# Apex Microphones



## falcon (Feb 24, 2005)

Our theatre just bought an Apex SP1 microphone set. It includes 2 Apex180 pencil mics and one Apex345 mic. Does anyone know if these need phantom power to run at all?


----------



## zachlipton (Feb 24, 2005)

I don't know about those mics in particular, but you should be able to find out pretty easily. Chances are that the literature that comes with the mics should tell you. If not, as a general rule of thumb, dynamic mics do not require phantom power, while condenser mics do. 

Here's probably the easist thing to do. First check the manual to make sure that phantom power is not going to damage the mic (they will almost certainly let you know this very clearly if it will). Then plug in the microphone and bring up the channel. If it doesn't work, give it phantom power and try again.


----------



## falcon (Feb 24, 2005)

I should have mentions that we looked at the manual and I checked the information online from the manufacter and I couldn't find any information about phantom power. The words didn't even come up on any page that had info about the mics.


----------



## avkid (Feb 24, 2005)

they are condenser mics,condensers almost always use phantom power. If a mic does not use phantom power and it is supplied, the mic USUALLY will not be damaged.


----------



## falcon (Feb 25, 2005)

so if they do need phantom power, can I use PVM™ 22 Diamond Series™ Microphones with phantom power? also we have wireless headset mics (hope that makes sence to you guys, I can try to clarify the best I can with the limited information I have about them) that we have to run, i'm not sure the brand of them since we are scrapping ours and borrowing from another school, but can they generally run with phantom power on?


----------



## Peter (Feb 25, 2005)

Usually wireless mics will go through a reciever which will output the signal to a 1/4" cable into your board or whatever, and phantom power will never go to a 1/4" cable. Even in the "nutric" inputs with a 1/4" inch input inside an XLR input if you turn phantom power on to the chanel and have a 1/4" plug in it, the phantom power will not go to the 1/4" cable (only to the XLR) 

I would start out by pugging it in without phantom power and seeing how good the signal you get into the board is. Everyone should feel free to correct me, but I dont think pluging in a mic that needs phantom power into a plug without phantom power will do much harm, the worst i can see it doing is not working while the phanom power is off. If it doesnt work without phantom power, I would take that as a decent sign that it nees phantom power. 

I am not sure about those PVM mics, but a quick look on google might answer that (in the manual) I would look for you, but it's getting late here and I need to catch a few winks of sleep!


----------



## falcon (Feb 25, 2005)

the wireless mics have an xlr connection,


----------



## zachlipton (Feb 25, 2005)

XLR or quarter-inch, the wireless recievers do not require phantom power no.


----------



## cutlunch (Feb 25, 2005)

Falcon. The Apex mikes you have got need phantom power. The PVM mike won't be worried about phantom power so long as you are using balanced microphone leads. With the wireless mikes so long as you don't take an unbalanced output from wireless receiver into the balanced XLR input on the mixing desk there won't be a problem. As you mentioned the receivers have an XLR output so I take it you just use an XLR - XLR balanced lead so no problem.


----------



## falcon (Feb 25, 2005)

so plugging all three types of mics into the board using xlr cables and turning the phantom power on won't fry anything?


----------



## cutlunch (Feb 25, 2005)

That's the theory, just check the output on the wireless receiver is balanced. It may be marked on the receiver or it should be in the manual.


----------



## Peter (Feb 25, 2005)

wow, sorry about that.... i never knew they made wireless mics that outputed to XLR.... Hey, you learn something every day!


----------



## falcon (Feb 25, 2005)

all of our equipment is outputed through xlr except for our monitors and speakers. I have never seen a mic that using 1/4" at all. Come to think of it, I don't even think we have any extra 1/4" cables lying around that isn't connecting out speakers or monitors.


----------



## avkid (Feb 25, 2005)

1/4 inch is usually used only in inexpensive(dare I say cheap)microphones.


----------



## Peter (Feb 25, 2005)

I stand enlightend! Actually, I think our wireless mics must have had their own preamp type thing in them so they ouputed a line level 1/4" inch signal. the more I think about it... I am not sure what our new wireless mic system has... (new building new equipement.... lots of cables in the back of the rack.... another thing for me to check on monday if i remmber) 

And yes, I have a microphone sitting here next to me... a "Realistic Highball 2" that my grandfather used to use to tune violins with, and which I recieved when he passed away... that has a 1/4" plug comming out the end of the built in 6 ft cable. Ya, it's cheap, but it was free, and it picks up a decent mix of everything if i put it on top of my equpment (it's an omini) to provide a reference track if I have an open recording channel.


----------



## cutlunch (Feb 26, 2005)

When you talk about 1/4" inch plugs on microphones the main thing to remember is the difference between balanced and unbalanced. If the 1/4" is mono ie has only one band seperating the tip from the sleeve, this is unbalanced and should not be plugged into a phantom supply. If the mike has a 1/4 " jack like on your stereo headphones this will probably be balanced and can plug into phantom power.


----------



## propmonkey (Feb 26, 2005)

i was taught that phantom power can be on and it wont hurt any mic. i found out make sure you either turn the channel off or down beofre turn phantom power on. i knew all or wireless mics have xlr and 1/4 outputs. our sound guy was told that our new sennihoser(i cant spell sorry) wireless mics only had 1/4 but they also have xlr. we use 1/4 main for running line out of amps our cd players and moniters but never mics.


----------



## Peter (Feb 26, 2005)

Does phantom power ever go down a 1/4" cable? I was under the impression that phantom power was only an XLR thing... Now you guys have me worried b/c that mic i have is unbalenced (one band seperating) and I dont know if I can plug it into a Neutric connecter with phantom power on.


----------



## cutlunch (Feb 26, 2005)

Peter. The simplest way to check is with a multimeter. Insert a stereo 1/4 " plug into the socket, use a new one with no cable attached and the cover off. Then turn on the Phantom Power. Measure the DC voltages between the ground connector and the tip , ring connectors. If you have Phantom Power , this voltage should read , at least 10V and as much as 48V. Also look at your mixer manual there should be info in there. If you do getting a voltage reading greater then say 5V then don't use that microphone, as you will damage it.


----------



## avkid (Feb 26, 2005)

Phantom power is usually supplied only to the xlr inputs on a mixer.


----------



## falcon (Feb 26, 2005)

Alright, so plugging in JBL km 220 (i think thats what they) wireless lavs, apex180 condensor mics, pvm 22 diamond series and sennheiser me40 into the sound board, all using xlr, with phantom power ON, won't damage anything? 

Our TD was under the impression that putting phantom power on to mics that don't need them will fry them, more specifically the pvm 22's, those are our vocal jazz mics and if anything happens to them we are dead.


----------



## propmonkey (Feb 26, 2005)

i was told that they wont, atleast it wont hurt shure beta 58a and most other mics. in our sound board instruction video the installer said that it wont.


----------



## avkid (Feb 26, 2005)

I think your TD has some weird ideas about phantom power(sounds like someone picked up bad information from random places)


----------



## falcon (Feb 26, 2005)

Our TD is the only one besides me who knows about sound, so its pretty much my word against his. I sometimes have a hard time convincing him that some of the things I suggest will not harm any equipment. I just told him about inline phantom powers and he had no idea what they were. And this guy is a sound major and the choral director at our school. Its amazing what I've found that he doesn't know about.


----------



## cutlunch (Feb 26, 2005)

Falcon so long as the dynamic microphones are balanced then Phantom Power won't do them harm. However if you have Phantom Power that can be switched at each channel then turn it off.


----------



## Peter (Feb 26, 2005)

Yep, just got done with my trusty multimeter... There is no voltage in the 1/4" inputs in the Nutric connectors even when the XLRs have 48v of phantom power going to them.


----------



## falcon (Feb 27, 2005)

Now I know, I don't have to worry about frying any of our mics any time soon. Thanks guys.


----------



## avkid (Feb 27, 2005)

You're welcome!


----------



## cutlunch (Jun 26, 2005)

falcon said:


> Our theatre just bought an Apex SP1 microphone set. It includes 2 Apex180 pencil mics and one Apex345 mic. Does anyone know if these need phantom power to run at all?



Falcon. I was wondering how you are finding your Apex microphones as I am looking at buying the same microphone set. Are you changing the pattern on the pencil mikes much? Do you have any tips about their use/ quality.
Thanks
Cutlunch


----------



## falcon (Jun 26, 2005)

Honestly, I haven't been using them enough to make a concrete opinion about them. But with working with them for our musical as area mics, they were wonderful, they worked soo much better then our sennheisser area mics. The Apex mics are designed for recording and I think they do a pretty good job at it to. You will find that you have to find the right pattern for the distance you are using them at. We have set them up as hanging mics above the seats for recording and from the test record I did, without any effort to adjust to the proper levels, eqs, and gain. it turned out pretty good, so using them properly they are good mics. They aren't travelling mics though, they are very delicate, so they are pretty much a hang and leave them type mic.


----------



## AVGuyAndy (Jun 26, 2005)

> so plugging all three types of mics into the board using xlr cables and turning the phantom power on won't fry anything?



Phantom power will certainly fry the wireless receivers. EDIT: Connected through XLR inputs, that is.


----------



## avkid (Jun 26, 2005)

AVGuyAndy said:


> Phantom power will certainly fry the wireless receivers. EDIT: Connected through XLR inputs, that is.



Wait,what were the circumstances again?


----------

