# Our crew is on the very tip of walking



## soundop (Apr 23, 2007)

OK I know i have been venting the last few days, but im streesed to hell. ok, so first of all ive been head of rail for 2 weeks, i stayed till 11oclock on school nights wre i had huge assignments due, to do dry runs BY MYSelF on the rail.
so i come to rehearsel today, and walk in on the stage manager talking to a newb whos on rail, but claims he done this before. (before i tell the end of that convo) so i decided to see what he knows.
the first thing i do is walk him over to an out of weght line, and then ask him how A) how to reweght, and B) what is the importance of keeping a line in weght.
his answears were, well you put the weghts above this plate (which has a ring above it) and this is incorrect, so i have to explain you put in betweenthe two plates,and ofcurse he says why, so i have to explain saffty, and pipe weght to this moron. Now heres his answear to keeping lines in weght- it dosnt matter as long as you can move the line. well i have had it at this point. any one up here who works flys knows the wear out of weghts put on your systems, and how hard it is to replace a rope. 
know i ask him how to fly stuff out, on an in weght line, so he walks over and instead of taking th saffty off he trys to pull down he lock, he relizes it isn woking and he los confused, then relizes his mistake. sohe takes it off and i tell him to watch his spike and what to yell before bringing it in, well guess what he misses spike, forgot to yell "fly 8 coming in" and hits the girl i have a huge crush on right on the head.
well i have had it and now i go up for the run and th sm tells me that im no longer in charge, since the "newb knows more the me" (i later found out he explained everything i told him to her and said it was my fault for hitting the girl on the head) ok so know im pissed, oh and the thing i heard when i walked in was "ya i dont really like the guy on rail so try to take-over his cues so we dont have to deal with him" so right now it takes three to run the rail, tomorows our last rehearsel before the show, so i know its way to late to bring in a new kid.
so anyway after rehearsal the sm walks up o me, and just states if you ever crawl behind the cyc during a rehersal again, you will be kicked off crew. heres the kicker there were only 2 people behind the cyc, the ld and the newbie. 
so you guys think i have reason to walk? by the wayi tried to talk to the director and she sid what the sm says goes. so our whole crew is about to walk.


----------



## Edrick (Apr 23, 2007)

Just a quick question, is your stage manager a student too?


----------



## soundlight (Apr 23, 2007)

I will be the first to say that it's much easier to read if you spell correctly and organize sentences logically.

Besides the fact that it was a mess to read, you should always yell out the lineset coming in even if your trainee does not. A lineset smashing someone over the head is not a training experience by any stretch of the term. If the trainee does not call it, _you call it_. And someone who does not know the principles of counterweight systems (which apparently this person did not) should not be working or even being tested on the rail.


----------



## soundop (Apr 23, 2007)

ya, sorry for the mispelling and unorginazation, but this isnt a english club. but i was poed to all hell when i got home, and the lineset was my fault, but i looked away to hear the director say something. the key point to this topic is the stage manager stripped me (who rightfully deserved it) of being head fly master, and gave it to a newb who clamied to know everything about it. i am pretty sure any one would want to kill the sm who madee that choice. and yes the sm is a student.


----------



## soundop (Apr 23, 2007)

by the way, thanks for letting me vent, better i do it here then at the theater (that would involve dropping a 1 ton bandshell on our sm)


----------



## soundop (Apr 23, 2007)

by the way 3 of the 6 crew will be walking tomorow, possibly all 6, so all theyl are 2 dumb newbs who will probaly end up kllling every one on the rail


----------



## Edrick (Apr 23, 2007)

uh oh... I know what's coming for replies when you talk about a student "walk out".


Why doesn't your whole crew go and talk to the drama director calmly, and do it calmly don't just say look unless you do this and that we're all walking. Last time I had half a group of people do that becaus they didn't get along with the "popular" people on the team and they felt that they shouldn't be on the team because they were popular. So they ganged up on me and said they were going to walk. I said fine and anyone can be replaced, they took it to mean that they specifically can be replaced. 

Out of those 6 only 2 walked, and the teams been better off since with a lot less "student drama"


----------



## Eboy87 (Apr 24, 2007)

If we're talking about the experienced heads walking, and leaving people on the rail who can't tell the ***** end of a horse from its head, then go straight to whomever is in charge above the SM. I know this kid and SM are both pissing you off, but if someone gets hurt due to inexperience and/or incompetence, it's your job to point it out to the powers that be.

I agree with Rickblu when he said talk to the drama director or theater manager, or TD calmly, and lay out your concerns and troubles. Back up your reasons why this kid is a danger to those on the deck whenever he unlocks a flyline.

Fly systems are not something for the inexperienced to eff around with, no matter what the SM might think. I'm sure there's someone who knows you and your reputation better than the SM, who, if a student, would tend to make judegement and personell (sp?) calls based on favortism instead of ability. It's your responsability to point out to the powers that be that this kid is a danger to people if he's on fly.


----------



## soundop (Apr 24, 2007)

we went to the director, she said wat the sm says goes, and the whole crew is uncomfortable with the guy up their


----------



## mbenonis (Apr 24, 2007)

Because of the nature of the fly system, I would make it known to school administration that the department is allowing untrained and inexperienced stagehands operate equipment that is extremely dangerous. You may have to play up the safety concern, but that usually gets attention in administrative circles. Be sure to avoid mentioning any personnel issues to administrators - they don't care about that sort of thing, and it makes you look as bad as the PSM and the director by mentioning it.

It is very unfortunate that the PSM is acting immature, and even more unfortunate that the director of the program is unwilling to discuss the issue. After working in a collegiate atmosphere where such behavior would never be tolerated, I've grown very intolerant of situations like the one you've described. If people can't act professionally, they have no business putting on a production in my opinion.


----------



## len (Apr 24, 2007)

Given the litigious nature of people, I would make sure to WRITE EVERYTHING DOWN and send it or e-mail or fax whatever to someone who is outside the loop, such as the principal, etc. Make sure that everyone knows there's a personality problem BEFORE something serious happens, and that you are trying to resolve everything safely, but meeting with some resistance.

Walking off a show never solved anything. I saw a guy do it once on a corporate one-off and he hasn't worked for that company since. I hear he's struggling because word has gotten around that he's difficult to work with. Obviously, I don't know the whole story of WHY he walked off the job, but now he has a reputation for doing that and so other companies are hesitant about bringing him in.


----------



## gafftaper (Apr 24, 2007)

First off this is once again why High School theaters need an adult on staff who runs the theater and trains/leads the crew. 

Former High School teacher here, and I don't advocate walking out in the middle of a performance... learning to get along with jerks and morons is an important job skill you need to learn. On the other hand, I do advocate walking out if the situation is dangerous... and it sounds like you may be getting to that point. You don't realize this but it's already dangerous having you a "trained" high student run a fly system without a trained adult's supervision. I've talked about this before but... there is a theater a few miles from the college we rent for shows. It has taken months of negotiation to reach the point that they are going to allow us to use a college student to run their fly system during our shows. THAT is how it works in the real world. In the real world, you don't just allow anybody who has a half hour training to run a line set. When people screw up a fly system people die. The girl who was hit in your theater is lucky VERY lucky. 

As others have said I would take the entire group who are going to walk together and write down SPECIFIC reasons you want to walk. .. not "the sm is a #!%#"... instead try "The S.M is allowing someone who has no idea what they are doing to run the fly system. It's dangerous for everyone on stage as we have already seen when he hit a student last week. We believe it is unsafe to work on stage if that untrained person is in charge of flying things."

If you don't get any support from the teacher. Take it to the administration. But realize that by going over the drama teacher's head you may be done working in the theater for good. So weigh that choice carefully. Always stress safety and proper theater procedure. If your complaints are about annoying people you will get nowhere. Again working with difficult people is a job skill you need to learn, but working with dangerous people is not.


----------



## Charc (Apr 24, 2007)

Maybe I missed one of soundop's posts, but hear me out on this one.

I'm an advocate for communication. Just as design meetings are necessary on a regular basis before the show goes up, meeting with you S.M. are also necessary. Talk to your SM, ask her(him?) in a calm tone of voice, and with composure what she has heard of the rail crew. Let her know that you are the most qualified for the job, and even if she doesn't like you, or she likes the "newb" better, it is her job to put the most qualified, and therefore safest person on the line (lineset? My theater doesn't have a fly system!!!). Remind her the "newb" has no chance in hell of learning the cues on time, and that she shouldn't be surprised when Act I Scene 7 is missing its flat. Be calm and composed, yet be clear and make all your points. If this doesn't go well. Take the same story to the drama teacher. Say: "I've talked with the SM, and she fails to see the current safety concerns."

By the way! Don't forget to remind her the newb already beamed one girl in the head!


----------



## astrotechie (Apr 24, 2007)

Rickblu said:


> uh oh... I know what's coming for replies when you talk about a student "walk out".
> 
> 
> Why doesn't your whole crew go and talk to the drama director calmly, and do it calmly don't just say look unless you do this and that we're all walking. Last time I had half a group of people do that becaus they didn't get along with the "popular" people on the team and they felt that they shouldn't be on the team because they were popular. So they ganged up on me and said they were going to walk. I said fine and anyone can be replaced, they took it to mean that they specifically can be replaced.
> ...




Well maybe because those 6 felt uncomfortable with the "popular ppl" which were unexpirenced to do a job and screw up and not have a good feed back. And reality check, nobody can get replaced. Also it hasnt been better off since they are gone since they were a help to me, maybe not you, but to me yes. Since they have been gone i have been doing the work of 6 ppl at once, and guess what, if they were there, i could get the work done better and faster. 

Soundpop, talk to the SM or TD or Drama director, calmly, and explain what side you are coming from. And walking out before a show isn't logical. 

That reminds of the idiots that try to load wieghts on the flys at my hs and are like what do you mean. And they are cant be trusted with a singal piece of equip unless it is a bucket with all the items put in it and tell them to carry it. "Reminder: People are idiots, when idiot people and equipment collide, you have diaster." That has been my expirence


----------



## taylorjacobs (Apr 24, 2007)

I am SOOO TIRED of hearing undeserving brats talk about walking out on shows. This is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. THIS IS THEATRE...and not everyone gets along, but thats okay, because you are creating magic onstage...and thats what the goal is.Life is not always perfect...believe it or not you don't always get to work with great people, but what makes a great technician is someone who can get the job done no matter what obstacles or personalities lie in the way. You are not turning your back on one person you are turning you back on the whole cast and crew. This may be something that you don't plan on continuing in college of professionally but outside of high school, theatre relies on contacts..and if this was a professional gig you wouldn't be working in that town the rest of your life. 
As a former teacher of mine always used to tell me
Fake it til you make it.


----------



## soundlight (Apr 24, 2007)

taylorjacobs said:


> I am SOOO TIRED of hearing undeserving brats talk about walking out on shows. This is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. THIS IS THEATRE...and not everyone gets along, but thats okay, because you are creating magic onstage...and thats what the goal is.Life is not always perfect...believe it or not you don't always get to work with great people, but what makes a great technician is someone who can get the job done no matter what obstacles or personalities lie in the way. You are not turning your back on one person you are turning you back on the whole cast and crew. This may be something that you don't plan on continuing in college of professionally but outside of high school, theatre relies on contacts..and if this was a professional gig you wouldn't be working in that town the rest of your life.
> As a former teacher of mine always used to tell me
> Fake it til you make it.



My thoughts exactly.


----------



## soundop (Apr 24, 2007)

well, we got the matruity probem sloved (i found a couple videos, edited it them together and showed them to the newb) and today was much better, and hers the stage managers excuse "you missed a rehearsel" well, she knew i had to miss it to see my great grandpa (95 years old) so just because he was there for one rehearsel, afterive been there for every thing else and spilled blood (waste of blood) he gets fly manager. i cleard things up with him, and he even agreed that the sms reasoning was b*******, but we have to suckit up. bu he straghtnd out to day (of course i sat off half the to cool down and keep from accidently undoing an out of weght electric nd beaming her) but the situations cooled down, thanks for lettin me rant.


----------



## Edrick (Apr 24, 2007)

astrotechie said:


> Well maybe because those 6 felt uncomfortable with the "popular ppl" which were unexpirenced to do a job and screw up and not have a good feed back. And reality check, nobody can get replaced. Also it hasnt been better off since they are gone since they were a help to me, maybe not you, but to me yes. Since they have been gone i have been doing the work of 6 ppl at once, and guess what, if they were there, i could get the work done better and faster.
> Soundpop, talk to the SM or TD or Drama director, calmly, and explain what side you are coming from. And walking out before a show isn't logical.
> That reminds of the idiots that try to load wieghts on the flys at my hs and are like what do you mean. And they are cant be trusted with a singal piece of equip unless it is a bucket with all the items put in it and tell them to carry it. "Reminder: People are idiots, when idiot people and equipment collide, you have diaster." That has been my expirence



Without going into this again or too far, since this topic isn't about this. There was only two people that left and only one was actually part of the group, the other was just there. So you're not doing the work of 6 people on stage. You also have 2 other people that work with you but you need to give them a chance. But again this is a discussion for another place and another time.


----------



## Eboy87 (Apr 24, 2007)

It sounds like you got your situation rectafied (sp? right word?). But, I feel like I should add some things for those in the future who read this. I agree whole heartedly with taylorjacobs. My high school didn't have a true fly system. The first show I ran in a different venue with a fly system was a completely new experience (I admit, i confused fly cues with light cues). Anyway, on to the point.

Walking out is bad. In this situation, I don't think it's the right thing, and I'm not sure my earlier post made that clear. I agree with taylor (may I call you taylor?), communication is the key. I'm not saying this is the case with soundop, but I have read threads where people b**** and moan about not being head whatever because the SM decided someone else should do it. Been there, done that. It does help to vent every now and then, but only venting, not whining, and yes, there is a difference.

In the real world, you're not always going to get the position/job you want. In this situation, whilst I wouldn't call it whining, talking is the right way to go. From the OP, it looked like the SM had completely shut herself off to reason (I see it happen all the time; take a philosophy course with conservatives). If that's the case, and safety's a big concern, such as someone who is "head flyman" not knowing anything about it and bringing a lineset (hope that's the right word for it) on someone's head, that flyman is now a risk to everyone on the deck, and so is everyone on the rail for that matter, since their leader has no concern for safety. When those two situations happen, then the need to go over the SM's head is apparant. In this situation, safety was a real concern, and people could have been seriously injured. Even then, it's the responsibility of those in the know to stay and make sure things are done safely, even if they aren't head of whatever crew (audio, light, fly, running, etc.) The few shows I've worked professionally (well, in a venue other than my high school, and since I've graduated) the first thing is NOT the show must go on. The first concern is safety. If you see something unsafe, even if you're not sure, point it out to someone IMMEDIATELY. IF safety is met, then the show goes on, not vice versa. That seemed to be the situation here.

Now, if you're sacked from being head whatever, that's a different story. There's not much you can do there, and I've seen lots of people get sacked who thought they were the most qualified for the postion. Usually they had a tremendious self-inflated ego, and actually knew jack s&!^. If you get sacked because of favortism, then talking to the SM's the only route you can take. If safety is concerned, then go to the SM and/or higher powers.

This is one of those topics for me. I've drilled it into every crew I've been in carge of; our first priority is to make sure no one gets hurt doing this. Our second priority is to put on a fantastic and flawless show. Our third priority is to have fun. I've seen far to many situations that have ended badly because people ignore safety. I go rock climbing, and I've seen people injured because they're in too much of a hurry. They don't double check their knots, and they don't always put protection in when they should. What should be a small fall turns into a long one with a crash into the rock face afterwards. DON'T IGNORE SAFETY! It's your job to point out something not safe. This is one of those situations where apologizing later for being wrong is better than someone using said unsafe device and being injured. Ok, so that's not the exact proverb, but I blanked out halfway through. If you're not sure about something, point it out, then go find someone who does know.

Sorry for the hijack there, but I felt I had to say that. Anyway, carry on.


----------



## Van (Apr 25, 2007)

taylorjacobs said:


> I am SOOO TIRED of hearing undeserving brats talk about walking out on shows. This is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. THIS IS THEATRE...and not everyone gets along, but thats okay, because you are creating magic onstage...and thats what the goal is.Life is not always perfect...believe it or not you don't always get to work with great people, but what makes a great technician is someone who can get the job done no matter what obstacles or personalities lie in the way. You are not turning your back on one person you are turning you back on the whole cast and crew. This may be something that you don't plan on continuing in college of professionally but outside of high school, theatre relies on contacts..and if this was a professional gig you wouldn't be working in that town the rest of your life.
> As a former teacher of mine always used to tell me
> Fake it til you make it.


 

Well........ I think the use of "underserving brats" is a bit harsh but I do agree with the rest of the sentiment. To paraphrase our former Secretary of Defence < spelled the for the Aussies> "You go theatre with the crew you have, not the crew you want." In Highschool and College you don't always get the "best" crews you get the best crews availible. I've often said that a college degree doesn't prove you know more than somebody else, it proves your able to put up with 4 years of B.S. to prove you know what you know. Walking out on a show is an absolutly positively horrible nasty last resort thing to do. Besides it's much more fun to stick around, and kill the SM with kindness, and drive her insane trying to figure out what your'e up to. 
This is a bad situation and a reason that we have TD's and Production managers in the real world. This is NOT a decision that an SM makes, the SM can discuss a personel problem with a TD or PM and work to resolve the situation, but they do not have the authority to make a replacement on a crew, period. An SM could throw a crew memeber out of the theatre, if they showed up drunk or were massively derelict in thier duties, but to remove a crew member from a crew? No that decision is made by someone in charge of production concerns. So I sympathize with your situation but I cannot condone a decision to "walk out" I understand from you latest post that your situation is resolving itself, but I hope this post is one others will read in the future when reviewing this thread.


----------



## soundop (Apr 25, 2007)

well like i said we have settled it, i will be doing flys, but they said they mght nneed me for camera crew, but its cooled off


----------



## Chris15 (Apr 29, 2007)

Van said:


> < spelled the for the Aussies>


 
Oh, how sweet, Van was thinking of us... and on ANZAC day as well...


Van said:


> I've often said that a college degree doesn't prove you know more than somebody else, it proves your able to put up with 4 years of B.S. to prove you know what you know.


 
Funny... A Bachelor of Science degree is only 3 years down here...

And yes, walking yells unprofessional and unable to work effectively with others, an important skill in almost any employment situation. I think the advice of others covers it reasonably well.


----------



## SHARYNF (Apr 29, 2007)

Hi Chris I believe that if you are using the British system of GCSE and A levels you wind up with an extra year on what we would call high school, basically in a levels you get your core classes done, and then in your degree focus on your major.
US system is typically 5 years elementary, 3 years middle, 4 years high school, 4 years uni

Sharyn


----------



## Chris15 (May 1, 2007)

Australian School System (in most cases)

Kindergarten, years 1- 6 - Primary School
Year 7-12 - High School.
University - depends on what you are studying 3 - 6 or more years.

Some private schools do "middle school" for yrs 5-8. K-2 are known as infants and there are SOME infants only schools. That and most primary schools are administratively divided between primary & infants divisions.

Clear as mud?


----------



## Logos (May 1, 2007)

Mind you in SA
Kindergarten/Reception
1-7 Primary school
8-12/13 High School
and in Tasmania
Kindergarten/Reception
1-6 Primary School
7-10 High School
11-12/13 Matric College
Closer to the US system
Some schools are beginning to offer the International Baccalaureate instead of Matric and I believe that is happening in the UK as well. It is supposed to get you into Uni's all over the world that recognise the system without additional training or testing.


----------



## Chris15 (May 3, 2007)

Hmm... should have remembered that I was talking NSW and the other states are different. I guess that's what happens when I write these things at ridiculous ours of the morning...

Some states do year 1-13 instead of K-12. SA as Tony has mentioned. I know Western Aust. does the same.

Closest equivalent to a matriculation college as mentioned would be a senior high school. Some of them exist. But in the main, high schools goes 7-12. Where you have a senior, it tends to be that other HSs around will go 7-10 and then 11-12 at the senior high. Oh, and the term senior in relation to HS down here means year 11 or 12...

IBs are starting to become popular in some private schools. But bear in mind that at least according to our politicians, the NSW HSC is highly regarded internationally...


----------



## Logos (May 3, 2007)

Unlike SA Matric. Even some SA Uni's are considering introducing SAT's for SA Matric students.
I find it ridiculous that some politician in the UK said not long ago. "Soon every student will pass their A levels". It's not an exam then is it?


----------



## Van (May 4, 2007)

Logos said:


> ..............I find it ridiculous that some politician in the UK said not long ago. "Soon every student will pass their A levels". It's not an exam then is it?


 
OMG Don't get me going. My Wife is currently pursuing her Masters degree in Early Ed. Here in the States, we have the "No Child Left Behind Act" It mainstreams all kids. If there is a child with severe Cerebral Palsey, or Massive behavioral problems, or requires a heart lung machine. Thay are stuck in the same classroom as everyone else. If the behaviorial challenged student is disruptive you can't discipline them if their behavior is a result of their behavioral problem............... make sense out of that. If the kid with CP can't control their vocalizations or suffers seziures several times a class you simply have to deal with it. And the teachers are expected to teach all the kids to a level so they can pass government standardized tests. If you school doesn't meet the testing goals, you lose federal funding. Hmmmmm Makes sense, if you're from Kennebunkport, Maine, er ......Saudi Arabia, er ......... Crawford Texas.


----------



## tenor_singer (May 4, 2007)

I came in on this conversation a bit late. Adults out there... 

I have never ran a fly system. I have seen them when I have acted these past mpshdtfmphhh *said with hand over mouth* years. What I have gathered form conversations, other blogs, reading, personal observation, etc., is that fly systems, when manned by experienced and trained people, are still potentially dangerous and when manned by inexperienced and untrained people, they're hazzardous at best. This leads me to some obvious questions...

Don't you have to have some form of certification to run them? At the very lease shouldn't there be some form of requirement/proof of ability when training people on them? 

Why are high schools even allowing students (14 - 18 year olds) to work with these things??!!?? A rail flew in and a kid was hit on the head??? Where in the hell was the adult supervisor?? A student stage manager training a newbie?? I give my SM some liberties, but she (this year) is NEVER far from my sight when doing something even remotely dangerous. This school sounds like a catastrophe waiting to happen (albiet I am forming an opinion from only one sided information).

Sorry to the high school-aged students who are a part of this community. I am sure that the vast majority of you *are* careful and work very hard within your prospective theaters. However, you lack the life experience, expertise and training to run an auditorium that a professional with years of college, internships and practical work experience has. A vast majority of early - mid adolescent aged children lack communication skills. They do not have the ability to say "get out of the way" or "hey... you're being unsafe". It would take a very big A type personality to be able to confront people at your ages. If you can do it... great! In my 15+ years of experience I have had 5 students who could confront their peers well on a consistent, regular basis and this is out of THOUSANDS of students that I have taught.

Chrimeny... I am speechless (I know... I know... for somebody who is so speechless you sure do talk alot).

Just be safe, soundop.


----------



## icewolf08 (May 5, 2007)

tenor singer, I think, from reading your post that you would be surprised at how many high schools have fly systems and have students who run them. You have to learn somewhere. I understand the concern for safety, but if we tell people, "you can't do X because you don't know how" they have to be taught or they will never learn. I certainly agree that the situation described in this thread is less than ideal, but even well trained and experienced people make mistakes. This is all besides the fact that even high school students could possibly have training from working/interning at local community theatres or other venues.

I learned to run a fly system in high school. I was taught by older students mostly, but we did have a real staff TD who supervised everything, and the department head was also experienced, and we were not allowed to work in the theatre without one of them there.

Almost everything we do in theatre is dangerous. Saying that high school students shouldn't use a fly system is like saying they shouldn't use a table saw, or even a follow spot. Sure, all of these activities require the proper supervision and training, but that is why we go to school. You can't just pull someone off the street. At least the student who started this thread realizes that there is an issue in the way things are run at his school, and recognizing that something is wrong is the first step to correcting the issue.


----------



## tenor_singer (May 7, 2007)

icewolf08 said:


> I learned to run a fly system in high school. I was taught by older students mostly, but we did have a real staff TD who supervised everything, and the department head was also experienced, and we were not allowed to work in the theatre without one of them there.



I think that this is the key element. You had a staff TD and experienced department head who knew how to use them. Unfortunately a lot of schools offer drama as an extra-curricular activity that is often times staffed by a teacher who either has a minor in theater or who, like me, has dozens of years of experience in theater. I will admit to having zero knowledge of fly systems, but can, at the same time, see a person similar to me trying to figure out how to use them with no training... who in turn will try to teach their students. 

Again the question is... is there any certification that you need to run them? A shop teacher has the advantage of 4+ years of college training them on proper techniques, etc and is licensed by the state to perform their tasks within a secondary school. Most extra-curricular drama advisors lack this education and because it falls under the pervue of "extra-curricular" do not have licensure as well. Thus, they really shouldn't be training or using fly systems (unless they themselves have gone through a program training them).


----------



## Toffee (May 7, 2007)

Well you have to call in a special group [forgot the name] to fly people around on the fly system and it is illegal to do it yourself. But I haven't really heard of an actual group that gives some sort of legal document stating you are qualified to run a rail. Though there may be one out there.

Though hopefully the TD at any theatre has worked in the bussiness for a while and knows how to operate a rail and doesn't allow crap to happen in his/her theatre. This is one reason why I hate reading the comments by High School Students stating that they are "Technical Director" when they just don't have the qualification or the experience to gain such a title. To be honest the school districts need to start giving a **** about theatre and start paying some qualified TD's to start coming in, for the safety of everyone.


----------



## Van (May 7, 2007)

Toffee said:


> Well you have to call in a special group [forgot the name] to fly people around on the fly system and it is illegal to do it yourself. .......quote]
> 
> The best group, by far, to call for flying people onstage, is Flying by Foy.
> You are incorrect, however, in your statement, _"and it is illegal to do it yourself."_ . There is nothing Illegal about it, unfortunately, it's just very stupid.


----------



## gafftaper (May 8, 2007)

Yes Tenor, Sadly there are *many* high schools out there with full fly systems and no one in the building knows how to use them or is even aware that they could possibly be dangerous. The English teacher who is asked to direct a play once a year is told that Johnny knows how to use the system because Billy taught him how last year. Billy was considered the T.D. because he figured out how to record a submaster on the old 2 scene preset console... so he obviously knows how to train someone else on the fly system. Billy graduated and so now Johnny's the T.D. because Billy taught him the secrets of the submaster before he left. Everyone assumes that they would never install anything dangerous in a school theater so it all must be safe. 

Oh and the status of that fly system... it's the original hemp ropes that were installed when the building was built in 1964. It has never been serviced and the lines are badly frayed. The 3rd electric has been about 200 pounds over weight for 5 years but no one knows it's a problem they taped a sign to the break that says don't touch and they use a ladder to make adjustments to it. If they knew how to fix it they wouldn't be able to because there are no counterweight bricks... they are being used to prop the lunch room doors open. 

Names have been changed to protect the guilty but that's basically how the high school I taught at was before I arrived.


----------



## len (May 8, 2007)

One other thought:

Recently I started working at a large restaurant. The sound guy and the house band are not getting along. It's mostly the band's fault in that they want a lot of reverb in the monitors, they can't hear the monitors but they don't stand in the right spots to hear the monitors, etc., etc., etc.

The sound guy threatens to quit every night. But he keeps coming back. 

So if you are going to threaten to do something, be prepared to act on it. Or be prepared that those in charge will push you out before you are ready to leave. 

Otherwise, a less confrontational solution is in order.


----------



## Toffee (May 9, 2007)

Van said:


> Toffee said:
> 
> 
> > Well you have to call in a special group [forgot the name] to fly people around on the fly system and it is illegal to do it yourself. .......quote]
> ...


----------

