# If you can't afford a comm system...



## headcrab (May 6, 2010)

If you can't afford a comm system and hate walkie-talkies as much as I do, yet you have a bunch of windows computers available, you have access to a free, low-level chat utility.
There is no eye-candy, nothing to be distracted by. In my opinion, it's perfect for show communication if there's no other option.
It is accessed by going to Start | Run, and entering "dxdiag.exe" without the quotes.
Wait for the program to load and go to the Network tab. Click "Test DirectPlay." If this computer will be the server, enter a user name and session name. If this computer is a client, select "Join existing session" and enter the server computer's IP address when it asks for it. Select the session name you chose when setting up the server computer.
In the chat window, enter your message in the field at the bottom and click "send."
I know this works with Windows XP. DxDiag may be available in other versions of Windows. I tried to run it through Wine in Fedora, but I couldn't get it to work.


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## 00AVD (May 6, 2010)

Cool. I've actually been thinking of writing a small Telnet application for this type of thing. I hadn't got around to working out whether to implement it as a simple one-to-one system or multi user.

The DxDiag thing sounds a little fiddly (for a non computer person) to do each time, so maybe my idea would be worth looking into?


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## Les (May 6, 2010)

Hopefully that program works better than Facebook Messenger which reports back to you, like, 30 seconds later that your previous message didn't send.


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## headcrab (May 6, 2010)

In my experience, latency is basically zero. 00AVD, you bring up a good point. It is somewhat fiddly, but I like the lack of eye candy. There's no junk to wade through.


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## zuixro (May 6, 2010)

I didn't know dxdiag had a chat program like that. Cool.

Ventrillo is a voice chat program. It's completely free. You can run the server locally. The client is available for Windows and Mac (linux coming soon. I think.) The server is available for Windows, Linux and Mac. My brother and I used it over our Wi-Fi network (g) while playing an online game, and we didn't have any problems. It's full duplex. Customizable options like muting people and such. Clearcom would definitely be preferred, but if you can't afford it, Ventrillo could work.


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## 00AVD (May 6, 2010)

So, would there be any interest in a very simple chat program?

I was imagining:

Send & receive boxes (like msn, etc)
Send button (also sends on enter key)
Optional screen name (set in options)
Server name / IP address (set in options)
Server port # (set in options)
Not sure whether to write a small server app as well as the client, or just one program that can be started as the server with a command line switch?


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## Footer (May 6, 2010)

So, instead of spending 500-1000 bucks on a com system, you envision using computers with headsets to comminicate? So for each person you need a computer that has wifi, a USB or analog headset, an install of windows, and an monitor. You are replacing a system that draws less then an amp with a system that now draws 10-20 amps. You are also adding more complexity then is ever needed. 

Trust me, the LAST thing you ever want to happen on a show is for coms to die. I have had it happen to me 3 or 4 times with an audience in the house and the feeling is like being stuck in the middle of an ocean without paddles. Spend the money, buy a com system. There have been threads like this in the past. Voice over IP is great technology, however unless you are going to spend money on it and have a robust system you are asking for trouble. Also, we don't need any more screens FOH or backstage.


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## DuckJordan (May 6, 2010)

Footer said:


> So, instead of spending 500-1000 bucks on a com system, you envision using computers with headsets to comminicate? So for each person you need a computer that has wifi, a USB or analog headset, an install of windows, and an monitor. You are replacing a system that draws less then an amp with a system that now draws 10-20 amps. You are also adding more complexity then is ever needed.
> 
> Trust me, the LAST thing you ever want to happen on a show is for coms to die. I have had it happen to me 3 or 4 times with an audience in the house and the feeling is like being stuck in the middle of an ocean without paddles. Spend the money, buy a com system. There have been threads like this in the past. Voice over IP is great technology, however unless you are going to spend money on it and have a robust system you are asking for trouble. Also, we don't need any more screens FOH or backstage.




Although what you say is true, some high schools and smaller theaters have computers already, with headsets and such for the computers. This is a cheap solution compared to buying a system. While not as uniform and One track system, it is a good idea. So I'm sorry footer but I would have to say that the one track system of headset can be quite useless to some spaces. 

Not saying i would ever use this in a mission critical enviro but it still has its uses. (such as extreme low budget) and you have computer savy people.


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## Footer (May 6, 2010)

DuckJordan said:


> Although what you say is true, some high schools and smaller theaters have computers already, with headsets and such for the computers. This is a cheap solution compared to buying a system. While not as uniform and One track system, it is a good idea. So I'm sorry footer but I would have to say that the one track system of headset can be quite useless to some spaces.
> 
> Not saying i would ever use this in a mission critical enviro but it still has its uses. (such as extreme low budget) and you have computer savy people.



They also have tin-can and tie line. I bet over one lunch period you could build a system to communicate to everyone. It might work better and be more reliable. 




The idea that computers are "free" in education and in smaller theatres is a bit of a misnomer. I work at a community theatre. We just had two laptops donated. Both of them barely run windows XP. I also worked in a very large school district. It was like pulling teeth to get even one computer to use as a pre-viz machine. I could not imagine asking for 10, all with active windows licenses. Most school districts buy volume licenses for a given number of seats. Even when they upgrade a computer, one has to leave. You might see 50 computers sitting in a basement collecting dust, but usually those computers don't have an activated copy of windows on them. If you want to shell out 150 bucks per machine to get windows on them, more power to ya. If you don't you are breaking the law and putting your theatre/school at risk. I have seen Microsoft come through and do an audit in a school district. Its not pretty. 

Now, if you can get it to run on linux that uses less resources and runs on older hardware better then new hardware, that could be a bit more appealing.


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## headcrab (May 6, 2010)

I never said anything about headsets. I just said that a simple utility that's part of Windows does a reasonable job of sending text from computer to computer.


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## 00AVD (May 6, 2010)

I think there's still a market out there for simple text over network software. A freeware solution that could run on existing laptops would be useful.

At the high school I help out at (as a parent), laptops are a ready resource. A lot of students bring them for school work, or to use on school productions.

The school Intranet should allow the use of TCP on high port numbers so I can't see a problem there.


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## KeepOnTruckin (May 7, 2010)

Footer said:


> The idea that computers are "free" in education and in smaller theatres is a bit of a misnomer. I work at a community theatre. We just had two laptops donated. Both of them barely run windows XP. I also worked in a very large school district. It was like pulling teeth to get even one computer to use as a pre-viz machine. I could not imagine asking for 10, all with active windows licenses. Most school districts buy volume licenses for a given number of seats. Even when they upgrade a computer, one has to leave. You might see 50 computers sitting in a basement collecting dust, but usually those computers don't have an activated copy of windows on them. If you want to shell out 150 bucks per machine to get windows on them, more power to ya. If you don't you are breaking the law and putting your theatre/school at risk. I have seen Microsoft come through and do an audit in a school district. Its not pretty.
> 
> Now, if you can get it to run on linux that uses less resources and runs on older hardware better then new hardware, that could be a bit more appealing.




Depends on the school system. Where i went to school, there was more than enough computers laying around, and licensing was not a problem. I could see this working for the theater departments that have no budget.


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## 00AVD (May 7, 2010)

Yes, sometimes in schools there's plenty of equipment (or money) in other areas, just not for performing arts. That's why you often see interesting (and creative) purchases to get what you need within the school system!


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## Tex (May 7, 2010)

I've done this before with some success.
We did NOT use Windows. Although there are some good free windows chat programs, I never trusted the OS to not crash. (This was pre-XP; I don't think the problem is as bad now). 
I went with a version of linux that would boot from a CD. There are versions now that will fit on a small USB drive. Try Puppy Linux or DSL (**** Small Linux). They should come complete with YTalk and XTalk which have some great features, including being able to color code different users and macro keys that will insert pre-defined text.


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## 00AVD (May 7, 2010)

There really are no instability issues with Windows XP onwards when the OS is installed cleanly and not fiddled to death with. Any OS can be made unusable if hacked around with enough! LOL.

That said, if the PCs concerned can be booted from the CD or USB, then going the Linux route may be an option for some people. It does mean that they may not be able to run the chat client along side of whatever other Windows software they need for the show.


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## Anvilx (May 7, 2010)

I tried this in vista ultimate x64. While I could find and run the exe I could not seem to find the function in question.

IRC might be better suited for this.


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## Footer (May 7, 2010)

It's not on Windows 7 either. Really, this is what netmeeting was built for.

sent from my HTC Incredible


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## museav (May 10, 2010)

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the purpose of comms as being applied here but I don't see calling cues or aiming/focusing or follow spot operators or many other typical uses of comms in theatres being practical with a computer based chat approach. Is it communications and potentially useful for some applications, definitely. Is it practical for the type of communications typically required in theatres, that I don't see. And one of the last things I would want is the SM/ASM, riggers, etc. focusing on watching a computer screen rather than watching what is happening on stage.

I have to agree with Kyle, I see way too many examples of people comparing computer based alternatives based on the assumption that the computers are there and have no cost. And I have dealt with way too many corporations and educational institutions in which applications (both functional and software) other than those supported by the people in charge of IT are very tightly controlled.


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## 00AVD (May 10, 2010)

I wasn't thinking specifically of theatre when posting my replies. I do think that PC messaging could be useful for corporate and other school performance use though.

Sometimes schools aren't performing a play or a musical, but still need some sort of communication between two or more areas.

For example, in the high school I help out at (as a parent), it would be great to be able to communicate between the control box and back stage (in performing arts building) as well as the rehearsal rooms in other buildings some 50 - 100 metres away. There are no existing intercoms or phones (and no real chance of getting them), but computer network connections (and Wi-Fi) are everywhere.


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## museav (May 11, 2010)

00AVD said:


> I wasn't thinking specifically of theatre when posting my replies. I do think that PC messaging could be useful for corporate and other school performance use though.


There definitely are potential applications, however I believe that the OP specifically mentioned it being for "show communication".


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## lieperjp (May 11, 2010)

00AVD said:


> I think there's still a market out there for simple text over network software. A freeware solution that could run on existing laptops would be useful.
> 
> At the high school I help out at (as a parent), laptops are a ready resource. A lot of students bring them for school work, or to use on school productions.
> 
> The school Intranet should allow the use of TCP on high port numbers so I can't see a problem there.



IRC software would do that, and a lot more.

Even just use software such as AIM or Windows Live... Skype if you want voice. Though it is not super reliable. 

Novell Client Services (a lot of schools use this, sadly...) does simple text over network, provided your admin hasn't disabled the feature to prevent chatting during classes.


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## MarshallPope (May 11, 2010)

Well, if we are getting into internet-based systems, let me suggest Tinychat.com if you are just looking at text. It lets you start a chatroom just by entering the address with whatever name you want (Ex: tinychat.com/insertyournamehere ) This would be a lot easier than configuring a system when internet is available.

EDIT: Hmm. It has changed since the last time I have used it. Audio and video are now available.

EDIT PS. The "save" button to edit the post says "vote now."

EDIT EDIT PS. I tried again and it says save now.


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## 00AVD (May 11, 2010)

The problem with a lot (most?) of those chat programs is that they require an outside party for the initial negotiation. This is my understanding of them anyway. I'd rather a specific point to point system where the traffic never leaves the LAN.

Schools tend to lock down outside access of these ports (via a firewall), but there's not a lot of filtering on the LAN itself. I asked a local school IT admin about this the other day and he said as much.

Even if you don't use the existing LAN, a network switch and some CAT5 will get you going. People give / throw away 10mb (and 10/100mb) switches all the time as they upgrade to 1000mb units.


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