# You Can't Take It With You - "Beautiful pretty girly red fire of brilliance"



## Jamie (Sep 29, 2010)

That's what the director wants alright. Those unfamiliar with the show, (in short), father makes fireworks and is showing one to his daughter late at night. It is described in the script as a small fire that sheds a soft glow around the room.

I was thinking of finding a small pot or something and putting together a few Cree 3W red leds to a power source (resistors as necessary) to a small switch on the exterior of the pot for actor access.

The problem becomes the flicker. Any ideas?


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## DuckJordan (Sep 29, 2010)

Jamie said:


> That's what the director wants alright. Those unfamiliar with the show, (in short), father makes fireworks and is showing one to his daughter late at night. It is described in the script as a small fire that sheds a soft glow around the room.
> 
> I was thinking of finding a small pot or something and putting together a few Cree 3W red leds to a power source (resistors as necessary) to a small switch on the exterior of the pot for actor access.
> 
> The problem becomes the flicker. Any ideas?


 
or you could use a small low 40w or so bulb with red gel over it and in series wire a fluorescent starter it makes a nice flame like flicker when supplied the 120v I'm not sure if being at a lower voltage would cause problems.

or you could always take apart one of the hand held flame lights you can buy cheaply at a halloween store and place it in the pot.


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## sk8rsdad (Sep 29, 2010)

The last time we did the show we used pyrotechnics and a red cake fountain, with the appropriate licensing, approvals, and safety measures in place. 

You could conceal a light source on the set, then set the pot down so the glow appears to emanate from the pot rather than the concealed light source. Downlighting onto a reflector in the pot can work too, but the actors have to be far more careful about positioning the prop. Program a chase or multipart cue on your lighting console rather than getting into inventing something that is battery operated, or dangling an extension cord that has to be connected.


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## scapino (Sep 29, 2010)

sk8rsdad said:


> The last time we did the show we used pyrotechnics and a red cake fountain, with the appropriate licensing, approvals, and safety measures in place.
> 
> You could conceal a light source on the set, then set the pot down so the glow appears to emanate from the pot rather than the concealed light source. Downlighting onto a reflector in the pot can work too, but the actors have to be far more careful about positioning the prop. Program a chase or multipart cue on your lighting console rather than getting into inventing something that is battery operated, or dangling an extension cord that has to be connected.


 
The last time we did it, I used a 19 deg source 4 mounted above, pointing down, with a red gel. In the bowl they put on the table was a mirror. The S4 was shuttered so that the light only hit the mirror in the bowl, and bounced out onto thier faces.

Kurt


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## Van (Sep 30, 2010)

Is there a specific reason you wish to use and LED as your source ? is it for the portability factor ? "A small fire that sheds a soft glow around the room" sort of screams big red wash over the stage and a small source light for the actors faces. I think a high wattage/ low volt halogen lamp either dipped or gelled properly could provide the 'on face' light.


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## Van (Sep 30, 2010)

I apologize i just re-read your original post....
I would take the earlier sugestion. Buy yourself a cheap 'Fake votive candle' the kind that run on small batteries. Carefully rip it apart. Typically, I have found that the cheaper models that are set up to only run 1 led actually have two places on the mobo to make electrical connections. This allows you to make two circuits of LEDs and you get a better flicker. Bear in mind if you are trying to power a high power LED using a salvage driver like this then you will most likely burn out the circuit rather quickly. Luckilythe fake votives are really cheap, if you have the time to do the rebuilding. If you have the ability , time and desire you could also tkae a look at this http://fnbcreations.net/Articles/FIREFLICKER.pdf and see if you might not want to build a couple of these to mount in the bowl.


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## Jamie (Sep 30, 2010)

I mainly want to use LEDs as a personal project to see if they will work elsewhere. The overall look I'm going for requires all of the "red glow" to come from within the prop so that the actors can hold it close to their faces and we only get a single-sourced shadow.

Van, your link is close to what I'm trying to do, I'll just have to look into the rating of the components to see if a 1w-3w led can be hooked up to that circuit


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## Jamyo (Feb 14, 2013)

scapino said:


> The last time we did it, I used a 19 deg source 4 mounted above, pointing down, with a red gel. In the bowl they put on the table was a mirror. The S4 was shuttered so that the light only hit the mirror in the bowl, and bounced out onto thier faces.
> 
> Kurt



I know this is an old post, however, we recently closed on this production at my high school and I used this technique for the red glow. It worked great! I added a gam roller with the flame roll to get the movement of flames reflected and it looked fantastic. Thanks for the tip Kurt!


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## MPowers (Feb 15, 2013)

A few years back I wrote some articles on "Fire on Stage". A couple involved shop built solutions to "flickering". I don't know if they would work with LED's or not, consumer grade/cost LED's bright enough for this effect, did not exist back then. I'd be very interested in finding out. Take a look at the articles Fire Part I and Part II, scroal down past the article and video at the top. Special Effects


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## scapino (Feb 15, 2013)

Jamyo said:


> I know this is an old post, however, we recently closed on this production at my high school and I used this technique for the red glow. It worked great! I added a gam roller with the flame roll to get the movement of flames reflected and it looked fantastic. Thanks for the tip Kurt!



Glad it worked for you!

I've used variations of that trick many times. On one show a guy was supposed to get electrocuted from a foot bath he was taking, and I did the same thing, with 3 tight spots just in front and overhead, focused onto a mirror under a little water in the tub he had his feet in. They were gelled with a no color blue and strobed randomly very quickly. Looked like the "sparks" were in the tub he was soaking his feet in.


Kurt


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## jhochb (Feb 15, 2013)

Good Morning all

Check out the KIT page at ALL ELECTRONICS
Kits | AllElectronics.com

There are 4 or 6 kits that may fit the bill for the next time someone needs a candle.

ADJUSTABLE LED FLASHER KIT | AllElectronics.com

ELECTRONIC CANDLE KIT | AllElectronics.com


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