobs from Brookfield to a Milwaukee Electric Tool plant in Greenwood, Miss., will continue, the company said in a conference call with journalists.
The company will keep its Brookfield headquarters and will continue to focus on product development here, said Dan Perry, Milwaukee Electric Tool president and chief executive officer.
The toolmaker is being sold to Techtronic Industries Co., the Hong Kong maker of Ryobi tools and Homelite garden care products.
The sale includes Milwaukee Electric Tool's sister company, Atlas Copco Electric Tools, a German toolmaker. Both companies are being sold by Atlas Copco AB, of Sweden, which has owned Milwaukee Electric Tool since 1995.
Earlier this year, Atlas Copco AB said it was selling its electric tool business after it had not reached the goal of being No. 1 or No. 2 in its markets, which include competitors such as U.S.-based Black & Decker Corp. and Bosch GmbH of Germany.
The conglomerate said there were limited synergies between electric tools and its other industrial-product businesses.
Techtronic, which makes Craftsman tools for Sears, Roebuck & Co., stands to gain from buying Milwaukee Electric Tool because the Brookfield company is well-positioned in sales of power tools to building contractors and other professional users.
Techtronic wanted the company's distribution network as well as its products, said Bob Freitag, president of Techtronic Industries' North American Hardware Group based in Anderson, S.C.
"It gives us a lot of ammunition to be more competitive," he said.
Techtronic, originally a maker of cordless tools for other companies, bought brands such as Ryobi, Homelite and Dirt Devil vacuum cleaners to increase its profit margin and gain ability to set prices.
Techtronic boosted profit at acquired companies, such as vacuum cleaner-maker Royal Appliance Manufacturing Co., by shifting production to China from higher-wage locations.
Combined, Milwaukee Electric Tool and Atlas Copco Electric Tool had sales of about $700 million last year. Operating profit for the two companies was $49.8 million for 2003, Atlas Copco AB said.
In the mid-1990s, Milwaukee Electric Tool had more than 800 employees in the Milwaukee area, including manufacturing employment. The 80-year-old company makes drills, saws, grinders and other tools and has factories in Mississippi and a plant in Mexico.
Techtronic will assume $86 million in pension liabilities for 3,100 workers, which it will subtract from its payment to Atlas Copco AB.
The pension obligations are payable over 20 years and are tax deductible, Techtronic said.
Bloomberg News contributed to this report.


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## OldGrover

My thoughts as a random carpenter/tech guy. Since I do community theatre, we don't have a shop (most building either happens at some random location scrounged by the carpenter or TD or actually on the stage) nor do we have any company tools. What this means is that I'm bringing my own stuff over, which means I don't spend any serious money on them, as things have a tendancy to get abused or to wander away.

Personally, I go with the 18V cordless drills. I buy the cheapest reasonable one I can find with dual batteries and find that as long as one battery is charging at all times, I never run out of juice. I'm a big guy, though, I know my wife and smaller people have trouble with the weight on the 18v drills - find something that fits you nicely.

I consider them essentially disposable - it is actually cheaper to buy a new drill then to, for instance, replace the batteries or the charger, assuming you're buying at a home depot or similar. Given how often my chargers take a walk, that's enough for me  And at 70-80 bucks per, it isn't worth getting bent out of shape over and guarrantees I always have relatively new batteries  

I expend my tool tracking energy on the expensive stuff - the saws, the socket set, the compressor, the nailgun... the stuff that clears 150 bucks a shot. I've only got so much attention to devote to keeping track o' stuff.

-OG


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## TechWench

Im personally all about my *DeWalt cordless 14.4 volt*. it does the job quite well. 

 

peace!


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## techieman33

i owned a 16.8v craftsman drill, and i loved it, it fit well in my hand, weighed about right, and was tough as hell, i dropped it from about 15ft. on several occasions, and it kept right on working. It's still at my old high school somewhere. 
as for the firestorms with the removable chucks, i don't like them at all, when there off the drill is very unbalanced, and i don't like that at all, i would rather use the craftsman countersink bits, the bit itself actually flips 180, it's easier, and you don't have to hold on to an extra piece.


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## Sombra2

i have a dewalt which is very good, and it amazing that it manufactored by black and decker, even though it the higher quality. I accidentally went through a metal piece behind some wood in my attic to run a wire through. I didn't realize it until i took a closer look.


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## GlassMan

*Hitachi tools*

Does anyone have any experience or know someone that has used the 18 volt hitachi cordless? I personnaly use an 18volt DeWalt XRP and love it, but know many that have have bad luck. But as earlier posts have said, the whole tool issue is hit and miss at best because this years great model is not next years.


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## PATech

Up until last year my school's drills were all Dewalt. This school year we are replacing the Dewalts with Panasonics as the Dewalts die. So far we are at 3 and 3. The Dewalts had a really good life-span of about 5 years, but the triggers have been failing it seems. 

By the way the Panasonics are wonderful. They're powerful, well balanced, and actually brake when you release the trigger. The only problem that I can find is that they use a circle with an arrow diagram to designate forward and reverse which can be confusing, unlike the Dewalts which just had a straight arrow.

All the best.


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## freshmantech

*Hitachi and DeWalt all the way*

i've been working both at home and in school on construction quite extensively. My first "drill" was one of those B&D screwers...the little 2 volt ones that set in a charger and look like...well...a long rod. That was retired to a dumpster when i tried goin through some actual wood. My second drill was a craftsman 14.4 drill. I was extatic at the time but within a year it's batteries (both of them) were failing and the charger took...a gentle touch to get it to work. 

I recomend a Hitachi 14.4 drill for EVEYRTHING. It is powerful, cheap, and has yet to fail after 4 years now. My high school (upon my request) now has 2 and i own one at home as well.

DeWalt will always be god. The 18 and now 18+ series' of DeWalt drills are amazing both in their durability and power but lack in the "affordable" range. My only complaint about these incredable bright yellow devices is their price tag. If anyone could tell me where to get an 18v yellow devil for under 100, i'm all ears!


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## OldGrover

I'm coming from a different perspective then most of you (being someone who is 30, works full time (not in theatre) and thus probably has more disposable income) but I honestly can't see getting that attached to a cordless drill. Mine get lent, dropped, used as hammers, drowned, you name it (in general, not by me). So I just buy the cheapest 18v one I can and don't cry when it needs replacing.

There are tools I care about, but drills just are expendible 

-OG


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## freshmantech

*not attached :-(*

i guess it is your perspective on it. I would much rather use our 18 v dewalt than a 14.4 skill...there are senority "wars" before strike at our school as to who gets the dewalt...i usually end up winning as being the senior technician...but well, a drill becomes meaningful if it is used enough.

-Michael

ps. YOU DROWN YOUR DRILLS - MURDERER!!!


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## OldGrover

*grins* /I/ didn't drown my drill. Nor did I use it as a hammer. I just decided that going ballistic on the person that did wasn't worth it. Stress leads to an early grave 

Now.. if they'd chosen to drown my new air compressor or dropped my lovely sliding compound mitre saw or... THOSE I would have gotten ticked about!

-OG


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## ship

He he he! I as a pro in the industry would choose the 14.4v over any 18v tool no matter the brand at a drop of a hat.

Perhaps check E-Bay and see how many 18v tools people want to sell off verses those having the lighter weight 14.4v tools on the market. 18 to 24v much less backpack is good if building a cabin in a forest without power around, fact is that if you run out of batteries on a 14.4v tool in normal usage, you are a special person. The 14.4v tool has more than enough power and most I talk to having these tools once they get beyond the matcho 18v part of it, regret having bought such things given it's extra weight that in using it all days long five days a week, really is not something to be swinging around.

While out of practice in the carp. trades, I would still expect those still doing so still laugh at those all too more power types coming in with 18v tools than complaining they are too heavy by the end of the day.

If of any help, my DeWalt #996 cordless pistol grip hammer drill has after earlier this year having had a new chuck, trigger and motor popped into it for $150.00 plus, now gone back into the repair shop for a new clutch. Given the thing is about 10 years old now and does not have much of the origional parts, it's well paid off itself at about $245.00 at the time.

This given for me at least a pistol grip version of a cordless tool is the only tool I will use given even a 14.4v backup T-Handle drill as my spare, or the shop owned three gear speed versions that in at least options are better than all. Still for me at least the pistol grip.

What ever the case, I have never met someone that uses such things for a living liking the extra weight given they have also used the 14.4v to compare with. Sure if you don't know better, more power wins out over extra weight, but until you compare, no contest in my opinion.

So given the first repair shop can't fix the discontinued model, I'm faced with the choice of sending it to a DeWalt repair shop that will do a $99.00 maximum repair to it in what costs more even for older drills, won't be charged. Something most companies in drill don't offer. This or in buying the next generation in cordless 14.5v hammer drill for another $145.00 and at least giving away the other only needing another $99.00 worth of repair than being almost brand new in other parts installed otherwise.

One can read into this as they wish about the need for a DeWalt or how much it costs for me to maintian something I like useing on a daily basis, but in the end, both the DeWalt 14.4 has well paid itself off and the pistol grip for me at least in being classically trained in holding a drill is much more comfortable. It's a testiment that ten years later I am debating fixing the old tool or replacing it given daily usage of it.


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## OldGrover

Heh. I'm a big guy with big hands and given the usage I do, I really like the 18's. I've never had any problems with weight, even after using it all day, and it can run all day without a recharge, which is nice. And it can handle drilling into cement and masonry without sucking its battery dry, which is also handy for me more then occasionally (not in the theatre, at home)

*shrugs* Everyone has to find the tools that work best for them, I guess. Expendable 18V drills do so for me 

-OG


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## ship

Agreed in different strokes and no disrespect to your finding use in the 18v.


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## OldGrover

And besides.. it is funny watching tiny little actors trying to use it! 

I have to take my amusement where I can.

-OG


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## theaterscout

My shop uses 2 Makita 14.4 v cordless drills, 2 Dewalt 12 v cordless drills, and 1 Dewalt corded drill. The Dewalts we have had for about 6 years but they are starting to show their age as they won't hold a charge for a long time and one of the batteries is shot. The Makitas we have had for about 4 1/2 years and they still work great considering the abuse that they have gone through.
We also have a couple really, really, really, old corded drills that I cannot even come up qwith a name brand for, but what they lack in style the make up for in power and tons of torque.


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## agave

I've built about two dozen sets, a garage, and tons of other stuff with my factory refurbished 18volt DeWalt and have never had one lick of trouble. Our shop used Makitas for years, switched to Porter Cable for a few years till all the batteries went to hell and then switched to 14.4v DeWalts and have had no trouble with them other than one with a faulty chuck which I have to find time to dismantle.


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## ship

I'm thinking that the question of battery in rating a cordless drill should be of seperate question and not really have a bearing on one's opinion of a drill. All normal cordless tool batteries have a limited lifespan - normally about 3 years with constant use. I have 3.6v Panasonic cordless screw drivers that have half that life yet. At that point the battery is the cause, you simply replace the batteries and as long as there is not a flaw in the tool design, and it's been maintained it should work properly again. That's about $45.00 worth of a new battery as opposed to what about $200 on average for a new drill? Batteries typically also have a one year warranty on them. If it dies, you return it for a replacement. (Save your recipts.)

Just finished spending about $350.00 over a period of about six months on my far above 14.4v cordless DeWalt pistol grip hammer drill to make it run. First one thing broke than another, this time requiring a new motor and other parts, A third time for a part that's discontinued. The Authorized service center was not able to fix it.

As a last chance, I sent it to a Black & Decker / DeWalt service center for their $100.00 maximum charge - no matter what's needed and they were not only able to get the discontinued clutch - given six weeks in the shop, but most of the rest of the parts on the drill including now a third motor were also replaced. I was hoping they would just give me a credit on a new drill but instead there are more new parts on this thing than origional ones. Should have sent it there in the first place and pocketed the $250.00 I wasted at another repair shop.

Given it was only about a month between the first and second manfunction, I still credit that - "what you didn't notice this" or problem the second time around with the repair shop but still paid it given those guys do this for a living just as I wire fixtures for a living and seem to know what I'm doing. That first repair shop had no warranty thus I paid more still in just hoping to get my favorite drill back. Could have been a new problem not noticed - it is old and well broken in after all. Than again, it took with the DeWalt shop more than just six weeks to get the drill back. The first time I went to pick it up I noted a gear selector switch problem it did not used to have. Normally it should just drop into gear. This "repaired" tool had way too much slop in doing so and would not stay in gear dependibly. Seems a new repair tech had "fixed it", and the shop's Master Tech once the problem was noted now had to repair the problem given the parts in stock were not suited for the drill in me doing the repair. Nothing new for a new tech to send slop out the door, just new that such inspection of their work passed by the eyes of the "old salt."

Thing is, when a tool does not function as designed, that expense can at times be much cheaper to repair than buying a new drill. I'm sure many tool companies will either give a credit or have a maximum repair price. I note a "factory referbishshed tool" sticker above and on my own Bosh Jigsaw which works as if new even if cheaper in cost given it's used. If you are a pro, you do factoryspec. work and the tool will be in perfect running condition. - good source by way of factory repair center them referbished tools. Given the old drill now also has full warranty coverage again, it for all intensive purposes is a new drill for $100.00 instead of $245 for a new version of it. Granted the $250.00 wasted was more a mistake in sending it to the wrong place.

This new/old drill even has a new break on it's motor that the old one never had. That bit stops almost instantly in saving the motor from damage. It very much is a brand new drill.

Six years ago I had about 10 or 12 cordless 14.4v DeWalt batteries for five tools using those batteries. Over the years, those batteries have died out and been replaced. I now have about four within one year old batteries but don't use the tools as much. There is also another four of the similar type in the shop I can pull from should I run out of juice. 

Standardization is the key. Two batteries often will not be enough especially once they get older - short of Lithium (available as an option with some brands) which will last longer but have less power overall. If you have a standard battery in the shop, you always have power. 

The shop just bought a Bosh 14.4v cordless drill. I'm pissed that someone did so. It's an excellent cordless drill and could be a good standard for the shop, but given we are already DeWalt, it was a poor choice. Seems Menards has stopped selling DeWalt equipment and as opposed to just going to Home Depot, the person buying it recognized the standardized battery problem but was too lazy to go the extra two miles down the road. Now as opposed to two "fresh" batteries put into the shop cordless tool battery system - given some are no doubt reaching the end of their life, we now will need to buy fresh batteries for the shop tools and three years from now buy more batteries for the Bosh as something that's not standardized.

I hope that the above two points clear up some confusion I see between the tool and the battery, much cost effectiveness of replacing tools with getting them repaired. Certainly at some point - given I had already spent $250 on the DeWalt, it would be cheaper to purchase a new one, but were it only $100.00 with full warranty this than will have been much more cost effective than the new tool. On batteries, it's a given they will wear out. That's just the price of using them. If your tool is not to be used for three months you need to discharge the battery. If shorter than that, but not used every day, take it out of the charger. Leaving a battery in a charger for more than a week is not as healthy as one might think over a extended period of time. After that, if used every day, you simply have to replace the things every few years.

Since the mid-1990's, there is yet to be a major improvement beyond three gear selectivity for speed on power tools. The older tools still work the same as new ones. Replacing because they don't work so well seems to me more a sympliclistic view of not understanding the investment you have. Go back to earlier "Top Gun" drills and others such as some origional versions of the Makita, and there were some serious design flaws with both clutch and speed selector. Most more modern tools have these problems solved along with the thermal cut off switches, and chip memories on the batteries taken out which were from Hell on some tools from a cetain era. 

No you don't have to completely discharge your batteries any longer no matter what brand unless cheap crap say from Wagner, in order to ensure it will get a full charge. Have I mentioned this point enough? - Constantly finding people doing the velcro strap around the trigger in following some1990's inner chip mythology still alive about battery memories - given they even understand the necessity of why they do so.

If your battery is reaching the end of it's usefulness, you can try discharging it, but most likely it's a natural battery type of not holding as good of a charge type of thing and nothing to do with somewhere between the charger and battery out thinking you in only providing as much charge as that battery was charged for last time.

By the way, my 14.4v. DeWalt T-Handle is about 13 years old now and has been back to the shop perhaps four times - but only for a more or less yearly maintinence. It's the spare drill for when the other is in the shop or I need a higher gear to torque ratio. My other about 12 year old 14.4v Pistol grip I prefer has been sent in for maintinence yearly for probably it's first eight years when I was using it daily to an extreme, and about every other year since than. It's old and still used daily, just not to the extreme as putting a few hundred drywall screws in a day with it. Just a few hours a day of use. It has seen about either 18month or every two year service calls. That what is it, 12 year old daily used and highly abused drill in needing a new motor and lots of other things now is an excellent life for a cordless drill used that much. You will note that it's been maintained as per the manual as per a car. No oil in the car... you bet it's going to burn up. So things broke on it. Given the service center couldn't fix it I was all ready to upgrade because it paid itself off. 12 years old, much less older for the T-Handle that is less used? 

Both cordless drills given a good battery still work the same or even better now than they did when they were new. Granted it's some cash spent to get them in for yearly maintinence. Still it's well worth the effort.


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## techieman33

I kind of agree with you on the battery's. But I don't really with cheaper drills. Take my dad's 14.4 firestorm, it was a couple of years old, and the batteries died, he also had a sawzall that used the same battery. Well Black and decker had stopped making that style of battery, so he would have had to have the "guts" replaced in them, which would have been $70 each, and for that he could go out and but a new contactors set, with drill, sawzall, cutoff saw, and light. So in some instances it is cheaper to just buy new.


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## ship

Indeed, at some point it is chearper at some point to buy new. Have you forgotton that I in the last six months spent over $350.00 for a 13 year old cordless drill they don't even make any more in it having been improved?

Didn't think the Firestorm batteries fit on a DeWalt cordless recepricating "sawzall". That interchangability will have been a selling point for shop tools verses personal tool usage I asked about with a no doubt similar discontinued battery system to yours. The 14.4v DeWalt battery pack on the other hand has been re-designed and is much better.

In any case it is as it is at times cheaper to buy a new tool. Do not get me wrong, in implying that fixing tools and replacing batteries is mostly the cheaper option, but at times less cost effective. My own intent was to replace my pistol grip with it's three speed upgrade. Heck even on a cordless drill 2 - battery kit, if three years from now, if both the batteries go weak, and the motor or something else expensive on the drill goes bad, the new drill certainly would be worth the investment for a new one at times. This given a motor going bad three years latter either means a crappy drill or one without proper maintinence and car. Those that don't maintain their tools, very much should not be buying high end tools anyway. Even if nothing is wrong, the grease in the gun gets funky and needs replacement. Some of the older tools you could re-lube and fix various parts on it, but on modern tools they are too complex even for me to maintain. Some DJ club owner would not be expected to service call his moving light, why would a theater tech person now be sufficient to service their cordless, much less given a theater tech, why would they not treat the tools they make a living with treat that equipment the same as the moving lights? Get my point here with maintaing your tools?

Too bad if changed in style, the old version can't be saved for spare parts as otherwise the norm between say 1986 and 1996 with certain drills. Much less had I saved my old 9.6v under-powered Makita cordless saw, it in still being made will have been worth money in parts.

In any case, I would not in any way call a Firestorm cordless tool industrial grade. I still fall back upon those at the Black & Decker / DeWalt service station's advice to me in not buying the Firestorm while first introduced in it being a "home owner" grade tool and not suited for more contractor situations. Check the torque or number of screws able to be driven as similar to that of even of the big brother DeWalt in similar voltages, and it will show a much less powerful motor no matter the battery size. Much less in cheaper parts when abused, will wear out quicker.

Actual usage might very, but in testing it's still not the most heavy duty of tools - more on line with Royobi or the Royobi made Tim Allen line.

The Warrior series from Skil replaced the Top Gun. The drill body you could actually flex in your hands if strong enough. It also went the way of home owners - not that the Top Gun was all that heavy duty in the first place.

For belt sanders, Royobi, Skil and Bosh sell very much similar looking models at different prices. Bought the Royobi and it on average lasted three months before I had to replace it's drive belt over a period of about a year. In reality, all it took was one good usage an the belt would melt down given a aluminum gear. Seems they used different cheaper internal parts than the Bosh I'm 10 years later in very much similar models yet to have to repair. While corded tools, it's still the same principals in tool design.

Granted the DeWalt and Porter Cable have good and even within debate better "SawZall" versions, but Milwaukee in it's SawZall became that bench mark just as in 9.6v Makita became a bench mark and in 12v and 14.4v DeWalt became a bench mark. Buy a 7.1/4" circular saw - especially if the more powerful worm drive version and it's called a "Skill Saw." Just as Milwaukee is known for their "Screw Shooters" and "SawZalls", Skil is known above other brands for the power and reliability of their worm drive contractor saws. Used to be that if you had a cordless drill, it was a "Makita". Since than it was a "DeWalt" but the bench mark in changing is still the same and with intent.

A bench mark is something to base others upon. If better, great. Otherwise if cheaper but not the same in all ways, there is a reason for it itslelf not being that bench mark in trust. Hate my T-Handle 14.4v DeWalt. Yet it's still the bench mark for the industry.

No matter what level of usage of the tools, this debate on tools as useful to all, and I have gotten more impressed with the later Firestorm, Craftsman and Royobi tools than initially, is still a debate on what's useful to buy and use as it's goal. Back in 86' if I did not purchase the Makita 9.6v HD version, my high school theater teacher will have clubbed me over the head and she was right in it being the best of it's day. Now everyone makes cordless and especially, what is that add by Milwaukee about a "V28 Lithium-Ion" system? No more heavy than your 18v. drills, but all day use off a single battery.

Your school's TD should research and provide a decent tool in doing his or her job. Beyond this should recommend as mine did by way of threat what you should purchase as any old timer should. Ever so many people buying 18v tools "more power" than complaining that they get too heavy to use all day long as opposed to walking a few feet to the charger in getting a fresh battery. Do you unless out in the woods and without power need the highest voltage now 28v drill? Heck, there are backpack units for extra batteries in series with you main one and even plug in batteries that change your cordless to corded now. Still the 12v drill is sufficient for a 2 hour on average charge, and the 14.4v cordless for a greater than that with standard usage. That extra pound in batteries adds up after this when if you set the drill down, it might just become gone.

The Milwaukee V28 might be useful in some situations for the "Portaband" tool usage of it, but for a limited situation such as this, that different battery type might be more useful in being unique to the system than having to climb and sit atop a ladder with a 28v drill just because it also works with the portaband you only some times use.


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## techieman33

Wow, another long post. And yes the batteries were basically interchangeable, you just had to break off a little plastic tab, and it would work just fine.


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## ship

But in being long, was it useful?


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## techieman33

I don't think I understand your question, but if you mean the top of the battery, it would lock into place, just like the rest.


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## ricc0luke

I use a DeWalt 18v Drill/Driver/Hammerdrill

I really don't need the hammerdrill, but I really enjoy the extra power. I don't have all that great of a corded drill so it balences out.

On thing that I have not heard anyone even mention is an inpact driver. I have the DeWalt DW056K-2. I once used someone elses while working on a show, and after that I had to get one for myself. It has a 1/4" hex shank quick release. I use it fro everything from driving screws to lag bolts without having to predrill. It works extreamly fast and very light weight. The best part is the unbeleavible power behind it. I would recommend that you all go out and try one---

more info at-- http://www.dewalt.com/us/products/tool_detail.asp?productID=6341


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## ricc0luke

Just a note-- if you are looking at one, go with the IMPACT DRIVER, not the IMPACT WRENCH.

They also make them in 14.4v along with 12v.

Its worth your time to take a look-- and you money to buy one!


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## ship

Impact drivers are great tools. In a different post about some 10Kw fresnels, it was a pneumatic impact in this case I think wrench which removed a very stuck nut. They do have the power to do more work by suscessive blows than normal drill/drivers. For a bolt, there might be nothing better. There is also for contractors some cordless wire cutters and crimp tools. We have a four pin indent multi-cable pin crimp tool for such pins and it's sweet. Were I doing more distro racks, I would want a cordless or pneumatic crimp tool.

Such impact tools even on a stick drywall screw might have promiss. Otherwise it's a question of need for use in tightening boltls verses the other more general tool. Such a tool is probably on my list to puchase given a in general bulk of them. Good point in another tool on the market that's well within need at times. Impact tools also work as torque wrenches much more accurately than that of trusting a clutch setting based upon power or battery. If you need a specific torque, thest tools can't be topped.


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## sound_nerd

Right now I have a Bosch 14.4V hammer drill. A year ago, I blew the clutch, and then screwed it up even more by changing gears with a hammer and screwdriver. Had it repaired, they had to replace the clutch, gear assembly, casing, chuck...basically everything except the motor. It's running strong still today.
At the college, we use all Dewalt drills, and impact drivers. The only beef I have with them is that the batteries die within an hour of hard use. Otherwise, I would recommend the DeWalt XRP drills anytime.


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## ship

Just got the newer version of the 14.4v DeWalt Hammer Drill/three speed. It's nice in having a higher RPM, but it's weight and configuration is off a lot from the origional one I'm used to. Finger/hand position on it is way different, instead of using ones second finger, it's more like the third by how it's laid out in holding the drill in one's hand and which finger is operating the trigger.

I very much like the older discontinued gun better but at least it's still a pistol grip instead of T-Handle.

I also dislike the chuck on the new drill.

Interesting note on the duration of change on a impact cordless. Makes sense I suppose for what its doing.


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## Diarmuid

I recently decided that I would buy my own cordless drill, as the one at my theatre, is quite old and slow, I also thought I would find it quite useful at home.
I bought a Black and Decker 18V CD18CA.

I have found it to be excellent, and perfect for itss intended use, of drilling through wood etc, to construct sets. It can also be used on metal, but I havent tried this out. 
The only problem with it is, that it doesnt have a stand alone charger, and I think that this would be much better than having to plug the whole drill into the mains when charging it. I do think that the 18V battery, does last quite a long time, when it has been fully charged.


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## soundlight

FEIN cordless drills are, without a doubt, the best. I was at at a theater this summer that had tons of different drills, different voltages, different brands. They had ONE 14v Fein drill that could take out the 18v Makita any day. It worked like a charm, and everyone in the scene shop wanted to use it, and would make excuses to borrow it from people and not give it back. And it was one of the older ones. I've tested new feins (can't remember what model), and they are still top on my list. They're great.

*edited after guest posts deleted*


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## control

i personally own a craftsman 18volt with a led at the bottum to light the work area but my school has dewalt 18volt xrp drills which keep on vanishingi think the bandies took them.


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## gafftaper

My first two cordless drills were Craftsman because like the original post from Ship said, I was raised in a Craftsman home. I quickly learned that while the hand tools are great the cordless drills are crap. 

I currently own both a Black and Decker 14 Volt and 18 Volt Firestorm drills. I got the 14 volt for $40 at the factory outlet store and a few months later Lowes had a closeout on the 18 volt combo kit with a circular saw, flashlight, drill, laser level, and dustbuster for $90 so I just had to get it too. Both of these are good basic drills. Nothing special about them but they work fine for all my household needs. 

My current work situation has me a year away from purchasing all the equipment for a brand new college theater. I'm definitely going to buy Dewalt at that point. They are sturdy, powerful, and just feel good in your hand. 

When purchasing drills for my old high school shop I tended to buy Black and Decker because tools have a habit of walking away. While I would have loved to own Dewalts, I could buy 3 or 4 Black and Deckers for the same price. So it wasn't worth the risk when I had one or two stolen or broken every year (I think the custodians stole half of them). 

Black and Decker has factory outlet stores... see if you can find one in your area. You can get refurbished 12 or 14 volt drills with two batteries and a charger for $30-$50 (the price is different every time you go). There was one time I went and every tool in the store was half price, even the refurbished stuff... I spent $400 that day. Yes it's inferior equipment but it's not bad equipment like Craftsman. It'll handle light work at home and if you're buying for a High School shop where tools are abused or stolen, it makes sense financially.


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## MircleWorker

I too prefer Dewalts also, but in my space I use now a $90.00 18 volt firestorms. When we opened, a "Box store" had them on sale for $80.00 each with two batteries and a fast charger they were $110 at the time. Yes they are cheap, but when a student breaks one I don't cry.


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## MircleWorker

One of the best cordless drills I have ever owned was a Panisonic. it was a 12 volt beauty, after 8 long years it died on me. Now I have a Dewalt.


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## MHSTech

Right now I have a 12v Craftsman, and it's just not cuttin it for me. I'm thinkin about buying the Milwaukee 28v set. Can't go wrong with that. Those are some serious cordless tools.


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## soundlight

We just recently got a B&D 12V at my high school, and it works pretty well. It only has one battery, and it won't cut it for putting in lag screws, but it'll do most everything else. But I still would take a Fein over anything else. I used one this past summer and they're the best cordless drills that I've ever used.


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## gafftaper

Hey Soundlight you can get a quickcharger for B&D batteries for around $30. It'll make your life much easier.


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## saxman0317

*Re: cordless drills, what I have used*

At the stage right now, we have a bunch of dewalts, as well as what we used to use at work. But dewalts cant handle a beating well for what you pay for them and the batteries are terrible.. Too behonest, the cordless i just bought personnally as well as a few at work are 18v Ryobis. You can only get em Home Depot i think, but their really inexpensive, and from the way that i use stuff like that, it lives still. Battery life is really good too. The last set we did i used to battery for 2-3 days without charging it. And thats with alot of use. Cheap, and **** good durability...just make sure you get the 18v and you can interchange it with a multitude of other tools. I bought a set with a one of those big lights that works real well gelled, a chainsaw, a sawzall, 2 drills, 4 batteries and charger, a vacum, and a circular saw for about 300$. You can also get just the drill for about 50$ on sale.


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## tenor_singer

I started my school year with four different cordless drills...

1 12 volt Black and Decker ($29.99 sale at Lowes)
1 14.4 volt Black and Decker (Came with a kit of tools that cost a total of $49.00)
1 14.4 volt Skill drill ($129.00)
1 19.2 volt Craftsman drill ($199.00... set with a saw, light, drill etc...)

Three of them broke throughout our constructions. The funny thing is... guess which drill is still working?

Yup... the freaking $29.99 black and decker drill (with the gell filled grip none-the-less). AND the only reason the other B&D drill broke is because a kid used it to bang in a nail, ruining the battery (which we couldn't find a replacement for).

Since then we've invested in a 12 volt DeWalt. It's a very good drill, but still doesn't beat our beastly 12 volt, on sale special Black and Decker (that was dropped 28 feet from a lift and still runs).


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## jamsession

Great topic! Worth discussing - albeit tools, esp drills is practically a religious topic*, with emotional favorites - thx for all the detail on your favs and why.

*(my all-time fav Christmas gift 10+ years ago still remains a Craftsman industrial strength corded drill - I've made beds, houses, sets, castles, bookcases, tables, who knows what else with it. The original rubber cord is due for replace, but it's still going strong and forever has a special place in my heart.) 

funny - my favorite cordless drill isn't on the OP's original list that I could see, and scanning didn't see it mentioned. I'll keep this short and sweet.

My friend and I recently knocked out a 12' stage ramp in 2 hours. He was a trim carpenter for many years by trade, had daily used/abused/wore out every cordless out there (including Makita and DeWalt), and the ones he was using now were by _far_ his favorite. I'd have to agree - they have CRAZY torque and were a joy to use. Our pick:

RIDGID RIDGID RIDGID


If you're going to spend the $$$ for a good cordless or pair or more, check them out.


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## derekleffew

Call me a traditionalist, but Makita was the first, and I think still the best. I still have a 9.6V, 12V, and 14.4V. Anything greater than 14.4v weighs too much for general use. for very heavy-duty work, I'm also fond of the Milwaukee brand, but I understand they're not as good as they used to be. The DeWalt seems very rugged, but again too heavy.

I mentioned in another thread I prefer the Stanley Yankee screwdriver over any cordless, in some applications.


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## gafftaper

Derek you have to try one of the new 18 volt Makita Lithium Ion's. It weighs about the same as a 12 volt but has AMAZING power. 15 minute recharge on the battery. No battery memory. Even has this little LED light focused on your work area which is great when you are working on a set in some crazy location in the dark. This thing kicks some serious butt.


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## len

I purchased a Makita Li-Ion 18v package recently from e-bay brand new. It had a work light and an impact wrench as well, and I found it for $260. I'm very happy with it so far, although I haven't been able to use it much as I've been busy with other things, and the weather is too cold to do anything outside right now. But it's very comfortable, and light. Batteries charge fairly quickly and last a long time.


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## len

jamsession said:


> RIDGID RIDGID RIDGID
> 
> 
> If you're going to spend the $$$ for a good cordless or pair or more, check them out.



My dad ran the factory that made the chucks for 90% of the drills mfg. in the 1970's. And they were all made by Rigid. 

And if you drove a Big Joe material handler made in the early 1980's, that was my dad also. Last job he had before retirement.


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## DaveySimps

I got one of the new style Makita's with Li-Ion 18v battery. I LOVE it. The LED task light is becoming one of my favorite features.

~Dave


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## cdub260

I recently upgraded to a Milwaukee 18 volt, lithium ion screw gun. I've been happily abusing it the last two weeks while installing my new backstage work lights. So far I've only had to change batteries once.

I love my new toy.


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