# I'm speechless!



## BillESC (Jul 8, 2010)

*But I can still type*

Just got a few new LED lighting fixtures it and HOLY COW  are they impressive.

Will be playing with them over the weekend and taking some pictures. Mondays post should be enlightening....


----------



## Sony (Jul 8, 2010)

**** it Bill! You're such a tease


----------



## BillESC (Jul 9, 2010)

Couldn't wait.... the TyLED-C336 RGBAW


----------



## derekleffew (Jul 9, 2010)

How does one keep the colorframe in the fixture?


----------



## BillESC (Jul 9, 2010)

That's an optional set of parts. Not much need for media with RGBAW color mixing.


----------



## millamber (Jul 9, 2010)

Lay a medium flood s4 par lens on the front of that sucker and spin it. Its a really neat effect for those type of par LEDs. We also found out that with some "help" the lens will fit in a gel frame.


----------



## Grog12 (Jul 9, 2010)

BillESC said:


> That's an optional set of parts. Not much need for media with RGBAW color mixing.



I'm not sure how much I agree with that statement...but it would be nice to have a place to put a set of barndoors or a tophat.


----------



## WooferHound (Jul 9, 2010)

I tried a search on google for that light but I can't find it
are you sure you have the right information ?


----------



## sk8rsdad (Jul 9, 2010)

WooferHound said:


> I tried a search on google for that light but I can't find it
> are you sure you have the right information ?



Here you go: Longman Light Parco


----------



## BillESC (Jul 9, 2010)

sk8rsdad said:


> Here you go: Longman Light Parco


 
Give that man a cigar. I'm having Longman build fixtures to my specifications. The build quality is quite impressive and the diodes used are manufactured in the U.S.A.


----------



## producer (Jul 9, 2010)

I would be very interested in this! More specifically, color quality, brightness. It is a pity it's not 5 pin dmx, but what do you expect from chinese stuff like this. 

Keep us updated! I'm looking for LED fixtures without flicker for architectural and also stage lighting in a warehouse setting.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 9, 2010)

Grog12 said:


> I'm not sure how much I agree with that statement...but it would be nice to have a place to put a set of barndoors or a tophat.


 
For $ 6.00 I can have the extra parts installed at the factory.


----------



## photoatdv (Jul 9, 2010)

What's the price on these?


----------



## BillESC (Jul 9, 2010)

$ 599.00 is the list price. I'm sure they will street for less.


----------



## producer (Jul 10, 2010)

how much for 5 pin dmx?


----------



## bishopthomas (Jul 10, 2010)

producer said:


> how much for 5 pin dmx?



$15
Amazon.com: Chauvet 5-Pin Male to 3-Pin Female DMX Converter: Musical Instruments
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00180VT2O/?tag=controlbooth-20


----------



## producer (Jul 10, 2010)

I already have a few of those made up. I'd much prefer if they could build these cans with 5 pin dmx as my entire system is 5 pin. I avoid turn-arounds as a permanent install solution.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 10, 2010)

I can have them made with 5 pin DMX, no additional charge.

Here's another new fixture, the TyLED-1TRI 36 three watt Tri (RGB) diodes.


----------



## producer (Jul 10, 2010)

I don't suppose there's any way to do demos up here in Canada.... I'd love to see these units and see how they compare light wise with the microh line (what I'm currently playing with)


----------



## ETCRULZ (Jul 10, 2010)

Wow, I was not aware ETC was making LED pars! That thing would blend in perfectly with the S4 pars I have in my rig right now! I can't wait to get my hands on some. Do you have any figures on light output from the fixture or how well it will blend with its big brother, the S4 par?


----------



## LightingTechie (Jul 10, 2010)

I still prefer the traditional lanterns, I don't think LED technology has developed enough to take over lighting!


----------



## derekleffew (Jul 10, 2010)

ETCRULZ said:


> ... Do you have any figures on light output from the fixture or how well it will blend with its big brother, the S4 par?


Any comparison between an LED and incandescent source is _almost_ meaningless; see the Mike Wood article, _Color Prejudice, or How Bright Is That LED Really?.pdf_.


----------



## xander (Jul 10, 2010)

ETCRULZ said:


> Wow, I was not aware ETC was making LED pars!



This is in no way made by ETC. It is a Parco; manufactured by Longman, if I am not mistaken.

-Tim


----------



## bishopthomas (Jul 10, 2010)

What's the DMX configuration? I'm assuming there's macro, shutter, and dimmer on top of the color control, right?


----------



## xander (Jul 10, 2010)

bishopthomas said:


> What's the DMX configuration? I'm assuming there's macro, shutter, and dimmer on top of the color control, right?


 
Shutter? What do you mean by that?


----------



## BillESC (Jul 10, 2010)

The Parco 336 LED Has 8 DMX channels.

1 - Master dimmer
2 - Red
3 - Green
4 - Blue
5 - Amber
6 - White
7 - Speed
8 - Macro colors, chase sequences, strobe and audio active

Longman is the manufacturer and the RGBAW fixtures are being built to our specifications.

Next week I'll have use of the local auditorium and will take pictures comparing the fixtures to an Altman's 575 Star Par. I'll post the results in this thread.


----------



## bishopthomas (Jul 10, 2010)

xander said:


> Shutter? What do you mean by that?


 
Sorry, I mean strobe. Strobe is often part of the shutter channel in ML's so that's usually how I think of it.


----------



## xander (Jul 10, 2010)

bishopthomas said:


> Sorry, I mean strobe. Strobe is often part of the shutter channel in ML's so that's usually how I think of it.


 
Ok, that's what I figured you meant after I thought about it for a second.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 11, 2010)

Our economy 36 X one watt RGBAW fixture, the TyLED-136 RGBAW




Also available in a 3w version - TyLED-336 RGBAW

BTW, I'm re-naming all of the new fixtures to start with TyLED. In honor of my grandson, the LIGHT of my life.


----------



## Les (Jul 11, 2010)

ETCRULZ said:


> Wow, I was not aware ETC was making LED pars! That thing would blend in perfectly with the S4 pars I have in my rig right now! I can't wait to get my hands on some. Do you have any figures on light output from the fixture or how well it will blend with its big brother, the S4 par?


 
Actually, this is not an ETC. The case design is similar, being a popularly cloned casting. Many other LED pars and incandescnet models share this design. Behringer (Ultra Par, if it's still around), American DJ (Opti Par) and Elation (Opti RGB - LED) being a few that I can think of off-hand.


LightingTechie said:


> I still prefer the traditional lanterns, I don't think LED technology has developed enough to take over lighting!



Depends on what you're looking for. 

I went to a show on Friday (featuring our very own Tex ) and they used LED pars for some close range color washes and I was thoroughly impressed. It was a small space (the show took place in a medium sized auditorium but the audience was seated on stage) but the punch of the LEDs could have been just as effective had we been seated further away in the house. The color was good, and the beam seemed very even. Could have easily fooled me in to thinking there were par cans or fresnels up there, except for the fact that I looked up. I don't know what models these were, but they looked like the traditional LED par can. Sure, they're not ready to "take over", but they have proven very useful -- even indispensable to some mobile event lighting designers. Go run a wedding in an unconventional space with incandescent lighting, then do the same with LED. Tell me which one you prefer at the end of the night.


----------



## Wolf (Jul 11, 2010)

I don't know if this would really be the thread to introduce this idea/concept to but as people are talking about LED's why not. I was meeting with a concert lighting designer and was using LED "Pars" but he would not call them Pars and said he wished they would not be referred to as "Pars" for 2 reasons. 1, they are not producing a parabolic beam and 2, by definition as we all probably know P.A.R stand for Parabolic Aluminum Reflector and LEDs are non of these. It seems LED Pars are closer to fresnels with the focusing ability, more of a soft focus spot. Just something to consider I think.


----------



## xander (Jul 11, 2010)

Off topic, but I'll bite. I agree and disagree. I do agree that they are not PARs for the simple reason stated, they do not have parabolic aluminized reflectors, however, I disagree with the fresnel bit. If you are not calling them PARs then you cannot call them fresnels either because they don't have a fresnel lens. But, I also disagree that the light they output is more similar to a fresnel's than a PAR's. A fresnel beam of light, while soft, has a pretty clear hotspot and then smoothly tapers off as you get closer to the outside edge. A PAR on the otherhand is a much more flat beam that is pretty much the same intensity out to the edge where it drops off suddenly. The LEDs I have worked with beams do more resemble that of a PAR than a fresnel. If you want to get technical, no, they shouldn't be called PARs, but should probably be called "wash" fixtures or something, but I think the nomenclature has developed because the PAR is the type of fixture one would normally replace with the LED "wash."

My $.02
-Tim


----------



## BillESC (Jul 11, 2010)

I believe they took on the name of LED Pars because many of the original offerings were built using an empty Par can and simply inserting the diodes and electronics. If you look at the last picture I posted, you will indeed see that is indeed a Par can housing. If I were to remove the PCB I could easily drop an FFR lamp into it.


----------



## Les (Jul 11, 2010)

Wolf said:


> 1, they are not producing a parabolic beam



I've never heard of a parabolic beam


----------



## sk8rsdad (Jul 12, 2010)

Les said:


> I've never heard of a parabolic beam


 
[HIJACK]
It is a photonics thing.

To quote an abstract:

Miguel A. Bandres said:


> We demonstrate the existence of parabolic beams that constitute the last member of the family of fundamental nondiffracting wave fields and determine their associated angular spectrum. Their transverse structure is described by parabolic cylinder functions, and contrary to Bessel or Mathieu beams their eigenvalue spectrum is continuous. Any nondiffracting beam can be constructed as a superposition of parabolic beams, since they form a complete orthogonal set of solutions of the Helmholtz equation. A novel class of traveling parabolic waves is also introduced for the first time.


[/HIJACK]


----------



## Tex (Jul 12, 2010)

Les said:


> I went to a show on Friday (featuring our very own Tex ) and they used LED pars for some close range color washes and I was thoroughly impressed. It was a small space (the show took place in a medium sized auditorium but the audience was seated on stage) but the punch of the LEDs could have been just as effective had we been seated further away in the house. The color was good, and the beam seemed very even. Could have easily fooled me in to thinking there were par cans or fresnels up there, except for the fact that I looked up. I don't know what models these were, but they looked like the traditional LED par can. Sure, they're not ready to "take over", but they have proven very useful -- even indispensable to some mobile event lighting designers. Go run a wedding in an unconventional space with incandescent lighting, then do the same with LED. Tell me which one you prefer at the end of the night.


Thanks for the plug, Les! I don't get to act much anymore and this was BIG fun.
Those were Elation ELED TRI 64B's. We used 4 of them and I was also impressed with the punch and the coverage. They also have both 5 pin and 3 pin connectors which makes the fixtures themselves a turn around. This was the first time I've used them and I couldn't believe the difference between these and the ADJ LED not really PAR's that I had at my former school. As far as LED's go, I think you really do get what you pay for. A couple hundred more for each fixture can make a big difference.


----------



## derekleffew (Jul 12, 2010)

Tex said:


> ... They also have both 5 pin and 3 pin connectors which makes the fixtures themselves a turn around. ...


(Please excuse the pedanticism...)
A turnaround has the same connector and sex on each end, a gender-changer. Your fixtures could act as adapters.
Just one of my many (too many!) pet peeves, along with 
not specifying the male end first and,
<what the console outputs> to <what the dimmers want> for protocol converters.
(/sorry)


----------



## BillESC (Jul 12, 2010)

The ELED Tri 64B is a nice fixture to be sure but still only uses 18 - 3w tri diodes. The TyLED-C1TRI has 36 - 3w diodes. My meter is reading 19,900 Lux at one meter.


----------



## CrisCole (Jul 12, 2010)

I've never used LEDs. Our theatre can't afford them. 

We still have 16:9s and old old old 8 inch fresnels and scoops.


----------



## len (Jul 12, 2010)

Use of the word (or acronym, to be more precise) PAR to define a light fixture, which is not specifically a PAR, is pretty common. It's one of those words like Kleenex and Xerox. Those Puffs Plus are not Kleenex and that Nokia copier isn't made by Xerox, but everyone knows what you mean. 

And now back to the original topic. 

Bill, curious if you have any photos of the actual output of those fixtures? Say compared to a couple other products which have comparable street prices or something.


----------



## Tex (Jul 13, 2010)

derekleffew said:


> (Please excuse the pedanticism...)
> A turnaround has the same connector and sex on each end, a gender-changer. Your fixtures could act as adapters.
> Just one of my many (too many!) pet peeves, along with
> not specifying the male end first and,
> ...


You are, of course correct. 
I should just take that term out of my vocabulary. Gender changer and adapter are more descriptive of the functions they perform.

CrisCole said:


> We still have 16:9s and old old old 8 inch fresnels and scoops.


Don't dis those 8" fresnels! I haven't had any for a few years and there are still times when I'd love to have that look. Those things make a beautiful pool of light that I can't replicate with any other instrument.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 13, 2010)

Len,

This afternoon I'll be in my local theatre doing a comparison between my TyLED line and a 1K Par and an Altman 575 Star Par. Pictures and meter readings will be posted as soon as available.


----------



## WooferHound (Jul 13, 2010)

Just to be clear . . .
PAR is an acronym for *P*olished *A*luminum *R*eflector


----------



## derekleffew (Jul 13, 2010)

WooferHound said:


> Just to be clear . . .
> PAR is an acronym for *P*olished *A*luminum *R*eflector


To be more clear (and correct) . . .
*P*arabolic *A*luminIZED *R*eflector

See the wiki entry PAR.


----------



## dcollins (Jul 13, 2010)

WooferHound said:


> Just to be clear . . .
> PAR is an acronym for *P*olished *A*luminum *R*eflector


No.


----------



## Grog12 (Jul 13, 2010)

xander said:


> Like I said in my first post about it, it is *Parabolic Aluminized* Reflector...
> 
> -Tim


 
2 times was enough lets move back on topic.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 13, 2010)

Didn't have as much time as I thought I would and had to be quick. The fixture is on a table 20' from the cyc. Average Lux reading was 335


----------



## bishopthomas (Jul 13, 2010)

Which fixture is that? That's a pretty decent white. Is that everything at max?


----------



## BillESC (Jul 13, 2010)

That was the TyLED-C336 RGBAW at full output. About 130w.


----------



## Wolf (Jul 14, 2010)

Seems like a veryly large beam, do you have an estimated measurement? or even photometrics for the unit?


----------



## BillESC (Jul 14, 2010)

This fixture has a 45 degree beam spread (25 and 15 degree are available.) I got a reading of 335 Lux at 20 feet.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 16, 2010)

Would any one like a demo fixture to play with for one week?


----------



## bishopthomas (Jul 16, 2010)

Ooh, ooh! I wanna tri color! PM'ed...


----------



## express (Jul 16, 2010)

id love to try the rbgaw version. again, PM me please.


----------



## BillESC (Jul 16, 2010)

Call the office on Monday. 800-582-2421


----------

