# Blinder Basics



## jmac (Oct 13, 2009)

Ok, more first rock concert lighting questions. When are blinders typically used, and for how long? Just flash at big moments, blink to the beat, or other uses?

We have two S4 Par's with VNSP lenses which actually do decent job, as this a small venue. Was thinking of putting scrollers on them to throw out some other colors for possible fun... Thoughts?


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## mstaylor (Oct 13, 2009)

I wouldn't put scrollers on audience blinders. When to use will be dictated by the music and the preformers. Sometimes it will be just flashes, other times it may be an extended cue.


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## ship (Oct 13, 2009)

Audience Blinders other than a Bardswell type HPL type lamped PAR 64 fixture are typically using PAR 36 or rarely PAR 64 type lamps based off the Mole Richardson Mole light bank system. Typically for rock audience blinders the PAR 36 size will be used and either if actual Mole Light the FCS lamp (amongst other types in beam spread or color temperature) or the more normal Thomas type design using a DWE medium focus normal color temprature lamp amongst other above options for lamp. Different lamps - one has screw terminals, the other has ferrules but otherwise the exact same lamps.

Both and all versions of them are rated for 25 hours which is why I laughed at one point a few years ago at a venu that wanted to use such lighting for house lighting. Given that lamp hour... sure you could use these high output lamps for what ever you with but it most likely would not be cost effective.

Again use them for what makes your art but it's a 25 hour lamp in the end and very possible that you could persay not have enough of them by mid-show if using their high output punch used too much. Blinking as with flashing don't persay hurt them if warmed by the dimmer much more than a long stay on with blinding the audience. Depends on the use given the lamp life as statement.

A VNSP PAR 64 S-4 is bright but a different beam spread from a typical audience blinder. Did you mean audience blinder using ACL lamps #4596 lamps also with 25 hours to them? Two S-4 PAR 64 fixtures verses a bank of like eight PAR 36 beams of light won't have the same effect either if even intensity of the run in series 28v 250w lamps.

Fun with scrollers... it's a thing but in general if thinking audience blinder they would not be as the concept wondered about. Talking about a bank of lamps verses two fixtures.


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## derekleffew (Oct 13, 2009)

Less is more, in my opinion. I tend to use them only when the artist talks directly to the crowd, or to get the audience "riled up." With this philosophy, I also agree scrollers could probably be put to better use elsewhere, perhaps on the center stage backlight specials.

If two VNSPs cover the entire audience, you've got either a very small or very large house. One usually wants as wide a fixture as possible, that still maintains intensity.

See also audience blinder, Molefay, 8-Light, 9-Light.


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## JD (Oct 13, 2009)

Back in the 80's the FAY bank was the standard. Generally, any bright lamp will work. The variance is how fast you want the lamp to come on and fade out. For club shows, I often used the BEP photo-flood, a 300 watt R30 with a 4 hour life. They had a very fast rise and fall time, but I believe the lamp has been discontinued. (Not to be confused with the 12v 55w desk lamp!) Blinders can either be used for general show, or as a specific effect. For example, we did a Pirate show where there were a lot of things happening throughout the room, climaxing with a blinder effect behind a guy who wanted to silhouetted on stage. In that case, the trick was to come up with enough light to leave him in silhouette, but still be visible, so the source had to be spread out. In the typical "kick" effect for rock bands, you almost want a point location that radiates outward. There are not too many formal rules when it comes to blinders


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## Grog12 (Oct 13, 2009)

/thread hijack] Sorry when I first saw the title to this thread all I could think was "Well you take a bunch of PAR cans and point them at the audience, doesn't get much more basic than that." /thread hijack over]


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## len (Oct 13, 2009)

IMO, they're used way too often. I don't want to see the crowd, I want to see the stage and the performers. If I see them more than 2 - 3 times (and I mean more than 2 - 3 different songs, etc. It's ok to punch them a few times for one song) I'm bored with them.


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## shiben (Oct 13, 2009)

I like them when used appropriately, ie, during the beginning of a big chorus, when the pit is going wild, etc. I was at an AFI show that had a couple blinder effect 4 lamp units (unsure of the make/model, they were in the air), and they used them for almost the entire opening band (circle pit ftw) at about 25%. Worked wonderfully for the situation, and they were on for a long time. However, went to another concert where the blinders were on maybe every other song, and it just was too much.


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## rschwimmer (Oct 14, 2009)

Rave: NO MOLES

Cooperate: NO MOLES

CONCERT/ROCK: MOLES MOLES MOLES.

Its all up to the board op, and how the designer of the show wants them used. Some ask for the 8 lights, some ask for the 9 lights, and some ask for the 4 lights. Some will want scrollers on them (which are a pain in the BEEHIND...LOL, but look sweet). 
I used to like to use S4 pars VNSP lensed, and have either clumps of them, or have them spread out, and all of them pointing directly at the crowd. But that of course is just me.


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## MSLD (Oct 14, 2009)

Whenever you feel the crowd getting lame and bored, turn em on and get them "pumped" and use it when you need to get the crowd involved. Iv used moles for 2 songs straight and nobody complained.

BTW, one mistake, call them "Audience Abuse" lights


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## Raktor (Oct 14, 2009)

I've also heard the rule of _anymore than two songs and it's excessive_.


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## JD (Oct 14, 2009)

EXCEPTION:

Ahh! To all rules, there are exceptions. One summer night in 1980, when I was not working, we had a band come in to the theater. Their lighting guy (would not exactly call him a designer) proceeded to set up their show which consisted to 14 circuits of ACL's all in white or light pastels, over head and to the rear, with no dimmers! (Just relays.) I fully expected the show to stink on ice, if you know what I mean. I was shocked! It was good. His timing and how he had things worked out with the band was spot on. From a lighting perspective, I guess the "light show" would be the musical equivalent of the group "Stomp." (The act that comes on stage and bangs on things like trash cans and buckets with a result that is quite musically entertaining.) Although I could not for the life of me imagine how he could do this night after night and not go insane with boredom, I have to give credit where credit is due and say his work was far beyond the expectations I had for the show. In summary, even a show that is nothing but blinders (for the most part) can actually work if thought out well enough.


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## fastfreddy (Oct 14, 2009)

If its a small enough venue to only need two S4 pars, you might want to put the blinders behind the band, I find sillouets and shadows wont piss of the crowds as much as straight blinding. Also, if you put a deep enough color in it, you can leave em on for much longer, Ive found. Course, then its not really a blinder! Good Luck and have fun!
FF


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## MSLD (Dec 28, 2009)

Raktor said:


> I've also heard the rule of _anymore than two songs and it's excessive_.



It was Neal McCoy. He told me too.


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