# Drafting Advice



## chawalang (Mar 26, 2015)

Can someone please recommend what version of AutoCAD is the most relevant to our industry? I am looking to start getting re acclimated, I haven't done any drafting for plots or scenery in about a decade.


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## egilson1 (Mar 26, 2015)

Vectorworks spotlight is the dominate cad program for the theatre/special event lighting side of the business. If you are working on the install side Autocad and Revit are still the most common.


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## Footer (Mar 27, 2015)

It really is starting to get a bit more wild westy. It depends on what you are wanting to do. Many of the shops are moving to programs like Inventor (Tait being one of them). A lot of people still use solidworks as well. The reason is all of these programs can easily output files for CNC machines and stuff like that. If you are not doing that, plain old AutoCAD is still in use. Vectorworks is still in play as well, but most TD types won't touch it. I'm still using AutoCAD 2005 if that makes you feel any better. 

I kind of wish I could take a year off and just learn Inventor... and have projects to draft in it.


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## chawalang (Mar 27, 2015)

The main reason I am asking is because I am looking to get re acclimated in drafting again before I go back to school fall of next year. I am looking to get my MFA as a TD and haven't done any drafting since I finished my undergrad almost a decade ago. So getting back into drafting scenery and lx plots.

Footer from what you have told me what version should I look for, you hit the nail on the head as far as what I will be using it for.


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## DasCarpenter (Mar 27, 2015)

chawalang said:


> The main reason I am asking is because I am looking to get re acclimated in drafting again before I go back to school fall of next year. I am looking to get my MFA as a TD and haven't done any drafting since I finished my undergrad almost a decade ago. So getting back into drafting scenery and lx plots.



I was just at USITT, and a lot of TD programs I spoke to talked about using AutoCAD. A couple of the schools I talked to mentioned 2015 specifically. I know you can get a 3 year license by giving Autodesk proof of enrollment. Overall, the prevailing theory I've heard is that the purpose of any drafting software is to make drafting faster and easier. So, if you have something that lets you work quickly and do everything you need, then use that. Anything else, I think you need to figure out how your program will expect it to be done. Best of luck.


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## Footer (Mar 27, 2015)

What school? Are you going TD, scenic, or lighting? If you are going into design, Vectorworks is it. If you are going TD, most regional houses will be using AutoCAD. Version number does not matter that much as long as you are on something newer then 2009. That was the last big shift as far as I know (I could be WAY wrong on that). 

You will find that Academia really likes to always be on the latest version of whatever software they are using. They can do that because education licenses usually allow that for free or cheap. You will also find that in the professional world many companies will sit on software for years long after it is "outdated". This is why I still use 2005 for all my stuff. It still works. It can still spit out a DWG that anyone can open. 

What school are you going to?


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## chawalang (Mar 27, 2015)

I am looking at UNLV, Cal State Fullerton, SDSU and Cal Arts.

As far as being a TD I am looking at more of technical management but feel it will be good to present some drafting of lx plots and scenery once I do interviews.


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## Footer (Mar 27, 2015)

Gotcha. Ya, I would try to get back on the horse. Pick up AutoCAD and start playing with it. I would just stick to the scenery, no point in doing lightplots if you won't be going in for lighting design. Also assume that they will teach you what you need to know about cad. Most grad programs I have talked to assume your undergrad barely taught you about line weights. If you have never played with 3D stuff, now might be the time to start.


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## robartsd (Mar 27, 2015)

Footer said:


> What school? Are you going TD, scenic, or lighting? If you are going into design, Vectorworks is it. If you are going TD, most regional houses will be using AutoCAD. Version number does not matter that much as long as you are on something newer then 2009. That was the last big shift as far as I know (I could be WAY wrong on that).


2009 is the version that adopted the Ribbon interface (copying the general idea from MS Office 2007). I find the ribbon to be easier for new users, but sometimes less efficent for power users. I haven't touched AutoCAD or Revit since 2011, so I wouldn't know if AutoDesk has made any big changes since then.


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## Footer (Mar 27, 2015)

robartsd said:


> 2009 is the version that adopted the Ribbon interface (copying the general idea from MS Office 2007). I find the ribbon to be easier for new users, but sometimes less efficent for power users. I haven't touched AutoCAD or Revit since 2011, so I wouldn't know if AutoDesk has made any big changes since then.



I remember working on a 2009 machine once. Had to get some dimensions off of a drawing... and there was no command line. I freaked out and ran away.


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## robartsd (Mar 27, 2015)

Footer said:


> I remember working on a 2009 machine once. Had to get some dimensions off of a drawing... and there was no command line. I freaked out and ran away.


The command line still existed (I imagine even the latest version can be used from the command line) - but could be hidden (probably the default by now, perhaps even then).


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## MNicolai (Mar 27, 2015)

robartsd said:


> 2009 is the version that adopted the Ribbon interface (copying the general idea from MS Office 2007). I find the ribbon to be easier for new users, but sometimes less efficent for power users. I haven't touched AutoCAD or Revit since 2011, so I wouldn't know if AutoDesk has made any big changes since then.



I'm working in AutoCAD and Revit 2015 these days. AutoCAD 2016 just got released. There were some versions where they hid the command line at first but switching to another workspace layout brought it back. Everyone I know still uses the command line. Biggest change was in 2013 Autodesk adjusted their DWG file format and a 2012 version wouldn't open a 2013 version DWG anymore. Since then, no further file format changes. Autodesk's free DWG viewer (DWG TrueView?) lets you convert file format versions pretty easily if you find yourself working in an older version and someone sends you a file in the 2013 format. Mostly, each year Autodesk adds a couple features you wish they had added years ago, and they move some buttons around to confuse and frustrate you for the first couple weeks after you upgrade.

Autodesk tried to improve the AutoCAD workspace to streamline users' workflows. There were so many legacy users entrenched in their ways though that they could never get much traction in these changes. Where Autodesk has really flipped user workflow on its head (for the better) is in Revit. Unfortunately, the side effect is that going from AutoCAD to Revit is a bumpy transition the first time 'round.

Overall, I have to say I like Revit quite a bit for 3D modeling and stage scenery/lighting/rigging. I've found it much more user-friendly than 3D modeling in Vectorworks. I always felt like I had to trick Vectorworks to model my extrusions like I wanted. Revit gets a bit clumsy though when you get down to the nuts and bolts and nailing patterns for a given set piece. This is where Inventor comes in. Inventor is very powerful at creating shapes that interlock or integrate together, and then generating out exploded assembly views and bills of materials. The way most architecture firms are getting by these days is using Revit for broad strokes to show where materials and equipment are physically located. They'll link CAD details then into their Revit models that diagram out the more specific assembly requirements.

Lot of different ways to skin the cat. Both Vectorworks and AutoCAD/Revit/Inventor are good products. Saw an infographic not long ago that showed that aside from some very few stragglers, the greatest number of users were on Autodesk produts, and basically anyone who wasn't on Autodesk was most likely using Nemetschek. In the wild, I've only ever seen Nemetschek's software used by lighting and staging designers.

Biggest thing is that if you're going to buy an Autodesk license, buy used or buy now. This is Autodesk's last season of product releases you'll be able to buy perpetual, non-expiring licenses for. Come the 2017 season of releases next February, you'll only be able to purchase annual subscription-based licenses.

Bit of an aside --

Nobody I've heard of is using Revit for lighting plots or stage scenery aside from myself. The barrier to entry is high, both in cost and in learning. The application is fifty times overkill for the purpose, but I created all kinds of custom families so that I have universal platforms, step units, side booms, lighting battens, curtains. After a steep learning curve building up my own personal library, I can create the entire production in 3D pretty quickly using my building blocks. Then I can generate cut lists for gels, circuit, dimmer and fixture schedules, rigging schedules with counterweight loads calculated, trim width and height schedules. Never have I had a smoother load-in than last December when I loaded in my first show I drafted entirely in Revit. I probably wouldn't be using Revit if I didn't have it through my day-job at a systems engineering firm, but it shows great promise at being a powerful albeit overkill tool for event production.


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## Timothy A. Samuelson (Mar 28, 2015)

So I'm weird. Prior to entering the entertainment field, I was studying and interning in Architecture. I use SketchUp for EVERYTHING! With the set of plug-ins and components I have, and my years of intricate work on it, I'm so fast that using anything else would only cause problems. I especially like using LayOut. I can take a single 3D model of a set or a rig and put together a full drawing set with perspective views, technical drawings, and renderings. All in one drawing set. 

I know it's not industry standard, but a drawing is a drawing, right? As long as you produce something that the people who need it can understand clearly what needs to be built, wired, hung, etc., I don't care what software it was produced on.


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## chawalang (Mar 30, 2015)

Thanks for all the info everyone, gives me a good idea where to start for what I want to get done.


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## robartsd (Mar 30, 2015)

Timothy A. Samuelson said:


> I know it's not industry standard, but a drawing is a drawing, right? As long as you produce something that the people who need it can understand clearly what needs to be built, wired, hung, etc., I don't care what software it was produced on.


As long as you don't need to exchange drawing files with colaborating designers - in which case it is much more convienient to be using the software that everyone else expects you to be using. Of course .dwx format is supported by most if not all drafting software, so generally using different software is not a problem if others only need to include your model in theirs for referrence.


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## Timothy A. Samuelson (Apr 1, 2015)

robartsd said:


> As long as you don't need to exchange drawing files with colaborating designers - in which case it is much more convienient to be using the software that everyone else expects you to be using. Of course .dwx format is supported by most if not all drafting software, so generally using different software is not a problem if others only need to include your model in theirs for referrence.


That is a valid point. For most of my applications, anything I produce is seen by the client for approval and sent directly to my shop to enter production. 

There's a different type of software out there for everyone all with different learning curves. Find the one that works best for your application; in this instance, part of your search is finding something that can easily be accepted by another designer.


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