# Looking for a intercom system?



## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

Hello everyone, As well as building a control room for our Auditorium, we are looking to buy a intercom system, I have searched various websites, and Google but couldn't find what I was looking for, I think I don't have the right name. We want a system with three or more wireless headsets with the headphone and the microphone that you push a button to talk and all headsets turned on will hear it. Or possibly just one headset for backstage and an intercom system for the control room, like, with a speakers and a button, since the control room will be about 50% sound proof, but headsets would be better. 

Im just not sure where to look for this kind of system, If someone could get me a link that would be great. Im looking for something simple, not having to tie into out sound system, just like, one receiver and the three headsets, kind of like walky-talkies.


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## TimmyP1955 (Aug 6, 2009)

I believe that Production Intercom (Home - Production Intercom Inc.) and ClearCom make them. We priced a system - it was over three times the $3000 cost of the two-channel wired system that we bought.


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## techyman2008 (Aug 6, 2009)

Not Sure what your budget is but here is a link to the Clearcom brand website.

Clear-Com - Products


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

Thanks for the reply's, I found exactly what I want, but like, I cant find where to buy them :/

Also, I need something self-sufficient, like, that doesn't need a soundboard to work.

Thank you!


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## cprted (Aug 6, 2009)

MillburyAuditorium said:


> Thanks for the reply's, I found exactly what I want, but like, I cant find where to buy them :/
> 
> Also, I need something self-sufficient, like, that doesn't need a soundboard to work.
> 
> Thank you!


Clear-Com/Production Intercom doesn't require an audio console. All you need is a power supply like these or a mainstation like these and you're cooking with gas.

If you email the sales department of either Clear Com or Production Intercom, they would be more than happy to direct you to the closest distributor who should be more than happy to draw up a quote.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

Awesome, thank you so much!


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## Van (Aug 6, 2009)

I haven't used any of Production Intercoms wireless setups but I equipped our second stage with a PI setup and I have to say I'm throughly satisfied with them. You can purchase directly from PI at www.beltpack.com I believe Clearcom requires you to purchase through a dealer. There should be a link on their site for " Find a dealer near you". 
I will add that a wireless system will ad significant cost to your system. They are great but if budget is an issue you can usually get several times the wired system fot the cost of even a small wireless.


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## rwhealey (Aug 6, 2009)

As said above, there are three big manufacturers of intercom systems, Clear-Com, Telex Audiocom, and Telex RTS. There are technical differences in the way that each intercom works.

Clear-Com is used more in theaters. Production Intercom makes Clear-Com compatible equipment for a lower price. I've never used either, but I've heard that Production Intercom is a great alternative if you're on a budget.

Telex Audiocom is a bit like Clear-Com, and is used more in professional video. We have one in our theater. Theater people will be less familiar with it.

RTS used to be a separate manufacturer until they were bought by Telex. I belive that they are used very heavily by pro video people. I've never seen one in a theater.

EDIT: I see you want wireless. Last time I added up what a 4-beltpack wireless cost, it was a bit over $10k. Wired would probably be cheaper if you have conduit you can use already.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

Well, it doesn't need to be wireless, but I think one or two will have to be. Because how will the person backstage and the person int he lobby be wired? 

I found the MS-200 from beltpack.com, and I looked it up, and I did not know it would be so high as around $1000. Does anyone now any cheaper solutions? I was thinking, if there isn't any cheaper solutions, than I could kind of make one myself, buy a cheap sound board, and getting 5 wireless (or three wired two wireless) headsets and plugging them into that. But I dont think it would work, because its ment for just a microphone, not a speaker aswell. So, Im notnreally even sure how it would work yet.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

I also just thought about walkytalkies. Is there anyway to buy walkytalkiey headsets? Like, instead of a louder speaker, and mic just in it, have it a headset, but being a walky-talkie. So I can just set them all to the same frequency and boom im good to go? Or maybe if theres any kind of walkytalky where I can plug in a headset and override the units features?

We really just want communication with backstage, lobby, and booth, we dont really want walkytalkies, expecially for backstage because people would hear it. Would like to be more secretive anywere its being used aswell.

Thanks!


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## Van (Aug 6, 2009)

MillburyAuditorium said:


> Well, it doesn't need to be wireless, but I think one or two will have to be. Because how will the person backstage and the person int he lobby be wired?
> .............


 
Depends on the system, some intercom systems can run over a CAT5 type cable, some run exclusivly on Mic Cable. Heck some can be run on bell wire. While conduit is not necessary for a lot of these aplications it can be required in some municipalities. Typically in a lot of intercom set ups the master station is located in the booth with the SM, If Wireless headsets are used the broadcast stations are located backstage and hooked to the Master station via cabling. 



MillburyAuditorium said:


> .....I found the MS-200 from beltpack.com, and I looked it up, and I did not know it would be so high as around $1000. Does anyone now any cheaper solutions? I was thinking, if there isn't any cheaper solutions, than I could kind of make one myself, buy a cheap sound board, and getting 5 wireless (or three wired two wireless) headsets and plugging them into that. But I dont think it would work, because its ment for just a microphone, not a speaker aswell. So, Im notnreally even sure how it would work yet.


$1k IS cheap. Start pricing a wireless Telex system.

More power to ya on building your own.....


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

Thanks Van, Do you have anything to say about the walk-talky idea?

Yeah, I just realized I could setup a station for the person backstage plug their headset into a outlets and run that outlet to the other side of the stage to our snake, plug it into the snake and plug the cable coming from the snake into whatever control box it would be. But that still leaves with wondering what that control box will be.


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## Van (Aug 6, 2009)

Look at the "econo" system at PI , there is no Master control, its one big open line essentially, but it IS communication, plus when you get a grant for better gear the PI Econo stuff is 100% compatible with all the rest of their gear and all of ClearComs stuff.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 6, 2009)

After doing some looking around Google and Amazon, I came up with a good system for only $200 

6x (one extra, had to buy in sets of two) Motorola EM1000R Radios
Amazon.com: Motorola EM1000R 20-Mile 2-Way FRS/GMRS Radio, Pair: Electronics

2x (It wouldn't let me buy 5 :/ Figure I will have the light and sound op have these ones and the director, backstage manager and lobby manager have the others.) Motorola 53725 SLK Headset with swivel boom.
Amazon.com: Motorola 53725 SLK Headset with Swivel Boom Mic (Black): Electronics

And 3x Motorolla 56320 Earpiece with swivel boom mic.
Amazon.com: Motorola 56320 Earpiece with Boom Microphone: Cell Phones & Service

We have never had interference with our 8 wireless mics, so I am hoping we wont have any with these radios either.

Does anyone think this is a good economical solution for an "intercom" system?


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## mstaylor (Aug 6, 2009)

It will work but it is less than perfect. What I would have done is what most every theatre does, use a regular intercom for show personnel and a radio between the front of house and the stage. 
There will be times that you will be calling a cue and somebody will step on your transmission. With an intercom you can interrupt, with a walkie-talkie you can't.


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## fredthe (Aug 7, 2009)

As others have said, go for a wired system, and a pair of radios for the Lobby/Stage comms...

While FRS radios may look good from a cost point, in the long run they are more expensive and less reliable than wired. They are more prone to breakage than normal intercom beltpacks, and the headsets just aren't up to constant use. As you are dealing with students, you need to expect they will not treat the equipment gently. Additionally, rechargable batteries don't last forever, they will need to be replaced periodically. So, while spending $200 on a radio-based system may seem good compared to a $1000 wired system, it will probably only last a couple of years (at the most) before parts will start to break.

Consider also that radios make a good target for theft, as they can be used by anyone, anywhere. A wired intercom beltpack/headset isn't particularly useful to anyone outside the theater.

-Fred


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## Van (Aug 7, 2009)

Oddly enough A person on our local Yahoo list ; PDXBackstage, recently inquired about an intercom system. almost the same day you did, was also asking about FRS radios etc. Here's the text and a response from a fellow Technician in town.

Below is the quoted text, edited for emails and names.


Excellent advice, Van! 

May I also chime in with that oldie but goodie:
You get what you pay for.


And my other favorite (which I seem to recall is posted in your scene shop, Van):
Fast. Good. Cheap. Pick two.


In other words, don't expect uncompromised reliability in an inexpensive product.


Oh yeah - this applies to people, too... but that is a whole other can of worms....... ......


Jen



On Aug 3, 2009, at 3:21 PM, Van McQueen wrote:


Oh Boy a question I can really get in-to on here!
 This is the kind of Question we field on Controlbooth. com all the time. But enough tooting.
 Your best bet is a intercom / headset system from PI ( that's P as in Production and I as in Intercom. I hate this font, doesn't have the little lines on top o th I's ) Check them out at www.beltpack. com

 They are 100% compatible with Clear-com systems and outside of a freebie from Craigslist they are the cheapest communications system you are going to find.
 " But Van, We over here at Profile don't have the big bucks you're used to dealing with at ART all the time...."
 Yes, I understand. While our budget are staggering we still enjoy getting a really good deal from time to time.

 The problems with most Walkie Talkie solutions are:

 1. Privacy. Most of the FRS etc band radios you see for sale everywhere are on the same Frequency and while there are many channels, exclusivity of use is not guaranteed, especially in an area with a population density like the Portland Metro Area.

 2. FCC regulations. Technically the small FRS ban radios are for "Public, Personal" use only just like the good ol' days of CB' the Rubber Chicken and the White Knight were individuals not companies. Will the FCC track down and Prosecute offending businesses that are using these frequencies? Doubtful, since General Powells son gutted the enforcement wing of the FCC during the Shrub admin and no ones seen fit to re-instate it yet.

 3. Ease of Use. Nothing is more frustrating during a high tension time backstage than the loss of communications. Using Walkie-talkies is a great way to insure this happens. Since walkie talkies are "simplex" communication < meaniing only one person can talk at a time> when people start talking over the top of each other, no one is heard at all and the situation can quickly spiral out of control. Headset systems are Duplex, like a phone, and everybody can talk at the same time, or if the SM chooses to turn everybody's mic off that's her / his prerogative. On the Ease of Use front; the availability of headsets or in-the -ear monitor/mics can be iffy for some of those walkies, and their use can be even iffier < sp?>. Talking quietly on some of those setup can be extremely difficult.

 Lastly,

 Reliability. never fails, 2 minutes before Curtain and the #^%!*&! Batteries die in the walkie talkies, or the other crucial time.. Right before Intermission.

Sorry to be long winded, it's just the way I am and I have very strong opinions on this particular subject. Feel free to get in touch I'm happy to talk you through a system purchase like this. and it may be cheaper than you think. 

Van J. McQueen
Technical Director
Artists Repertory Theatre


 All opinions, attitudes, remarks, witticisims, stuff you love, stuff you hate, whatever are those of Van, just Van and nobody else but Van and do not reflect any of the afforementioned of Artists Repertory Theatre or it's employees's, or Board or management, etc. etc.

 
From: Cindy 
Subject: [pdxbackstage] backstage communications
To: "'pdx backstage'" <[email protected] yahoogroups. com>
Date: Monday, August 3, 2009, 2:16 PM


 We would like to try using some walkie-talkie type equipment for backstage here at Pxxx. It’s a bit tricky, because anything but the softest sounds made in our booth will be overheard by our audience. It doesn’t need to work very long range—just from backstage (booth) to front of house (maybe 200 yards, max), and hands-free would be great. We are hoping not to spend an arm and a leg, and we need it to be reliable and not break up, go dead, or experience interference just when we most need it. Does anyone have suggestions or recommendations for equipment and/or retailers I should investigate?






 Administrative Director

​

​


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 7, 2009)

mstaylor said:


> It will work but it is less than perfect. What I would have done is what most every theatre does, use a regular intercom for show personnel and a radio between the front of house and the stage.
> There will be times that you will be calling a cue and somebody will step on your transmission. With an intercom you can interrupt, with a walkie-talkie you can't.


Well, our show directors are always located onstage. We really just need a system to keep in-touch with backstage and other areas, because like once, we were hosting a dance recital, and o course they had to bring their own sound system, so they are upfront and I am in the back with lights, and supervising, well, they had trouble with a song and so after the blackout after one oft he performances, within like 15 seconds the next song should start so I can bring lights back up, but nothing was happening so I wasn't sure what to do so I ended up running to the stage were they were. Also I was thinking, there are two directors to every play we do, maybe one can be in back calling ques, and one in the booth talking with backstage if they see anything out of place.




fredthe, 

I made sure the radios run on AA's so we can replace batteries when they ar eno longer able to be charged, and we only let 3 students use any equipment, including this upcoming radio system, Myself, my sound operator, and our back stage manager. The directors and lobby manager being adults/teachers. So im not to worried about anything being damaged, and as far as theft goes, the radios and headsets would be locked up in the booth after every performance, also, all 7 doors to the theatre are locked when not in use. We alos have a camera system around the room, soif anyone brakes into the booth they will be seen.

I meen, I would of loved to get a real intercom system, but I need to cut some corners with money since we want to present a proposal to the board of getting a lightboard (Going witht he Element), sound system, booth and this walkie-talkie set. As soon as we have enough extra money, We we deffinetly get a real system, but we dont have anything right now, so anythign is good.


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## museav (Aug 7, 2009)

The Motorola radios noted are potentially even more of a problem as they are FRS/GMRS and GMRS is much more tightly controlled than FRS. GMRS is limited to direct family of the license holder. Yep, have to be FCC licensed to use GMRS radios and while you could conceivably use them in an application like this, that would be possible only by every user being licensed. A license is $85 plus the paperwork, but I also believe that you have to be 18, so probably not an option for your application. You could use those radios without a license but only on low power and only on the 14 FRS channels, and how are you going to enforce that?

Between that, the potential of interference and reliability/durability, using FRS/GMRS radios may not be as practical a solution as it initially seems.

And talk about being a tempting thing to steal, a few years ago our house was broken into while I was on a job site at a theatre being built. They broke the door on our deck right out of the frame and went through every closet, drawer, etc. but the only things stolen were any cash they found, one of my wife's rings and two new FRS/GMRS radios I had just bought. Left the cameras, computers, stereo, TVs, instruments, and all the other jewelry, took the two Kenwood radios.


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## newdaypro (Aug 7, 2009)

We have just purchased "Coaches Intercom" from Telex. It is two channel wireless with up to 9 headsets. Our purchase included 7 beltpacks al in a carrying case. Instead of Channel 1 and Channel 2, one is Green (O) for offense and the other Red (X) for defense. It is IP protocol and searches automatically for clear frequencies. HOWEVER, the cost was about HALF the standard theatre systems.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 7, 2009)

museav said:


> The Motorola radios noted are potentially even more of a problem as they are FRS/GMRS and GMRS is much more tightly controlled than FRS. GMRS is limited to direct family of the license holder. Yep, have to be FCC licensed to use GMRS radios and while you could conceivably use them in an application like this, that would be possible only by every user being licensed. A license is $85 plus the paperwork, but I also believe that you have to be 18, so probably not an option for your application. You could use those radios without a license but only on low power and only on the 14 FRS channels, and how are you going to enforce that?
> 
> Between that, the potential of interference and reliability/durability, using FRS/GMRS radios may not be as practical a solution as it initially seems.
> 
> And talk about being a tempting thing to steal, a few years ago our house was broken into while I was on a job site at a theatre being built. They broke the door on our deck right out of the frame and went through every closet, drawer, etc. but the only things stolen were any cash they found, one of my wife's rings and two new FRS/GMRS radios I had just bought. Left the cameras, computers, stereo, TVs, instruments, and all the other jewelry, took the two Kenwood radios.



We need a license? The description says no license required :/

And as I have said before, For the last 15 years we have had NOTHING to communicate with backstage, no radios, no intercom, nothing. So even if there is interference, it will be better than nothing, what we have now. Also it wont be used for cues, as the directors are always backstage.

And on theft again,
As well as being locked in a booth, in a 7 door all locked theatre, completely enclosed within the school, the school has its heavy duty windows and doors, two sets for the main entrance, aswell as fire and security systems, and if it does get stollen, the school will back it up.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 7, 2009)

newdaypro said:


> We have just purchased "Coaches Intercom" from Telex. It is two channel wireless with up to 9 headsets. Our purchase included 7 beltpacks al in a carrying case. Instead of Channel 1 and Channel 2, one is Green (O) for offense and the other Red (X) for defense. It is IP protocol and searches automatically for clear frequencies. HOWEVER, the cost was about HALF the standard theatre systems.


I'll look into that system you mentioned.


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## museav (Aug 7, 2009)

MillburyAuditorium said:


> We need a license? The description says no license required :/


Which is technically correct, as long as you use only the 14 FRS channels and operate on low power, then no license is required.


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## newdaypro (Aug 7, 2009)

I believe there may be a couple of different levels of this system. This is the same system the Big 12 and C-USA uses.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 7, 2009)

museav said:


> Which is technically correct, as long as you use only the 14 FRS channels and operate on low power, then no license is required.


Oh, okay then. We have a small town and the school isn't close to anything really, so I think it will be fine.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 8, 2009)

I just tested out a walky talkie set I have at my house around the school and went to every public channel 1-22 and had absolutely no interference and it was as crystal clear as radio is going to get. Hope it works out : ) I will update this when we order the set and tell you how it works out.




And quick question, This may be seem odd, but I was chatting with the sound op about the walky talkies, and he said we should get those ones special services and managers use. The ones with the small earpicw and the clear winding wires going down their shirt behind there ear, Was wondering if anyone knew what those would be called and what the microphone is on those.


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## Van (Aug 10, 2009)

There are a couple of different names for the earpieces. IEM In ear monitors is one, and there was a recent thread on here about them. Sometimes those earpieces are the earpiece and monitor allin one. They pick up you voice via bone conduction and cutaneous transmission, More often than not the "Mr. Smith" versions like what's used in the Matrix and by the Secret Service have a microphone concealed in the sleeve of ones shirt and the earpiece is just an earpiece.


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## MillburyAuditorium (Aug 13, 2009)

Thanks : )


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## rochem (Aug 18, 2009)

Not trying to hijack this thread, but does anyone know what the approximate cost of having a PI system installed would be? At my school, we are still stuck using walkie talkies, but due to constant use and damage we end up having to buy a couple new ones every year. Previously in this thread someone mentioned $1K I think - would it really be that cheap? I'm talking about a 2-channel wired system, in an existing facility with no conduit currently in place. I know the cost of installation will vary widely based on individual application, but does anyone have a ballpark figure for me to go off?


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## cprted (Aug 18, 2009)

Unless you're looking at the wall mount units and such, there isn't much "installation" that needs to be done. All you need is 3-pin XLR. I assume there is an audio snake between the FoH and the stage? You can use one of the returns for the com line.

As to cost, it depends what type of base station/power supply you want, how many belt packs, etc. Best to call your local PI dealer.


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## museav (Aug 18, 2009)

rochem said:


> I'm talking about a 2-channel wired system, in an existing facility with no conduit currently in place. I know the cost of installation will vary widely based on individual application, but does anyone have a ballpark figure for me to go off?


Not based on the information provided. You'd have to know things like how many connections, how many beltpacks, how many speaker stations, whether the system concept is two channels with one for house and one for BOH with single channel devices or two channels everywhere with two channel devices, etc. And to estimate the related costs for conduit, etc. it would really take knowing the device locations and building conditions.

However, I believe the numbers noted earlier in the discussion were $1,000 for the Master Station and $3,000 for a system of unknown size rather than $1,000 for a system. I currently have what is effectively a two channel Clear-Com system (actually four channels but two wired channels, one channel to tie to an existing Telex wireless system and one channel tying back to an existing digital matrix to allow all the arts and music facilities to communicate) going into a Black Box theatre. The conduit alone for the Black Box portion is about $2,000 and would have been more if the Electrician wasn't already working on the campus and they didn't have some of the physical conduit itself left from another recent project.


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## Seldred (Oct 18, 2009)

Hi, all - I see I'm entering this thread pretty late and maybe should be starting a separate thread, but thought it would be good to start here. We currently have a Telex wired system in our auditorium (with beltpacks that are steadily wearing out) and are seeking to upgrade and expand our system with a set of compatible wireless headsets. It looks like there are now some viable options for doing this which don't completely break the bank.

The first is the "Anchorman" system, which Production Advantage (Quality Theatrical Supplies and Equipment?Production Advantage, Inc.), a reputable New England Theatrical supply company, is pushing as a great new solution. Anchor audio is at: Portable Sound Systems | Public Address and Wireless Sound Reinforcement. This looks like a very good, full duplex, wireless system - you can get 4 headset/beltpacks that all talk to each other in full duplex without needing a base station. And you can buy a "WingMan" unit to put in your rack that will interface the wireless sets with your existing wired system. The cost for 4 Anchorman units is somewhere between $3,200 & $4,000, depending on where you buy. HOWEVER, I noticed in the specs that the Anchorman range maxes out at 250 feet, which should be fine for most theater setups, unless that distance is only for unobstructed signal. I'm wondering how well these will work around corners and through walls between backstage, in hallways, and upstairs in our booth.

The second system I found is less expensive and has a greater range (1/4 mile) - it's the Eartec "PCX-1000" system (index). As far as I can see, it does exactly what the Anchorman system does. They sell the system directly - you can buy a 4-set system for about $2,400 - $2,900, depending on the headsets you choose. This system doesn't seem to have a way to connect to the wired system, but after checking back, I see that Eartec offers about 4 different wireless systems that connect with each other and a wired system in different ways, at different prices.

A key question with most of the Eartec systems is whether/how any of them allow party line talk amongst all users, or is it a pain to switch from "listen-only" to full duplex mode one user at at time - it seems all of the Eartec systems that can connect with a wired system employ one master transceiver and up to 3 subsidiary sets - I'm not sure how this setup plays out in real-time production usage.

So... my QUESTION is: has anybody out there worked with any of these, or similar systems? I'm trying to figure out if they would really work well in our environment. I'd love to hear any feedback on this subject at all, including how well master/slave systems work compared with everybody in full duplex all the time systems (something tells me this is what I should insist on getting).

Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!

Stephen Eldredge


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## Anonymous067 (Oct 18, 2009)

Clearcom. j


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## ChrisPistols (Oct 22, 2009)

Depending on what kind of system you have now I'm guessing a two wire system there are converter boxes that you can use to simply interface handheld radios into and then have them work on your current com system. Clear Com makes one that works on a two wire system and you hold down on the call button to communicate with the people which are on the radios. One benefit to this is that you can add as many radios onto the system as you want. The only problem with this solution is your wireless system would only be a half duplex system meaning that from a safety stand point if any alert was said over the com it would not be heard on the radios. This is extremely dangerous!!!! Any com system that I would put into a theater would be a full duplex system. The reason why so many of these wireless com systems are so expensive is due to the fact that they are full duplex.


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## Spiceboy (Nov 13, 2009)

Not sure if you qualify but it might be worth checking out Clear-Com's non-profit and educational program here

Non-Profit and Educational Program


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