# Preferred screwhead type?



## derekleffew (Jun 14, 2009)

If you had a choice, barring budget and other realities, what head would you use?


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## avkid (Jun 14, 2009)

In ideal world, I would still probably use Phillips as that's what i'm used to.

It's much easier to back out a Phillips screw that you can't see than a slotted one.


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 14, 2009)

Robertson all the way. Of course I assume we are talking scenic and construction jobs here.

The biggest downside with Robertson is that if you use the wrong size driver and strip it out, it's harder than a stripped phillips to remove. With the right driver, it is near impossible to strip, plus, the square head holds a screw, so you can pop on a screw and reach in a tight space and not have it fall off. 

Both Robertson and Torx and great improvements on slotted and Phillips. However, where Phillips and slotted gain the advantage is that, for the rest of the world, you can fudge your way by with one or two slotted and phillips head drivers your whole life and turn almost anything you come across. With Robertson, Torx, Hex and all the rest, you need to proper sized driver if you want a shot at turning that screw. Maybe fine for tool junkies like me but not everyone seems to want a box full of drivers when one or two in the junk drawer has been fine.


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## soundlight (Jun 14, 2009)

I wish more people would use square/robertson. I put square drive screws in to equipment racks as often as possible, and find that they strip out the least.


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## Les (Jun 14, 2009)

soundlight said:


> I wish more people would use square/robertson. I put square drive screws in to equipment racks as often as possible, and find that they strip out the least.



They're also a little more tamper resistant, being that not many people walk around with a square bit on them. I also agree with gafftapegreenia that it's a lot easier to get them to stay on the bit when you can't hold the screw in place with your fingers.


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## thatactorguy (Jun 14, 2009)

Like avkid, I'm also used to Phillips and generally stick with them, but I love the Robertsons. In a pinch, a Phillips bit can be used to pull them out (slowly! lol), and both the Phillips and Robertsons are still easier to remove if a little paint gets in them; not so with the torx, in my experience...


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## porkchop (Jun 14, 2009)

I'm a bit fan of Torx, a lot of things I have are put together with them so I have all the bit sizes handy. Robertson is good too but we always call it Canadian drive and it's more fun to razz the Canadians if we don't use it.


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## avkid (Jun 14, 2009)

gafftapegreenia said:


> With the right driver, it is near impossible to strip, plus, the square head holds a screw, so you can pop on a screw and reach in a tight space and not have it fall off.


 I just use a magnetic drive guide.


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## DaveySimps (Jun 14, 2009)

I prefer Phillips, just from a standard maintenance standpoint. There is always a Phillips driver available everywhere, you do not have to worry about forgetting the right driver, loosing your only driver in the work truck on a gig, etc. It is all in what you are use to.

~Dave


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## Footer (Jun 14, 2009)

Take a look at these... they are amazing...

Phillips II High Performance Screws - Home


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## seanandkate (Jun 14, 2009)

Gotta say Robertson. Not just because is one of the slickest Canadian inventions ever (is my Canuk side showing?), but because it holds a screw like anything. Good design doesn't need additional 'magnetic drive guides.'
I will now go eat some back bacon with my beaver . . .


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## thatactorguy (Jun 14, 2009)

Footer said:


> Take a look at these... they are amazing...
> 
> Phillips II High Performance Screws - Home



Coolness. Just the ribbed Phillips bits themselves make a huge difference not only in driving/removal, but holding as well...

Anyone know (or want to hazard a guess) why slotted is still made? Very old design, but it can't be for sentimental reasons


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## avkid (Jun 15, 2009)

Footer said:


> Take a look at these... they are amazing...
> 
> Phillips II High Performance Screws - Home



That is very interesting.


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## gafftaper (Jun 15, 2009)

Be careful with those Phillips 2 screws. You have to have the correct bit. I had a box of 3" Philips 2's get mixed in with the regular's and my students stripped nearly every screw because the normal Philips head driver just couldn't deal with them. 

Personally I would much rather just keep my shop simple. If everything would fit a #2 Phillips driver I would be a happy camper. 

I took over a highschool program that was all Robertson and converted to Philips because the screws were so much more expensive and the students had a harder time learning how to drive them correctly. You would be surprised how easy it is to strip out a Robertson if you are 14 and have never used a screw gun before. I've had far more success teaching students to use phillips heads. Plus if they screw up the screws and the driver bits are a lot cheaper to replace.


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 15, 2009)

Those Phillips II remind me of the Pozidrive. The biggest problem with Phillips is that by their nature they were DESIGNED to cam-out due to their initial use on automated machinery before finely tuned torq drivers were developed. From what I understand Pozidrive has greatly replaced Phillips in Europe. By anything from IKEA and there are almost assuredly going to be Pozidrive fasteners holding it together.

Also for the history lesson, the Robertson drive is older than the Phillips by nearly 30 years. However, Mr. Robertson was much more protective of his patent than Mr. Phillips. When approached by Henry Ford, who was looking for a screw to speed up the assembly process, Mr. Robertson refused to license his screw to Henry, having been screwed over (lol pun) on a previous licensing agreement. Mr. Phillips on the other hand didn't press his patent, and thus with widespread use, followed by several imitations on the marked, lost the patent it in the 40's, whereas Robertson remained patented till the 60's. Of course, by that point, Phillips had come to dominate. I think in the future, as has already begun to happen in the past few years, we will see Robertson becoming a lot more common here in America.

Also, when buying your Phillips bits (or any really) please don't cheap out and go for the cheapest bits on the shelf. The cheap bits strip faster, which lead to more stripped screws, OR if you are diligent about swapping out stripped bits, a usage of more bits. In the long term you are loosing money by buying cheap bits. Myself, and of course showing my DeWalt bias here, like their contractor sized bit packs. To each their own I guess.


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## Erwin (Jun 15, 2009)

The fact that there are answers other than Roberston in the poll shows that the majority of the user base here at CB is American. 

I can't for the life of me figure out why flat/slot screw heads are even being made still!?

Phillips is ok, but still, I can't think of a single advantage over roberston.

Roberston all the way!


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## gafftaper (Jun 15, 2009)

Erwin said:


> Phillips is ok, but still, I can't think of a single advantage over roberston. Roberston all the way!



Why use Phillips:
-I have to go to a specialty fastener store to find a full selection of Robertson screws. (Home Depot and Lowes carry some but not all sizes and not in a large quantity to make them reasonably priced).
-Robertsons will cost me 2-3 times the price of Phillips head screws when I finally do find the ones I want. 
-A Robertson bit costs about $3 each. I can get 25 Phillips bits for $10. 

In the end it's just a screw. (_Sorry, couldn't resist that._) Once it's in place, it holds the same be it Robertson, Slot, or Phillips. The advantages of the Robertson head for driving the screw simply do not justify the extra expense and time of acquiring them for many of us. 

Are Robertson's easily available and priced the same as Phillips up there in Canuck Land? If that was the case I'm sure many of us down here in 'Merica would switch.


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## Dionysus (Jun 15, 2009)

Defiantly have to go with Robinson... They are a million times better, especially when using a cordless screw gun.
And yes Robinson screws and drivers are much cheaper in Canada than in the states. Good thing I live in Canada... Really in Canada the only stuff that has slotted or Phillips screws comes from out of the country, mostly from the US.

I ALWAYS have at least my Robinson Green and Red drivers handy, at any time. And have Yellow and Black in my truck and toolboxes at all times as well.

The heads practically only strip if you are stupid with them, and if they do strip you can usually still manage to work them out and replace them.

I swear by Robinson, especially when working 'live'. Nothing sucks more than dropping a Phillips screw onto a live electrical contact... BOOM.


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## thatactorguy (Jun 15, 2009)

Erwin said:


> The fact that there are answers other than Roberston in the poll shows that the majority of the user base here at CB is American.



I visited British Columbia when I was a year old- does that count for anything?


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## Erwin (Jun 15, 2009)

gafftaper said:


> Are Robertson's easily available and priced the same as Phillips up there in Canuck Land? If that was the case I'm sure many of us down here in 'Merica would switch.



Oh yes! It didn't even occur to me that they would be more expensive south of the border. Bits here are 0.25 each and screws are available in 5K and 10K boxes at any building centre (er Center  )

If any of you Americans want some quality screws (insert joke here) I'd be glad to ship some to you!


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## lieperjp (Jun 15, 2009)

Here in our theatre department (and also personally) I use Phillips. However, I'm working for our maintenance dept. and they use the six-lobe screw for almost everything.


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## jwl868 (Jun 15, 2009)

Learn something new everyday. Up until now, I thought that square slot was just some sort of tamper-proof screw. 

I take it that Robertson was Canadian and that's why it took hold there?

Joe


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## Van (Jun 15, 2009)

At a couple of houses I have worked in, and on a lot of touring shows I've woorked we just called Robertsons "Canadians". One touring show I worked on the MC had a whole drawer of Phillips bits and adapters for the times they were crossing the border 'cause no one up there had the right kind of screw bit. 
One house I worked at, we would always throw a handful of phillips bit in one of the crates so the guys up North could assemble whatever we sent.


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## derekleffew (Jun 15, 2009)

jwl868 said:


> ...I take it that Robertson was Canadian and that's why it took hold there?


From http://www.robertsonscrew.com/index.html:

> In 1908, P. L. Robertson began to manufacture a square recess impression in the head of a screw in Milton, Ontario, Canada. At that time, it was a revolutionary change in the fastener industry. The first patent was issued in 1909 and the last patent expired 55 years later in 1964. For his invention, P.L. Robertson screws and screwdrivers carry his name to this day.


 Along with bacon that tastes like ham, one of Canada's great contributions to society.


Dionysus said:


> Defiantly have to go with Robinson...
> And yes Robinson screws and drivers are ...
> 
> I ALWAYS have at least my Robinson Green and Red drivers handy, ...
> ...


Are you trying to seduce me, Mrs. Robinson?​ 
What's that you say, Mrs. Robinson?
Joltin' Joe has left and gone away. (hey, hey, hey)


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 15, 2009)

I haven't heard them referred to as six-lobe, but rather first knew them as "star" bits before I knew they were TORX.


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## mrb (Jun 15, 2009)

Anyone used the LOX screws? Lox : Screws Designed for Power Tools I got some samples and thought they were great. Probably not the best for scenery though since the bits arent exactly easy to get....


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## Dionysus (Jun 15, 2009)

jwl868 said:


> Learn something new everyday. Up until now, I thought that square slot was just some sort of tamper-proof screw.
> 
> I take it that Robertson was Canadian and that's why it took hold there?
> 
> Joe



Robinsons were designed and manufactured in Canada, however when they tried to market them in the USA they were resisted by both the patent office and such. I don't remember exactly, anyways shortly after an American saw the Robinson screw he designed the Phillips which it was decided would be marketed in the USA, and they would not allow mass use of the Robinson head in the USA.

I remember seeing a thing on the discovery channel about it, quite some time ago.

Anyways that's why they are so expensive in the USA today in part. They're manufactured in Canada and imported, because they cannot be manufactured in the USA. Or at least at one time they could not be.


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## epimetheus (Jun 15, 2009)

I'm going with Robertson's because they always give me a better feel working with them, stay on the bit, etc. My Klein 10-in-1 driver is the most used tool in my arsenal, so bring it all on, slotted, phillips, square, torx, hex.


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## ship (Jun 16, 2009)

Footer said:


> Take a look at these... they are amazing...
> 
> Phillips II High Performance Screws - Home



ACR drivers might or might not work better at times, have not tried the screws. For the most part still a question of the end user over the tip in my opinion. On quick release tips and or screw guides... different topic for me.

Depends on the type of screw and application.

Hex Screw/Bolt, Machine Screw, Wood Screw, set screw etc? Security in ensuring they cannot remove or not?

If just talking about a black oxide coated bugle headed drywall screw, sure Torx, Robertson or Square drive question. Years ago in making scenery, I used to use the phillips drive screws for parts of scenery those striking the set “should take apart.” And square or Robertson screws for those striking the set (once assured there was no square drive bits on hand), were those screws that should not be taken apart. Torx drive drywall type screws were not out back than and I only rarely use them these days say for scaffold plank screws in “Drillcon” form.

Overall in opinion, I still for the most part prefer a phillips drive screw. Something like 25 years of me using a drywall screw since introduced to me as a concept as opposed to nail or wood screw along with cordless drills as opposed to manual means and in time I have developed a certain amount of tension I hold to the screw in ensuring it properly drives without stripping until driven home at which point the power tool twists without need of a clutch or with a clutch setting when softer materials. Works well as with my preference of pistol grip instead of T-Handle power tools. Heck, even works well in technique with a DeWalt right angle cordless toll that’s totally off balance.

Benefits, one can more often with effort with a phillips drive remove the screw once painted, plastered or dirtied up. This at times is difficult and takes a more experienced hand, fresh tip, a knife or if needed a drill out can often be done. All it takes is one stuck pebble of sand perhaps amongst other materials - a bit of paint or what ever and you ain’t never going to take that square drive or torx screw out. 

Disadvantage, those that don’t know how to properly drive a phillips screw or using screw drivers with stripped tips, even in choosing the #1 tip in not thinking about it, often strip the screw in driving it. This much less the pressure on the tip used to remove it in general can even in black oxide coated alloy steel or 18-8 stainless screws in general strip the screw...

Often a question of proper training and use than the screw itself. Square drive and Torx screws don’t require proper pressure on the screw to fully and properly drive them for the most part. You don’t need to be as well trained in listening the - are you “drilling that screw home” or driving it home? This by way of at times perhaps adjusting your angle and pressure and or changing your tip. That square drive tip has a lot of use in it no matter the tension especially on its tip before it gets far enough to strip a screw or tip. Once it’s gone however, might be quite a few screws that cannot be removed later by it - all a training or understanding the full concept and principles of what you are doing type of thing.

Sure, square drive you don’t need to push persay as hard to drive or remove the screw, on the other hand it does need to be fully seated and at times with the same amateurs having problems with phillips screws, they without proper training might not have that driver fully seated. This will strip the screw.


After that, often for me say with machine screws is a huge complaint - you don’t stock phillips!!! “I need Phillips to replace a stripped screw we had to extract!” Most often and normally given I stock the most well stocked fastener walls in the shop, people needing them come to see me for replacement fasteners and for a common fastener, yep it’s slotted I stock. Sorry, my fiefdom and my choice in fastener for machine screw. You want other types of screw, go visit another department/fiefdom and see if a) you can find what you are looking for, and b) if they have it in stock. Otherwise get over it is my view. While I do stock phillips in many types of screw, overall for my purposes, I would rather depend upon the proper torque a slotted screw can provide over that of a phillips screw. It’s a machine screw and we drive them by hand thus easy rapid install with power tool most often isn’t necessary.

Sheetmetal screws be them thread forming, thread cutting, self drilling etc. any number of types I stock and in them I do prefer square drive for the most part if not slotted washer head hex drive. Tapcons - concrete screws are not well done if phillips unless in really soft material, this as with most real thick steel threading screws.

Hex head bolt verses socket head cap screw that uses an Allen key instead of wreanch? Depends on the situation and grade of bolt. Alloy steel often stronger than Grade 8 in normal bolt strength. Grade 5 stocked for common use with Grade 8 or alloy for truss or structural use.

On the other hand recently did a upgrade fob for some light board which got encased within a box on a leash so it wouldn’t walk. Did some special security screws for that, this beyond other types of security screws in use be them Torx or Hex or other. Only one in the shop that has a full security screw bit and key kit in all forms... it limits the ability to access to lots of stuff.

All depends on the situation, application, use and skill level just as with what thread to use NC or NF if threaded into material and thickness which on what material to use. Love for my ground screws for instance to use a 5/16" hex head 10-32 size thread forming green zinc plated slotted hex head 10-32 ground screw standard to the electrical industry along with a few zinc external tooth lock washers and a 18-8 grade stainless steel 3/8" hex top lock nut. Nut driving into the softer screw and with lock washers in use means it ain’t coming apart. Normally the nut is of lesser grade than the bolt but not in the case of a ground screw where it’s useful that green color. Also as benefit, given the 5/16" drive hex of the ground screw in addition to the slotted drive for it, this verses the 3/8" drive of the nut assures no matter the standard tools in use especially if nut drivers, one can properly tension such a screw without needing duplicates to tools.

Pain in the rear when especially when a small size hex socket head screw strips out, pain when any screw strips out. Overall in my opinion, depends on the screw - this with lots of experience in cutting into any type of screw a slotted head with a die grinder so as to later attempt to remove it at best. 

Phillips and slotted screws often a question of pressure on the screw and tip often not properly done, other screws a question resistance to torque given its fully seated. Seen lots of square drive, hex and torx tips that get stripped out and can no longer driver a screw due to not being fully seated. This much less screws driven by them or by crap in the hole that don’t allow the screw to get removed.

For me it all depends on the situation and training of the user. This and or... sorry my fiefdom stocks slotted screws for the most part, deal with them or find another supplier for fasteners often to replace what’s stripped. This much less I stock replacement tools and tips often not asked for before long gone or broken in not asking for in driving such phillips or square drive screws.

Final big thing for me is Phillips verses PoziDrive tips for me. Really really hate PoziDrive screws, even over the weekend I was putting in some drawer glides and what was provided was the other than a phillips tip angle to the driver which easily strips out when using a phillips tip. Years upon years of using phillips drivers on Martin and other Euro gear be it Soco plug or Bud Box and one day a young lady without any persay time under the belt noted the eight notches to such screws in use which instantly changed how we do things in less stripping screws once we made readily available PoziDrive screwdrivers. Really really hate PoziDrive screws. Not better than phillips, strip out more readily and while they look similar it’s totally a different tip angle and driver. That’s a screw with a more pressure than turning force of a driver question than phillips in stripping out more easily thing. Now just to convince the Euro’s and French that PoziDrive sucks.. This as opposed to a Robertson verses Phillips debate... that would accomplish much more. How many multi-tools come with slotted, Phillips and PoziDrive plus Robertson drivers on them???? Phillips and slotted in my opinion for normal use - just a question of proper tool use in using them. Sorry you square drivers... no real need for such a bit type other than for an alternate tip or at times say into metal. Square drive TapCons... sure I think.


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## seanandkate (Jun 16, 2009)

thatactorguy said:


> I visited British Columbia when I was a year old- does that count for anything?



Absolutely. I was under the impression that all visitors to Canada from the US (of any age) were given a complimentary #2 Robertson driver and a Tim Hortons travel mug. Is this not happening any more? What the heck are my tax dollars _paying _for ?!?!?


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## Dionysus (Jun 16, 2009)

seanandkate said:


> Absolutely. I was under the impression that all visitors to Canada from the US (of any age) were given a complimentary #2 Robertson driver and a Tim Hortons travel mug. Is this not happening any more? What the heck are my tax dollars _paying _for ?!?!?



We'll convert them all to Robertson some day! After we infiltrate them unknown and take over their government MUAHAHAHAHA... Have you not noticed the US switch toward a more Canadian health care system??
Next their will be a tim hortons in every city and town in America!!!
HA-HA-HA!

(((of course not completely serious XD)))


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## gafftaper (Jun 16, 2009)

thatactorguy said:


> I visited British Columbia when I was a year old- does that count for anything?




seanandkate said:


> Absolutely. I was under the impression that all visitors to Canada from the US (of any age) were given a complimentary #2 Robertson driver and a Tim Hortons travel mug. Is this not happening any more?



Today a visit to British Columbia gets you a big bag of weed and a trip to prison when you try to come back into the US. You crazy Canadians and your sense of humor. 

According to Wikipedia there were 520 Tim Horton's Locations in the US at the end of 2008. The takeover of America has already begun. Wake Up America! Do you want to be forced to read French on all your packaging? NO! Join the Resistance today at your nearest Starbucks!


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## jwl868 (Jun 16, 2009)

gafftaper said:


> According to Wikipedia there were 520 Tim Horton's Locations in the US at the end of 2008. The takeover of America has already begun. Wake Up America! Do you want to be forced to read French on all your packaging? NO! Join the Resistance today at your nearest Starbucks!



They've taken over in Erie, PA, and we're holding a line in I-80. But they are actually trying to out-flank us through Ohio. :shock:

First the hockey players (no, wait, we really appreciate that). Next, coffee-donut stores. But forget the Robertson screw in these parts. Mention Robertson and you'll hear all about how he hit a homerun into the upper deck at old Three Rivers Stadium. Dissertations on Stargell and the Great One will then follow. 

Joe


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## avkid (Jun 16, 2009)

gafftaper said:


> According to Wikipedia there were 520 Tim Horton's Locations in the US at the end of 2008. The takeover of America has already begun. Wake Up America! Do you want to be forced to read French on all your packaging? NO! Join the Resistance today at your nearest Starbucks!


Yay for Tim Horton's.
Starbucks sucks, they've forgot their original mission.


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## gafftaper (Jun 16, 2009)

avkid said:


> Starbucks sucks, they've forgot their original mission.



No, they've pretty much always been out to conquer the world.


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## avkid (Jun 16, 2009)

gafftaper said:


> No, they've pretty much always been out to conquer the world.


You've never read the book, have you?


> _Schultz, chairman and CEO of Starbucks, and writer-researcher Yang trace the growth and development of Starbucks from a single store in Seattle, which in 1973 sold only dark-roasted coffee beans, to the international business it has become today. Schultz does not conceal his passion for good coffee or for his company. His initial goals were to introduce Americans to really fine coffee, provide people with a "third place" to gather, and treat his employees with dignity._


Amazon.com: Pour Your Heart Into It: How Starbucks Built a Company One Cup at a Time: Howard Schultz, Dori Jones Yang: Books


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## Dionysus (Jun 16, 2009)

This all reminds me.... *looks at clock* time for a new cup of Tim Horton's Coffee!


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 17, 2009)

When I'm at school I miss the wonder of Tim Horton's and those Iced Capps I have here in Metro Detroit.

Oh and that year that the NHL was on strike, and the CBC decided to show Curling all winter, man that was awesome. 

And its a right of passage for metro Detroit 19 year olds to make the crossing to Canada where they magically become the legal drinking age.

But the Canadian government has never given me a Robertson driver, ahem, I think I am owed something here?


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## sk8rsdad (Jun 17, 2009)

gafftapegreenia said:


> But the Canadian government has never given me a Robertson driver, ahem, I think I am owed something here?



That's the problem with people these days, always got their hand out to the government! Get your paws off my wallet. There's no such thing as a free lunch (or a free screwdriver) F***g socialists!!!


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## gafftaper (Jun 17, 2009)

sk8rsdad said:


> That's the problem with people these days, always got their hand out to the government! Get your paws off my wallet. There's no such thing as a free lunch (or a free screwdriver) F***g socialists!!!



No you've got it all wrong dude, he doesn't have his hand out to the government. He's got his hand out to *someone else's* government! That's not socialism, that's been a smart tourist. I say BRAVO. Canada can send me all the free crap they want. While you are at it can I get some of those little maple sugar candies. 


As for Starbucks it's funny that here in Seattle, the birthplace and world headquarters of Starbucks. The majority of people don't drink Starbucks anymore. We have moved on to a variety of other competitors, some are competeing chains, many are smaller "micro-brewery" operations. There is a small independent espresso stand on nearly every corner. We looked at getting someone to open an espresso stand in our theater lobby to sell coffee during the day and events. We couldn't get anyone to do it because there were already over 40 espresso stands in a 1 mile radius. 

In order to get attention these days espresso stands are all converting to bikini, lingerie, or even pastie clad baristas. While I'm not opposed to pretty girls doing whatever they want to make a buck, it sure makes you wonder about the food service and health code issues. There was a big story in the news here last summer about a mother/daughter bikini espresso stand in a wealthy suburb getting shut down. The mother was totally exploiting her daughter's hot young body and if I remember right the daughter was only 17. Which is creepy on so many levels. Crazy days here in coffee town. 

Lucky for my marriage, I can't stand coffee. My wife drinks it and when we are out and she want's one I always try to get her to let me take her to one of the girlie stands but she just hits me.


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 17, 2009)

Wow that's really interesting gafftaper. I can say the same is happening, to a lesser extent, in the Midwest, with newer local chains and many small "micro-brewery" coffee shops. NO lingerie yet tho. 

To sk8rsdad:


seanandkate said:


> Absolutely. I was under the impression that all visitors to Canada from the US (of any age) were given a complimentary #2 Robertson driver and a Tim Hortons travel mug. Is this not happening any more? What the heck are my tax dollars _paying _for ?!?!?



Your countrymen, not mine  
Guess I'll have to hit up Canadian Tire next time I'm south of the border. 

On another point, ship asked:

ship said:


> How many multi-tools come with slotted, Phillips and PoziDrive plus Robertson drivers on them????


Well, if you use any SOG tools, you can swap in the Robertson Drive

And for the Leatherman's with the bit adapter (Wave, Surge, Charge's) you can get the Leatherman Bit Kit with Robertson #1, 2 & 3.


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## sk8rsdad (Jun 17, 2009)

gafftapegreenia said:


> And for the Leatherman's with the bit adapter (Wave, Surge, Charge's) you can get the Leatherman Bit Kit with Robertson #1, 2 & 3.



Robertson #1 & #2 came stock with my Leatherman Skeletool when I bought it at MEC. It may be a regional thing. They need bilingual packaging anyway so my guess is they actually have a Canadian variant.


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## jwl868 (Jun 17, 2009)

If you go to a hardware store in the US (HD, or Lowes or Sears) and buy a "basic" set of screwdrivers (a small set, 4 to 8), you'll get a few slotted screwdrivers and few phillips screwdrivers.

In Canada, what does a "basic" set include?

Joe


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## seanandkate (Jun 17, 2009)

Probably looking at 2 Robbies, a Phillips and a slotted in a set of four; 3 Robbies, 3 Phillips, 2 slot in a set of eight.


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## gafftaper (Jun 17, 2009)

Here you go... 

A basic 6 piece screwdriver set from Canadian Tire
2 Robertson, 2 Phillips, 2 slotted

A basic 9 piece screwdriver set from Home Depot in the U.S. 
4 phillips, 4 slotted, one stupid key chain combo to throw away

To take it a little further: Home Depot lists 117 products under Screwdrivers. If you put on the "square" filter you find two products, a single #1 and a single #2... both of which are currently on a half price special!


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## sk8rsdad (Jun 17, 2009)

gafftaper said:


> Here you go...
> 
> A basic 9 piece screwdriver set from Home Depot in the U.S.
> 4 phillips, 4 slotted, one stupid key chain combo to throw away



HomeDepot.ca has lots of Robertsons.


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## Dionysus (Jun 18, 2009)

May I also add that slotted screws are often the bane of my existence. And how many cheap lighting fixtures I've had to hang had slotted screws on the internal components.
In Canada almost any electrical contact screw uses a Robertson! SO NICE!

I just keep extra screws in my pouch, throw away the slotted screws and replace them with Robertson heads!
The last electrician I worked for however caught me and yelled at me for that, something about costing him more money.... Then I figured out how much time I saved by using the Robertson screws, gave that a dollar figure and compared that to the, what $0.05 for the screws... He shut up pretty quickly then...


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## ship (Jun 25, 2009)

If at least of nothing else in me constantly using my square drive to drive ground screws home on a block of them, can Pozi-Drive hate be assured? Different tip assured to strip with a Phillips screw driver in sending it home. Just finished installing some home center grade (same types from a lumber yard) drawer glide for my silverwear cabinet. Didn't have such a tip at home, this much less in the screws provided, their heads were larger than the countersunk holes and I had to grind off the heads flush once sunk so as to make the drawer glide instead of stop and chip away at the caster each time such a screw hit it.

This much less I really dislike the multi-drive head screws esepcially on electrical stuff. Got the square, the slotted and the phillips drive combined into one screw head. Means not enough metal on the head of the screw to properly drive it. Two types of drive was bad enough, three if not also Pozidrive is really not able to tighten - this short of using the slotted or square drive drivers at best. Forget if Leviton or Hubbell rep. was asking me about such muti-drive screws at one point... don't think such advice I gave took root. Just as ETC and CM do a EU verses US version of their products, should be easy enough to produce a product for a market given the most common tool used market.

Worst of any type of screw in my opinion is the multi-drive screw, this followed or included with the PoziDrive tipped if not multi-tip Pozi screw. Curse them tick marks and different tip angle in driving. Don't even work as well in driving, why is such a driver style on the market?


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## gafftapegreenia (Jun 25, 2009)

I will certainly agree with you that those multi-drive screws are evil. They strip instantly. I find you just have to bit the bullet and use a slotted driver. No time saving or convenience.


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