# Videotaping Copyrighted Performances



## BrockTucker (Apr 11, 2010)

Did a search and surprisingly couldn't find anything on this topic.

It's always been my policy that there is absolutely no videotaping during a copyrighted performance, i.e. plays and musicals you have the buy the rights for. This didn't really matter much because until recently I wasn't the one making the call on whether that would be allowed or not, I just gave my opinion and the powers that be did what they wanted.

Well now I'm the powers that be and I'm catching a lot of flack from actors, family members, etc for this policy. Apparently most of the theaters around this area have no problem with it.

So, question for the hive mind, how strict are you on videotaping? How do you enforce it/say no?

Really just looking for some evidence that I'm not the only grumpy old man being harsh about this.


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## wolf825 (Apr 11, 2010)

Well...you're not the only grumpy person. 

FWIW....for rental clients we leave that decision for taping and recording and enforcement up to them..that is policy since the client is simply using our venue and we are not producing the show or musical. Since they purchased the rights, casting and are running it top to bottom--its up to them if they allow it to occur and its part of the contract that its their problem and we are absolved and held harmless from the acts of their patrons, guests ad they agree to be held liable and responsible for any consequences or future complaints etc etc etc... 

IF we get an OK from a rental client that they are hiring a vid crew etc to tape a show--great for them--but all we will at most provide is a split off our Hearing Impaired FM or IR system which is a high gain and highly compressed mic over-stage to pick up the room for audio.. That is about as far as we go... Even if the client is OK with it--they have to do it themselves, bring in their own gear and own persons to DO it etc etc--we wont use our equipment to do any recordings and we won't help them or provide them what they 'forgot' to bring for adaptors or cables... Since our FM or IR Hearing assist system is already 'broadcasting' within the room the sound--to comply with legal issues, our legal beagels figure that is the length we can go and if someone taps into that--nothing we can do as we have to comply with the ADA requirements. 

Our Staff do not do any actual taping or recording of ANY event due to these issues of copyrights and pirating etc. We are always asked--hey can you burn this to CD or make a tape for me or can oyu run my camera for me while I'm on stage etc..or hey can I get a feed of the show mix for my camera...the answer is flat out NO--our staff will not participate in, foster or carry out any act which could be viewed or taken as a copyright violation or act of piracy or theft. Don't care WHO is giving consent or asking--we just make it flat policy. People don't like it--we tell them to first get a written release from every performer and then call up BMI AIM, ASCAP, MCPS etc etc etc etc and have them send written official permissions etc etc etc and then have our own copyright enforcement office sign a release etc etc etc etc etc....

FWIW--that is how we deal with it...for rental groups we let it be their problem and we won't support it....for our stuff--we just say NO and don't even ask us cause it wil always BE a giant NO....

-w


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## Footer (Apr 11, 2010)

Nearly every publisher allows for one "archive copy" of a given work. This is for the sole purpose of the theatre and is not to be sold or reproduced. Mom and dad don't get to bring in cameras. DVD's should not be made and passed out to the cast. 

If you are in a AEA house, to record a show you have to jump through a ton of hoops. The SM, deputy, and I want to say regional office all have to approve the taping.


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## Sayen (Apr 11, 2010)

As a school, we do not record any events because of the legality of the situation...I won't even give a parent a line out from the board. I've made this a firm position with students, parents, and my administration. I let renters do whatever they want, since as I understand it the rights are on their head, and I don't have the time or ability to double check what they do.

I'm getting closer to a firm banning of any pre/post show music that is copyrighted...no more favorite band CDs. I've done it for my own productions, and I'm considering telling groups they cannot play copy protected material through my system. This is largely a teaching issue, trying to train my students to understand and respect the law. Unfortunately it seems like artists are the ones most likely to NOT respect someone else's work.

I have a difficult time telling parents they cannot video tape their child on their own. I usually just make a point to not notice those cameras, while posting something in writing in my program or at the door to the theater.


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## JackMVHS (Apr 11, 2010)

Our director and I both take a strong position on absolutely no photography or videotaping during a production, as well as during rehearsals. We just don't want to take any chances. We make it very clear in the playbill and with pre-show announcements that audio/video capture of the show is strictly prohibited and illegal. About once every run of a production we will see someone setting up a camera. If we see this, we will let them know that it is not allowed and that they must put the camera away.

This has worked well for us, despite a few complaints from actors families, etc. I'm glad our director is so stern with this, because we could get in a lot of unnecessary legal trouble that we don't need, and because cameras are just distracting to begin with, ENJOY THE SHOW!

The only exception we make is for our archival copy (which we request rights for from MTI or wherever we are licensing from).

BY THE WAY: We are a high school.


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## jwl868 (Apr 11, 2010)

The US Copyright Office website should be able to help you:

U.S. Copyright Office

A good article on copyright basics is here:

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.pdf


Joe


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## Dionysus (Apr 11, 2010)

I have to agree with Footer (as is often the case). The only 'video tape' of such a performance/show/production allowed is an 'archival video', which even has restrictions on who can view it when.

Around here, even small amateur community companies abide by this rule. I am sure there are a few who break it.

Now if you want to dish out a WHOLE LOTTA DOUGH for rites to videotape, and distrubute/sell said tapes... You may come to a dollar-amount that could be agreed upon with the rights-owner. Don't think it would ever be worth it.

Sufficed to say it is a 'no-no'.

You should take the due-diligence to see that people in the audience do not video-tape or photograph, or audio-record the performance as well.


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## dcolson003 (Apr 13, 2010)

JackMVHS said:


> Our director and I both take a strong position on absolutely no photography or videotaping during a production, as well as during rehearsals. We just don't want to take any chances. We make it very clear in the playbill and with pre-show announcements that audio/video capture of the show is strictly prohibited and illegal. About once every run of a production we will see someone setting up a camera. If we see this, we will let them know that it is not allowed and that they must put the camera away.
> 
> This has worked well for us, despite a few complaints from actors families, etc. I'm glad our director is so stern with this, because we could get in a lot of unnecessary legal trouble that we don't need, and because cameras are just distracting to begin with, ENJOY THE SHOW!
> 
> ...


 
We are the same way for the high school theatre I manage. We make it very obvious that recording and photogrpahy is prohibited. If we find someone during a perfromance we will go done and talk to them about it and tell them they have to put it away. This year we started buying the rights to record the show and have it recorded by a company and people are able to purchase DVDs. Same thing we have a photographer come in ane people are able to purchase pictures that he takes. We also limit photography and recording during our dance performances, again a DVD is available for purchase after the event and we find more people prefer this because of the quality of the company. They use three cameras throughout the theatre and fade everything. The photogrpahy is a big pet peeve for us. One for the safety of the performers, nothing is worse than being on stage and their are flashes going off, especially dance shows we really emphasize the no FLASh for the safety of the performers. We actually just had an incident at our last show where there was an audience member using flash and I had to go talk to her during the performance.


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## BrockTucker (Apr 13, 2010)

Thanks everyone for the responses. Is there a cost for the rights to create an archival copy with most rights houses? Also can you give me an idea what you're paying for the rights to make and sell a DVD?


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## sk8rsdad (Apr 13, 2010)

BrockTucker said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses. Is there a cost for the rights to create an archival copy with most rights houses? Also can you give me an idea what you're paying for the rights to make and sell a DVD?



The question covers too much territory for any meaningful answer. Recording rights and their associated cost vary depending on your status (amateur/professional/academic), the nature of the production (musical/play/scene/one-act/competition/...), the publisher, their agreement with the author, whether the piece includes other materials that are protected by copyright. In many cases, the publisher may not be authorized to negotiate recording rights.

Read your license agreement and abide by the terms, or contact the publisher and follow their procedure for amending the contract to obtain additional rights.


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## Footer (Apr 13, 2010)

BrockTucker said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses. Is there a cost for the rights to create an archival copy with most rights houses? Also can you give me an idea what you're paying for the rights to make and sell a DVD?



MTI will actually issue "DVD Rights" to schools and community theatres. Usually though you can only get the rights to reproduce the show if you are doing the student version of the show. From what I have been told, this is only available on a handful of shows. 

Personally, I don't know who would want to sit down and watch a DVD of a performance of any HS show shot on a crappy consumer grade camera with constant autofocus... but thats just me.


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## shiben (Apr 14, 2010)

Footer said:


> Personally, I don't know who would want to sit down and watch a DVD of a performance of any HS show shot on a crappy consumer grade camera with constant autofocus... but thats just me.



Make that for any show. Who really wants to sit around and watch a poor copy of the production, when you can go SEE it in person? So much better and more meaningful, in my mind. My question for parents, if they want to get a video copy of the performance, is to ask them if they will ever watch it again. The answer is usually never.


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## zmb (Apr 14, 2010)

At my school we have videotaped performances and sold DVDs to the cast and crew *only* and haven't had an issue. The best place to check is the publisher's website if you have questions on a specific play or musical.


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## museav (Apr 15, 2010)

wolf825 said:


> FWIW....for rental clients we leave that decision for taping and recording and enforcement up to them..that is policy since the client is simply using our venue and we are not producing the show or musical. Since they purchased the rights, casting and are running it top to bottom--its up to them if they allow it to occur and its part of the contract that its their problem and we are absolved and held harmless from the acts of their patrons, guests ad they agree to be held liable and responsible for any consequences or future complaints etc etc etc...


Definitely something to run by an Attorney. I can see this being at odds with some of the other issues often discussed here in regards to outside parties, for example if the renters are required to use venue staff or have someone from the venue present or even if someone from the venue simply is present, it may be difficult to abdicate all liability regardless of what the rental agreement says. And if they are paying for the venue, and thus the venue is profiting from the event or performance, that adds yet another potential factor. So have an Attorney review your specific situation and the language used.


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## NHStech (Apr 19, 2010)

We are a high school and on the form groups fill out I ask them whether public videotaping is allowed or not. However, I also make note that it is their responsibility to police this. I have too much to do without the added burden of being in the house and staring at a patron to determine whether he is using his digital camera to record video or is just lining up a picture. 
On the occasions where I have talked to a patron about videotaping - partcularly if it is a copyrighted play/musical - they have been receptive when I am apologetic and tell them the group they are suppoting could get into a lot of trouble with the company that owns the rights, as it is a LAW one cannot videotape.


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## jowens (Apr 19, 2010)

As a director of a high school show and the video production club, I would say that getting the video rights to a show (especially from MTI) is not at all expensive. We've done it for a few years now, and it is a tremendous fundraiser.
Usually MTI charges $75 for the rights to video, duplicate and sell your production of their work as you wish.
We end up with a three camera shoot, tricaster video mixer, some high quality recording mics, mixed with a feed from the board. Video-kids come for the week before the show to learn cues.
I buy my DVD's and cases from Uline, and print them myself. Entire cost - $1.50/disc.
We video our Thursday night show, duplicate immediately and sell them at the Friday and Saturday night show for $20 bucks. The quality is great and this year, DVD's made us about $3,000 bucks. Back when we did "pre-orders" and duplicated after the fact, we only made about $1400.
If you're committed to a few year plan, this will pay for your equipment and you'll be good to go for quite some time. Equipment rental also isn't a bad idea. It took us about 4 years to get to the point where we have the right equipment for the job, now it's like clockwork.
Good luck!

btw, parents and relatives and the kids themselves love this, don't underestimate the potential for affecting positive change for a students life. Since our show 3 weeks ago, I've seen at least a dozen parents who 'put the dvd on repeat.' 'my youngest kid can't stop watching..' etc. etc.


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## gafftaper (May 6, 2010)

I sent a question when this thread came up to an entertainment lawyer named Gordon P. Firemark. He has a great website with all kinds of free and interesting information posted. Yesterday he answered my question. 

The short answer: You can be fined up to $150,000 per copy of the show and blacklisted so you are never allowed to get rights to a show again. OUCH! 
See the complete answer here. 

He also has many links down the right side of the screen. I recommend you check out information in the "categories" section located second up from the bottom in the right column. You'll find answers from Mr. Firemark on a variety of legal entertainment questions all organized by topic.


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## NHStech (May 16, 2010)

Very eye opening. However, can we expand this a little bit? What about band/choir concerts? Is anyone aware of restrictions on these? The music performed is copyrighted, and bought by the band/choral department, but I can't seem to find anything about restrictions on recording. Mind you, I am not talking about individual house's positions (some directors seem to not care, some do), but something similar to MTI, etc.


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## MisterTim (May 16, 2010)

NHStech said:


> Very eye opening. However, can we expand this a little bit? What about band/choir concerts? Is anyone aware of restrictions on these? The music performed is copyrighted, and bought by the band/choral department, but I can't seem to find anything about restrictions on recording. Mind you, I am not talking about individual house's positions (some directors seem to not care, some do), but something similar to MTI, etc.



You cannot record and/or distribute copyrighted music without obtaining rights to do so. As far as I know, you are allowed to record for archival purposes only.


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## museav (May 16, 2010)

Performance rights and recording/distribution rights are separate rights.


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## HornsOverIthaca (May 29, 2010)

gafftaper said:


> I sent a question when this thread came up to an entertainment lawyer named Gordon P. Firemark. He has a great website with all kinds of free and interesting information posted. Yesterday he answered my question.
> 
> The short answer: You can be fined up to $150,000 per copy of the show and blacklisted so you are never allowed to get rights to a show again. OUCH!
> See the complete answer here.
> ...


That sounds kind of outrageous. Did he cite any cases where this happened? Who does he normally represent?

Lets say a parent starts filming away at a high school play or musical. Who's responsibility is it to go stop this person?


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## museav (May 31, 2010)

HornsOverIthaca said:


> Lets say a parent starts filming away at a high school play or musical. Who's responsibility is it to go stop this person?


Everyone's. I will preface my comments by saying that I am not an attorney or copyright law expert. But this is a topic in which I have had some involvement and followed with interest.

Whether you agree with the concept or not, if someone wants to pursue a copyrights issue they have the right to do so against whomever they wish. Typically, the initial onus is on the complainant to show some related real or potential damages, if there are no damages there is no basis for a complaint and many complaints do stop there. However, if such damages are reasonably shown then the onus is pretty much back on back onto the other parties to show that their actions were not a violation. The reality is that since the goal is compensating potential financial damages, in many copyright cases they will go after the parties who can or seem most able to pay, which would likely be the school, school district, club or association, etc. rather than a single individual.

You can put the responsibility for the other party to obtain rights into a Contract but I can also see that as a party obviously aware of such issues since you are addressing them in the Contract, that may not release you from all obligation. I can see certainly see someone arguing that there is a responsibility to take reasonable steps to ensure such obligations noted in the Contract are fulfilled in order to avoid all related liability, if you put it in there it is your job to enforce it. This is why I suggest discussing any Contract language with a qualified attorney rather than assuming that any Contract language completely removes you from any liability.

Even if the school is found to be protected due to the Contractual language, then that defense being used potentially lends credence to the argument that damages occurred and were the responsibility of some other party, possibly strengthening the case against those other parties. Thus a school or school district may be sued just to put them in the position of supporting that there was another party at fault. So it really can be in everyone's best interest to be proactive in preventing any cause for a copyright infringement suit.


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## Grog12 (May 31, 2010)

HornsOverIthaca said:


> That sounds kind of outrageous. Did he cite any cases where this happened? Who does he normally represent?
> 
> Lets say a parent starts filming away at a high school play or musical. Who's responsibility is it to go stop this person?



It sounds outrageous but its not.

museav has allready answered this question a lot more elequently than I can so I won't set repeat what's allready been said. But there are other copyright issues beyond just the script.

Scenic Design: By definition is copywritten when its created.
Lighting Design: Same thing.
Costume Design: Same thing.

And since its where I butter my bread:

Choereography.


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## TheLightmaster (May 31, 2010)

One of the theatres I work for has a humourous 'cellphone announcement' done by a few actors, usually relevant to their characters or the setting of the show, that states that you are not to use yor phone, take pictures, or videos. It's good because it adresses a serious issue but is fun too.


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