# Rope Lock Lockout



## MHSTech (Nov 28, 2006)

Here's a picture of our rope locks.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v654/fiestakid88/2741620c.jpg

Now the problem. Since we built this K-12 building, there is no longer and Auditorium, we have a combination Auditorium and Cafeteria. This has made our stage a rather high traffic place compared to how it used to be. Also, this is the first time we have ever had a fly system and we have other groups comming in to use the stage when I'm not around. I am worried that somebody will release the rope locks as they are walking by or perhaps mess with my counterwieghts. I am looking for a solution to locking the rope lock with a padlock. Is there something out there for my style of fly system? I know SECOA has theirs built so that a padlock can stop the handle from comming down. I could build something like it, but I would like to see if there is any product already being manufactured.


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## Footer (Nov 28, 2006)

The loop on the top of the lock is sometimes used to lock the lock. They do make a locking version of the lock that has a key in it to totally lock down the lock, and from the looks of things you do not have too many lines, so this is something that you could do for fairly cheap. If you can build some type of U bolt type thing that will go through the hole in the top of the lock and around the rope then that would be your best bet after replacing the locks. Otherwise, a large wire tie (I know you would have to cut it off each time, but it is an option). As far as people changing weight... I really do not think you should have a problem with that, people tend not to screw with things that are big and heavy. If anything, spray paint your weights after you get them in weight to verify that you have the right about in. If you can get a steel bander band the weights on after you get them in weight, or a chain and a padlock.

or you could get something like this, though I am not sure this will mount on your rail because Secoa uses a different hole configuration.
http://www.secoa.com/specsbrochures\RopelockCutSheet.pdf


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## CURLS (Nov 28, 2006)

Great QUESTION GREAT THOUGHT!

I remember *JUST* the product you are searching for that came out maybe less than a year ago from JRCLANCY, pretty much industry standard rigging people. Way to be SAFE GUYS! Here is your product! http://www.jrclancy.com/Downloads/SureLockDataSheet1.pdf

Hope this helps and hope it's not too expensive!


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## Van (Nov 28, 2006)

Looking at your picture it appears to me you could padlock the top of your brake handles to make it difficult for people to remove the locking ring. other than that I second what Footer said and highly suggest painting the top pig on the arbor, when it is at batten weight, with either Day glow orange, red or yellow it's a good place to count from when re-weighting so you don't have to do the math of how much to subtract for batten weight, just count the pigs above the paint line. < I mean really, do you want the guys loading weight to be doing math at the same time ? I didn't think so.  > 

My Sons school has a gymatorium and I was looking at the stage one day and noticed the battens had been tied to the wall using a couple of coat hooks. Needless to say I had to do a little volunteer work that week.

Who built that fly system ? the uprights look a little sketchy < if you don't mind me saying> I would love to take a closer look at the engineering of those, any more picts ?


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## Footer (Nov 28, 2006)

CURLS said:


> Great QUESTION GREAT THOUGHT!
> I remember *JUST* the product you are searching for that came out maybe less than a year ago from JRCLANCY, pretty much industry standard rigging people. Way to be SAFE GUYS! Here is your product! http://www.jrclancy.com/Downloads/SureLockDataSheet1.pdf
> Hope this helps and hope it's not too expensive!



Those are basically a re-branded magic locks. They can get a bit annoying at times. They can slow down how fast a piece moves. They also have a tenancy to catch of spike tape. I think they give a false sense of security. It is also nearly impossible to tell if it is the load out of balance or the lock locking up.


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## Van (Nov 28, 2006)

Footer4321 said:


> Those are basically a re-branded magic locks. They can get a bit annoying at times. They can slow down how fast a piece moves. They also have a tenancy to catch of spike tape. I think they give a false sense of security. It is also nearly impossible to tell if it is the load out of balance or the lock locking up.


 


And *EXPENSIVE *!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## MHSTech (Nov 28, 2006)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v654/fiestakid88/ropelock.jpg

Here is a closer more detailed picture of two of the locks. I like the SECOA locks, but I don't really want to replace the rope locks all together. My idea was to build two post that would bolt into the two holes on either side of it. There would be two holes in the top of the post where a Mastelock could go through. I'm going to try to get it sketched in autocad... when I get time.


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## Van (Nov 28, 2006)

I see, Well looking at that close-up pic, you could tap a hole through the handle at the top of the recessed area, just below where the lock ring notch is, and use the for a place to insert a lock. Doing so should not structural integrity at all. My concern for a closer picture was for the uprights, below the brake and lock lever it appears to me that there is no common rail tieing the onstage edge of all the uprights together. There also doesn't appear to be anything tieing the upright to the T-bar wall, it appears to me that there is only a 1/4" X 3 1/2 " steel flat bar running up from the floor where it is tied into the anchor point for the bottom sheave. Seems more than a little flimsy to me. Again I'm not bashing your new facility, this is more of a safety concern of mine, having installed more than a few fly systems. This must be set up to top out at VERY light loads. Under extreme loads that brake lever upright would be pulled into the center of the rig. After repeated use under heavy load this would result in stress fractures and eventual failure of the upright bar at the point where it ties into the anchor plate for the bottom sheave. 

Just sticking my nose in.


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## koncept (Nov 28, 2006)

it looks to me like you can just slide your rope lock loop (the loop the goes between the handle and rope) up slightly just use a larger than standard master lock such as http://www.masterlock.com/images/product_bin/product_6230KALH.gif. that should be a safe and cost effective method.


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## MHSTech (Nov 28, 2006)

Van said:


> it appears to me that there is only a 1/4" X 3 1/2 " steel flat bar running up from the floor where it is tied into the anchor point for the bottom sheave.


Thats a concern of mine too, but there's not much I can do about it other than complain. They are used strictly for 3 lightbars and 3 teasers. I have no intentions on using them for anything else for as long as I'm here (I'm done in less than 2 years). I want to leave this program knowing that its better safer than it was when I left. And if you saw the pictures of what our control room used to be, you know this new equipment is about 100 times safer. 

Don't worry about hurting my feeling on the new building thing. We got screwed over with so many different things during the whole project. Rumor has it that a certain state government organization came in and cut our budget because "We had too nice of a building." But...thats a whole different story and situation.


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## Footer (Nov 28, 2006)

Van said:


> I see, Well looking at that close-up pic, you could tap a hole through the handle at the top of the recessed area, just below where the lock ring notch is, and use the for a place to insert a lock. Doing so should not structural integrity at all. My concern for a closer picture was for the uprights, below the brake and lock lever it appears to me that there is no common rail tieing the onstage edge of all the uprights together. There also doesn't appear to be anything tieing the upright to the T-bar wall, it appears to me that there is only a 1/4" X 3 1/2 " steel flat bar running up from the floor where it is tied into the anchor point for the bottom sheave. Seems more than a little flimsy to me. Again I'm not bashing your new facility, this is more of a safety concern of mine, having installed more than a few fly systems. This must be set up to top out at VERY light loads. Under extreme loads that brake lever upright would be pulled into the center of the rig. After repeated use under heavy load this would result in stress fractures and eventual failure of the upright bar at the point where it ties into the anchor plate for the bottom sheave.
> Just sticking my nose in.



Its not a T-bar system, its a wire guide. They install that lock/floorblock set that they anchor into the floor and its a one stop shop type deal. It drives me nuts when they do this because you can never really go back to a full fly. Also, why do I have a strange feeling that there is not a loading rail? Oh... and if you really want to do this... Clancy just released what you are looking for. 

http://www.jrclancy.com/products_ropelock.htm


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## MHSTech (Nov 28, 2006)

I like the design of the new rope lock. That still involves me replacing our locks though, which is something I don't really want to do while this system is still new. 

Oh, and you can't see the loading rail because it is non existant. I wasn't kidding when I said we got screwed...


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## Footer (Nov 28, 2006)

MHSTech said:


> I like the design of the new rope lock. That still involves me replacing our locks though, which is something I don't really want to do while this system is still new.
> Oh, and you can't see the loading rail because it is non existant. I wasn't kidding when I said we got screwed...



Did they at least include a capstan winch or some type of winch?


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## Van (Nov 28, 2006)

You guys should see the Scottish Rite temple accross the street from us. Built in 1949, Wire guide arbor set 36 + linesets 4 or 5 electrics, and the entire arbor set is ....WOOD ! . the first time I went in there I made the comment that they might want to replace the guide cables, as at least half of them had snapped. If you didn't watch the arbor real close when you flew things in and out it would start twisting side to side and get caught on the arbors next to it. Yikes ! 

Sorry 'bout the getting screwed. I hate it when that stuff happens, especially when it's the kids that suffer. Anyway I still stand by my earlier assesment. Drill it and lock it. Or go with Koncepts Idea. 

Good luck !


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## paul (Nov 29, 2006)

This is how I would take care of this on a tight budget:
Swag up some aircraft cable just long enough to reach through the hole at the top of the brake lever, and above the top pig in the arbor (between the two vertical pieces of steel). Use a padlock to secure the two ends of said aircraft cable. 
Unfortunately, you'll have to fly out everything in order to get your arbors down low enough. A pain, I know. But it is a solution. Of coarse, this may not work at all for you. But from what I gather from the picture, this method would let me breath easyier about the whole situation.
p.s. - I like the pvc piping in the picture. that seems like a nifty way of doing things.


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## jonhirsh (Nov 29, 2006)

Put two eyelets in the walls on each side of your bank of rope locks. 

Then run Steel rope through the holes on the top of the locsk and through the eyelets pad locking a giant circle. 

Kinda like this

o I I I I I I I o 

Dont know if it will work but hey. 
JH


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## MHSTech (Nov 29, 2006)

Footer4321 said:


> Did they at least include a capstan winch or some type of winch?


Negative on that one. 

Oh, and the PVC pipe was something our crazy elementary music director put together...I can't believe it held from the way it was constructed.

I think for now I will be putting zip ties around it since they don't get touched hardly at all, however, I will be looking into makng a bolt on locking system to make the lock something like what clancy is manufacturing.


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## Chris15 (Dec 2, 2006)

jonhirsh said:


> Put two eyelets in the walls on each side of your bank of rope locks.
> Then run Steel rope through the holes on the top of the locsk and through the eyelets pad locking a giant circle.
> Kinda like this
> o I I I I I I I o
> ...



I would say that it may not work for the simple fact that you are looking at a number of metres or wire rope. And because of this, you will have a fair bit of stretch in the cable, to the point where I imagine that it would be rather easy to open the rope locks anyway. Conceptually I like the idea, but I suspect that the practicalities of it might be a problem.


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## jonhirsh (Dec 2, 2006)

Hmmm good point. 
JH


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## saxman0317 (Dec 8, 2006)

Any chance of just building a cage around it? If you cant get to it you cant mess with it, and cages are relativly cheap and easy. Even just a chain link deal would work...


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