# Yamaha LS9 ?



## JSFox

Has anyone had a chance to look at this yet? There are quotes of under $8k for the larger 32 input frame (64 channels). M7CL lite?


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## soundlight

I saw it and I love the concept of a smaller digital console that has a 32-mic input frame, and capability for cobranet cards and other expansion cards. The 16 outputs also enables live theater mixing with different zones for sound effects. I also like the pricepoint! I have a feeling that this could show up in my college theater before long.


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## NeilW

I got to see it at PLASA 2006, and it certainly looks like a great little desk. I had a quick demo on it and it certainly seems to have many likenesses with the bigger yamaha desks in terms of operating style, although with the obvious reduction in physical controls from something like the M7CL, some operations are slightly more complex or longer. For example, to adjust the eq on a channel you have to select the channel, then select the band (high, high mid, low mid or low) then you have physical controls for frequency, gain and bandwith. Likewise with the compressor/ gate section, only one control per dynamics unit, accompanied by the arrow keys and jog dial.
Theres also the fact that the screen ISNT a touch screen; if you have used a console such as an M7CL, you may find yourself stabbing at the screen to select something, which doesnt work (as demonstrated by yamaha sales guy)

There were some functions that seemed easier to me on a LS9 than an M7, in particular the aux to faders, which is simply a case of double clicking on the required aux select button, which is physical on the console rather than the screen as on the M7. It also has more user defined keys.

For the market it is aimed at, i think the LS9 will be a sucess, because of the huge reductions in outboard gear needed; 4 FX and 8 channels of eq (flex 15 mode), comps and gates on everything, 4 band parametric on all inputs and busses... the list goes on! Throw in the recallability and the small package size, looks very interesting indeed! I wouldnt hesitate to use the smaller yamaha consoles after the success i've seen with M7 and Pm5Ds.

Hope that is of some use, if you've got any specific questions i'll see what i can remember from the demo and the brochure ive got!

Neil


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## soundlight

I think that you mentioned this, but I've got a specific question. Can you call up the levels of each mix buss for each channel? I know that with the 01V, you have "fader mode" buttons. You can have the faders represent the level of the main mix, or the level of any of the omni outs, depending on which button you puch. Can you have fader control of the aux/buss levels for individual channels? In other words, can each channel fader control the level of that channel to a buss other than the main LR buss? Now that I've rephrased the question five or six times, I'll see about getting an answer...


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## NeilW

Yes you can! This is the sends on faders function. To the left hand side of the screen are 16 keys representing each of the 16 busses available in the console. If you double click one of these, the whole bank of faders below change into the channel sends to this buss. So, for example, you have a monitor mix on aux 1 and you need to turn up the vocal in it, you would double click the "mix 1" key, and the faders will move to represent the send levels from each channel to that mix. Its then a case of pushing up the channel fader for the vocal. Then press the same mix key again and the surface returns to the "normal" mode of mixing channels to the stereo buss. 

After reading through your question again, just to clarify, this is a global change, and from the time I had on it, i dont think that it is possible to swap individual faders to control different mixes simultaneously. However, I think that the complete bank swap makes it easy to see what is going where at what level, and is also a fast way of setting up monitor and effects mixes. Theres a couple of other things related to this that I didnt get the chance to test fully but which are of interest. Firstly, how the console handles stereo mixes; do you have to set one side at a time on the faders or do the faders control level and pan is set somewhere else?! Secondly, whether the LS9 follows the same as the other yamaha digital consoles, where selecting an aux also assigns it to the solo bus, which makes monitor mixing super fast.

There is also the option of several layers in the LS9 (1-32, 33-64, master and custom). The master layer has all the output master level controls in one place, and as default, the 32 mic pres are patched to 1-32. You could however, also patch them to 33-64, and use the second layer as the sends to monitors with different eq and comps. The custom layer can apparently hold any combination of input and output functions but this was a function i didnt get to try out.

Hope that is of some help
Neil


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## soundlight

I would want it to be global! That's how it is on the 01V. This mixer is looking to be the perfect (and much needed) medium of a live console between the 01V and the M7CL. And since I'm used to the 01V from working in Performance Services here, and I've already read half the manual, learning the physical console would be rather easy! Thanks!


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## NeilW

Ahh, if you want it global then it does what you need! 
It certainly seems to look ideal for the market between 01V and M7CL, particularly as it is a purpose designed live desk, rather than say, a DM200, which whilst workable, wasnt ever really ideal for live work. I think if you have used a yamaha digital console before, you will find the LS9 fairly easy to walk up and use, most things are right in front of you, or just a button press away. I spent about 20 mins with the surface at PLASA and would feel confident enough to use one in a live situation, although I have had some time on M7s and PM5s. A useful free tool is to download the yamaha studio manager program and the software for each of the digital consoles, dont think the LS9 is available yet, but when it is, it is helpful to see how things are laid out, and also allows you to set up your show in advance. This can then be transferred to the desk on a USB drive, or link the computer directly to the console through the network port.

Neil


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## soundlight

Exactly...I think that the main point is that this is finally a reasonably priced Yamaha digital console that is designed for Live work! I got a quote on the 32 channel model for UNDER 8K! I'd better start earning the dough...


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## NeilW

The other thing that hasnt been mentioned is what it actually sounds like (which is probably the most important thing)! There isnt any information in the brochure about whether the preamps are of the same variety as the M7CL or any of the smaller yamaha desks. I guess this is the type of thing that can only be established by a demonstration in a real world environment rather than a quick glance at a trade show. Would be interesting to hear from anyone who has actually done a gig with it, and maybe compare with the other desks from yamaha. 

Neil


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## JSFox

I/O channel specs are the same as M7 so I assume they're using the same head amp. Input sampling freq is wider than M7 so the A/D and/or input algorithms are at least different (better?). THD, XTalk, FreqResp, Noise all appear to be the same.

I like the onboard recording capability, though I really wish it could do more than 2 tracks. Even 4 would be a huge benefit.


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## Peter

This board CERTAINLY has my eye! For the price I havent been able to find anything else close, what would everyone else compare it to both by price and by features?


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## jbeutt

The closest thing is a TT24, which from the looks of the LS9 (more to come after this weekend), doesn't stand a chance.


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## soundlight

I agree that Yamaha is finally going to take over the market that Mackie is seeking.


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## SHARYNF

I also wish that they had expanded the recording capabilities If they had only added the ability for adat out it would have been great. The ability to assign the inputs to 8 16 24 or 32 channels of adat out would have made recording at the same time fantastic. We use Alesis HD24's so we would have loved this

Sharyn


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## soundlight

On the 32 input/64 channel version you can get 2 16in/16out ADAT cards, thus having 32 inputs and/or 32 outputs of adat! You just have to get the adat cards from yamaha.


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## jbeutt

Ok, here's the skinny.

Saw both boards (16 and 32) at AES today and I'm very impressed. You get the software set of the bigger M7CL console, but a far lower price point.

There's not a whole lot I can tell you that you can't read on their website already. All I guess I can relate is the tactile experience. Nothing extraordinary to speak of. Yamaha delivered a fantastic interface. 

Faders are extremely responsive as are all knobs and controls.

There's a very in depth software package with 4-band parametric as well as dynamics on each channel. 

It has a vast library of presets, obviously.

Nifty recording to USB flash drive. As suggested by the rep, it's good for sound checks, archiving, yada yada.

It's extraordinarily approachable. Unlike its bigger brothers the LS9 is not daunting and totally teachable as well as operatable by novices or students. Now, this does mean more button steps to options, but I'll take the trade off. 

It's very light and compact. It would definitely be a breeze to carry for a smaller touring group (probably not the right application, though). Gotta wait to find out how tough it is, but my impression given what I saw and what I know of Yamaha is that it can stand up to crap.

The 16 channel has one MY slot and the 32 has two. This does mean expandability with ADAT. 

Definitely a heavy hitter for the range of console that it is. Blows the equivilant TT24 out of the water on features. 

Not the most riviting review, I know. I've had very little sleep. If you have any quesitons, let me know and I'd be happy to answer them or get them answered by a rep tomorrow. I know someone on the "AES" thread wanted to know about personal monitoring over the ethernet connection. There was no equipment of that sort being shown that I recall, but I can certainly ask about developement.


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## SHARYNF

My understanding is that the adat option is an either or, so if you want two adat 16 cards, you cannot have cobra net? It would have been nice, if I am correct is to be able to have the cobra net abilities for Live sound, but also have the adat capabilities for recording? Probably having 4 slots would have been great, and it is hard to see if it would have been all that more expensive.

Sharyn,


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## jbeutt

Sharyn,
Not entirely either or. The 16 channel version has one slot, which would technically allow for digital output of 16 channels, considering that's what you were using. I suppose in that scenario, you'd not be utilizing your digital ins, but that's one option. Same scenario on the 32 channel version which has two MY slots.
However, you can have one ADAT card and one CobraNet card if you pleased. You are right, though, you woud not be able to send out all channels on ADAT were you to use both. Do you do a whole 24-track mix? In my world, I could go down to 16 channel recording on a 32-channel mix or even a 16 channel recording on a 48 channel mix (using adat and cobranet on a 32 ch. board). I can definitely see the downside. I suppose my answer, defending Yamaha and their decision, would be that someone needing even a 24-channel recording is probably out of the LS9 ballpark anyway.

Is that clear or was there more you wanted?

Also, to address personal monitoring. It doesn't seem that there is or will be the ability to output off the ethernet ports. I'm assuming these are just control ports. However, there are Aviom MY cards that each do 16 out.


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## SHARYNF

Here is what we have found re live sound/recording

If you have the option, the best approach is to simply have a input split snake, and send a feed to the recording truck or location etc, and have the person mixing the sound for recording to be isolated, and basically incontrol of their mix entirely. If you are say doing a tv broadcast you can use this mix also. 

If on the other hand you are trying to capture for later remix or really do not have the time/isolation to get the mix right at FOH, then the best approach is to take each of the inputs and record it independantly to seperate track.

So we have a pretty elaborate setup, if we bring the truck, then we just split the inputs with the ISO snake and do it that way (typically if we are recording and feeding a live ty mix) ON the other hand for a lot of school type activities, it is really useful to simply record all the inputs to tracks on a Alesis HD24, we have two of them they are pretty inexpensive, and with the two we have 48 tracks available. That way the FOH person simply worries about live sound, and all the post recording mixing is left for later.

So typically for the simple setup having a live console that has direct outs on all the inputs makes things really easy. 

Sharyn


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## jbeutt

o..k..
That is how you would do it, thanks for the explanation. That's pretty much how every other recording scenario works. 

Forget the cobra net, you still aren't going to get 48 direct outs unless you use every single output, with ADAT cards. My queeestion was how many inputs do you normally run. Also, what kind of show are you running? On top of that, what board are you using now? If you were really tight, you could premix stereo mics, toms, backup vox, etc.
Again, though, my impression is that someone doing a 48 channel split to a reording truck is probably going to be at a higher end model of mixer anyway, which I'm sure is what Yamaha figured.

Why not just use your recording split to your HD24s?


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## SHARYNF

I was merely commenting on how a school might use it.

Typically the school MIGHT like to use cobra net for monitors and at the same Time record. It is not so much that they use all 48 or 32 inputs at the same time, but that they typically might use all 32 during the whole show, and it is just simpler to not submix but just record all the channels. I have just found that when people tend to try to do a sub mix, and a record mix and a FOH mix all at the same time things tend to get screwed up if you are not all that experienced so the "fix it in post" where you have all the inputs that you can play with makes recorvery easier


Our setup varies

In the Smallish deals where we are doing foh monitor and video recording/broadcast
We have a three way iso split A&H at FOH for say 32 channels, Monitors fed from the iso varies sometimes we use a couple of Yamaha 03d's and we have an 32 channel Intelix Psych if we are using a lot if individual monitor mixes (this system can create 8) and then we have cascaded 02r's fed from the iso for recording 32 channels directly to the hd24's via Adat, and since we have spare recording tracks we will also typically send a mixed feed from FOH to e hd24's along with some house mics for ambiant and audience. The mixed feed from the 02r's is typically what we are using to feed the video broadcast.

Sharyn


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## SHARYNF

My comments were mainly aimed a possible uses for schools etc where we do some design/consulting work 

Here they typically don't have an elaborate setup and so it would be nice to be able to have a good foh system, use cobra net for monitor mix etc, and then since a lot of them now want to do some recording, it would be nice for them to be able from foh just feed directs to a HD recording system (could be HD24 or protools or nuendo etc) and then just capture all the tracks to have available later to do some final mix down off line later

Sharyn


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## Chris15

Would it not be an option to use cobranet cards in the mixer and get a cobranet to ADAT or whatever interface for the recording, so that you just run a cobranet feed into your recording setup? I gather that this should be possible and that a single set of inputs should be able to feed multiple outputs. Please do correct me if I'm wrong.


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## jbeutt

You could. What I believe Sharyn wants the cobranet for is doing monitor mixes. So in this sense, it doesn't fit with the ability to do direct outs. That's really what we're talking about here. My feeling is that if you already need the analog split for the video truck, just use that to record "direct outs". The downside is that you need preamps on top of that setup.


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## SHARYNF

Exactly, It is just when the come out with a new product it is always fun to play what could they have done better. I think it will be quite successful, I tis amazing how many semi pro setups use 01v96, add the additional adat cards and then use Behringher ADA8000 preamp units for additional inputs, The ADA800 has this oddity that there is no preamp in to direct out, but you have the adat connections.

Nothing is perfect ;-)

Sharyn


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## JSFox

Does the LS9 not have any DCA's (or a DCA/Sub function)?


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## jbeutt

If you're talking about mix buses, it has 16.


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## soundlight

After reading the manual, I don't think so. But it's entirely possible that I missed something...I didn't read it very thoroughly, it was in the 20 minutes that I had before a class. (If you're talking about the Digitally Controlled Amplifier, the equivalent of the Voltage Controlled Amplifier.) Hope that I got that one right...


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## JSFox

Yes, DCA's (same functionally as VCA's or Sub's (not the same as a mix or matrix)). EG, when a band plays I want Kick & Bass on 1, Drums on 2, Perc on 3, Guitars on 4, Inst's on 5, Vocals on 6, Loop on 7. Every board including a $800 mackie has them in some form or another. I can't find them in any of the functionality of the LS9.


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## jbeutt

There different ways of accomplishing this on a digital console.

You can mix down to one of the 16 busses and route them back to your LCR outputs. For example, drum kit or backing vox to its own bus. This is different than an analog console because you have control over the internal routing. So buses become ambiguous and you can choose between routing them as auxes or just sub-groups. Not very much different conceptually than an analog board, except that there are no hard outputs for a given bus or group, you define them allowing for much more flexability. 

You can also link channels for a similar effect. This is closer to the methodology of a VCA, however on the LS9, as well as other consoles, you can link more parameters than level, like eq and whatnot.


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## JSFox

Jack, you may be right. All of the other digital boards I've used had regular VCA's (or subs) as well as aux mixes and matrix, but I think it would be possible to setup mixes on the LS9 to function as VCA's since assignment can be on/off (instead of variable). Not necessarily neat and clean, but perhaps doable.

Thanks for the input.


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## NeilW

I can't find any reference to DCA's in the user manual or brochure I have for the LS9. I guess that this is probably one of the ways that Yamaha has reduced the functions on the LS9 compared to a 32 channel M7. Also, I wonder how many people in the target market for the LS9 are familiar with VCA operation anyway.

Someone mentioned that every board has them... well most boards have subgroups yes, but i cant think of all that many smaller frame consoles that have true VCA controls, and as mentioned above, the LS9 can do subgroups still, with inserts and that kinda thing. There seems to be a bit of confusion about the difference between subgroups and VCA's as well, think it has been covered on control booth previously, the only difference when using a digital desk is the naming of these functions, yamaha for example use mix busses and DCA's, whilst DiGiCo call their "vca" function control groups. 

If you need DCA's than a 32 channel M7 or above will do the job!
Neil


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## BenSounds

The two complaints I've heard concern the lack of DCA's and the somewhat less warm sound of the mic pre's. Now I feel I must add the caveat that the sound of the mic pre's (actually on the Mc7) was being compared to the sound of mic pre's on a Cadac F-Type, hardly an apples to apples comparison. It's like anything, the LS9 is one tool, and it's one we're giving some serious consideration to. It's a lot of live board in the price point.


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## JSFox

Well, personally I prefer the pre's on a Neve 88, but we don't have the booth space so we've decided not to go that route!  

You're absolutely right, there are a variety of tools for different purposes and perhaps more importantly different price points. I would love to get this school an MC7 and have taken a close look at some budget options to do it, but we'd have to give up alot of other stuff like more mics, IEM's, and a couple of VL1000's so it'd be no go. Compared to the TT24 and other options in the sub $9k range the LS9 is looking OK. For the money it appears to be the best option out there. Hope to see mine in 2 or 3 weeks.


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## Peter

Ok... now the question is how would I go about getting a demo of this board to know if my college should buy one for what we do? Should I try calling rental companies in the area or ....? I think all the places we would buy it from are rather far away. I'm in central MA if that helps at all!


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## Andy_Leviss

Just a quick non-Yamaha specific clarification on a very BIG misunderstanding in a few of the above posts. Namely, DCAs/VCAs and sub-groups are NOT at all the same thing, although it's easy to get them confused.

DCAs/VCAs are only a level control, and are entirely independent of any routing. Each channel assigned to a DCA/VCA retains any routing it's assigned, regardless of what other channels assigned to the same DCA may be routed to. 

Subgroups are actual mix busses, where the channels assigned to a group are mixed together into a single bus, which can then be further routed to other outputs (matrices or main outs), if desired. 

A subgroup fader is an actual level control that controls only the level of that mixed-together group bus. If the channels assigned to it are also routed elsewhere, the levels to those other outputs are unaffected.

DCA/VCA faders are essentially remote controls for the channels...if a channel is assigned to a DCA, that DCA fader affects that channel everywhere it is routed (excepting pre-fader sends, of course). 

If you assign a channel to more than one group, and then mix those groups together, you'll end up with distortion from the overloading caused my double-/multiple-bussing. You can readily assign a channel to multiple DCAs/VCAs, although there are certain quirks of how this works that need to be understood to effectively use it. (This is often done, for example, to have DCA faders for the entire band, and then one for just the drums, or for all the backup singers, but then also to be able to tweak the balance between men and women, among others.)

There's a bit more to it than this, if you study in-depth (I recommend the guide to VCA mixing you can find on Allen & Heath's website as a basic introduction), but the key to remember is that in subgroups, the audio signals actually get mixed together; in VCAs/DCAs, the audio signals remain completely independent, all that is linked is their relative levels. 

There are a lot of great reasons to use VCAs, although they're certainly an advanced feature. If there's enough interest, at some point once things slow down a bit I'll post a tutorial on "varsity level" Broadway style mixing using VCA automation to make large shows manageable--this is how, although Broadway shows have dozens and dozens of inputs, the show is actually mixed 90% on somewhere around 12 faders!

--A

P.S.-There are no Mackie consoles that have VCAs. The TT24 might have DCAs, but I've never played with it long enough to find out; my interest in the console waned long before the DCA question ever came up.


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## NeilW

Thanks Andy, thats what i was trying to get at but you explained it far better than I could!

Neil


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## Andy_Leviss

You're most welcome, Neil...it took me a while to try to boil it down to simple terms, and I was still afraid I might have been a bit confusing. 

Another way to put it is that VCAs allow you to do what most people who've never used/heard of VCAs use subgroups for, but without the compromises inherent in using actual subgroup busses.


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## JSFox

Andy, good overview.


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## NeilW

After some further thought, i think the VCA function on digital mixers is perhaps even more useful than on analogue desks, especially on some of the larger console offerings such as the Yamaha PM5D and the DiGiCo D5 and D1.
Whilst not such an issue on the LS9 and M7, where there is a fader per channel represented all of the time in the standard configurations, there is likely to be times on the other models where whole sections of channels are likely to not be immediately accessible on the surface. Using the PM5D as an example, there are only faders for either channels 1-24 or 25-48 at any one time, although the other set is only a button press away. So if the console is set up with a traditional input list (drums, percussion, bass, guitar, keys and vocals) it is quite possible that your inputs will spread across both layers. Without DCAs in this instance, it would not be easy to have control over a channel or group of channels that is not on the surface faders at that point. With the 8 DCAs available, it would be possible to assign all the drums to one fader for example which would be available in the centre of the console regardless of the page of the input faders. Finer adjustment would need swapping to the page with the drum inputs but for instant access to overall level would be useful. Furthermore, because it is a VCA style control it would also affect all post fade sends. 

Im sure there are many other instances where DCAs prove to be valuable in digital mixing, another one that springs to mind with the yamaha consoles is DCAs in conjunction with fader flip modes for monitor mixing.

I hope this isnt too off topic from the LS9, I just think that as new surfaces continue to appear on the market there are more and more slighly different structures and operating techniqies than are likely to ever be possible with traditional analogue consoles of any size. Being able to exploit these is likely to add even more value to the use of digital consoles in the live environment.

Andy, it would be interesting to hear a bit more about "varsity level" broadway mixing with VCAs when you get the chance, as most of my exposure to them has been in concert and festival style situations.

Neil


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## Andy_Leviss

I'll definitely do a more detailed write-up in the near future, but for the short version, it revolves around using a console that has VCA assignment automation as part of it's scene recall. Any digital console with DCAs, of course, has this, and higher end analog consoles do (Midas Heritage series, the XL_ series, and of course the top end in theatre is Cadac).

Generally, the last three VCAs are assigned permanently to the band, the band reverb, and the vocal reverb, so they can be easily adjusted and ridden during the show. Then, the remaining VCAs are dynamically reassigned throughout the show so that they're controlling the active inputs used in a given onstage moment (a console scene; oftentimes one stage scene will involve multiple scene memories on the console). 

If there are only a few actors onstage, it will be one VCA per actor; if there is a larger ensemble, often there will be group VCAs, so you might have Male Lead, Female Lead, Supporting Actor 1, Supporting Actor 2, Ensemble. If necessary for the particular song's arrangement, ensemble might break down into men and women, and there might be a VCA for any offstage singers, etc.

By dynamically reassigning the VCAs during the show with the console's automation, you can mix the show primarily just on the DCA faders, while having control over every input you need at any given moment.

Then you just go to the channels to tweak band mix and individual levels (I, for example, tend to make daily adjustments on the input fader for an actor who's in weak voice that night, so that I can still mix the VCAs partially by feel...with a bit of practice on any console, it's easy to hit U blindly, which is an important reference for theatre-sytle line-by-line mixing during rapid sections of dialogue).

On consoles with digital scribble strips it's super-easy, since you can label the DCAs dynamically with the scene, but on Midas consoles (and even on the Yamaha DM2000), you just number the DCAs and then number your script accordingly so you know which actor is on which fader. I'd love for somebody to come up with an affordable add-on scribble strip that you could control off the FOH computer!

Anyway, that's the bare bones of it...there are some little tricks to learn once you get into the intricacies of plotting and programming the DCAs, but I'll save that for the more detailed thing, eh?

--Andy, who realizes he should probably split this off into its own topic, and will do so when it's not 12:30am at night after a 13 hour day at the shop!


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## JSFox

Andy, I'd be very curious about your thoughts on the LS9 in general, but in particular it's lack of traditional VCA's and using aux busses as sub alternatives.


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## Andy_Leviss

Hmm...I'm a bit wary of commenting on a console I haven't had any flight time on yet, let alone even seeing it in person. Speaking conceptually, I can see it being a good tool for certain things, even certain sizes of projects I work on, but it's certainly not trying to be a bigger console than it's intended to be, if that makes any sense.

If you're doing shows on a scale that they don't need VCAs, then it's probably right on. I can't really speak to aux/groups on it, since I'm not really familiar with its setup.

Yamaha usually takes two different approaches with their consoles. Their studio consoles typically have dedicated aux and group bus outputs. Their live consoles, however, combine both into what they call mix buses (on the early M-series consoles, it was called GA Diversity, for Group/Aux Diversity). Each mix bus can be set to either have a fixed level where each channel is either on or off, sending to that mix either pre-fade (at U) or post-fade (tracking the channel fader), in which case it's acting like a group (with the added ability to have it pre-fade), or with variable level sends, like an aux.

So while it's a different terminology, and you have to wrap your head around choosing between a given bus being an aux or a group, it's no different than any other non-VCA/DCA console as far as having sub-groups goes.

I'm assuming that's what the deal is on the LS9, but again, I haven't even seen one in person or had time to crack the manual, so I'm only speculating based on Yamaha CA's typical topology for their live consoles.

--A


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## Peter

Wait... so if the LS9 has these mix buses... does that mean that they cannot be controled / used like aux outputs on 'small' traditional boards with individual control over the level of each channel being sent to the mix?


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## NeilW

As Andy said, the LS9 follows the same bus structure as most of the other yamaha consoles. From the LS9 manual:

The sixteen MIX buses provided on the LS9 can be assigned either as VARI or FIXED types in pairs of adjacent odd-numbered/even-numbered buses. They can also be switched between monaural/stereo for the same pairs of buses. VARI type and FIXED type buses differ as follows.

● VARI
This type allows the send level of the signal sent from the input channels to the MIX bus to be varied. The point at which the signal is sent from the input channel to a VARI type MIX bus can be chosen from before the EQ
(attenuator), before the fader, or after the [ON] key. This type is used mainly for sending the signal to a monitor system or external effect.
● FIXED
With this type, the send level of the signal sent from the input channels to the MIX bus is fixed. The signal from an input channel is sent to a FIXED type MIX bus from before Pan (if the MIX bus is monaural) or after Pan (if the MIX bus is stereo). This type is used mainly when you want to distribute signals to an external device with the same mix as the STEREO/MONO buses.

So it is up to the user to configure the console with the bus setup that best suits the needs of the job it is being used for. For monitors, you might choose to have all 16 busses in VARI mode to act as aux sends whilst for FOH, it might be more useful to have 10 busses set up as FIXED for subgroups, and 6 as VARI for aux sends for effects.

It looks like the LS9 editor is now available for download as well from the yamaha site, definately reccomended for understanding more of how the consoles work!

Neil


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## PhantomD

I went to a demo for the Yamaha LS9/M7CL tonight.

I was particularly impressed about the price point of the 16-channel version LS9, bringing digital consoles much more in the reach of the masses.

Especially as you can get for $A8000+ in a mixer what it would cost $A20000 to put in a rack - with a much less weight factor too!

Very, very impressed. As a veteran analogue user I was at ease with the console.

I like the idea of user "profiles", where you can just plug in a USB memory stick and it loads your profile of what you're "allowed" to do off there - can even automatically put certain faders up on insertion of the disk.

MP3/MP4/WMA/AAC audio playing capabilities are impressive, although there is a limit of 2GB of memory stick capacity for stable operation. Useful in churches for recording the sermon then putting it on the web minutes later.

Plus I got some merchandise 

Features of the software program that can be done at home are very useful - you could preprogram a whole show at home and just bring it in!


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## Pie4Weebl

wow this thread makes me realize how out of touch with the sound world I am, I guess in the past few months while at college I have not touched the schools digital board since I am off in light land, and all the mixing I did back in HS was analog.


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## TOG

Okay, everybody has had a chance to get over that first glow of New Product and has probably had a chance to work with the LS9. What are your thoughts now?


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## jglodeklights

My theater has one. Keep in mind- I am by no means a sound engineer/tech. However, that said, once I got some no pressure time to simply play with it, I picked up the basics of using it by myself (the manual actually makes no sense to me). 

The good-
For a non-sound engineer the automatic settings it uses when you patch devices to inputs are useful, as I would otherwise only have a vague idea at best of of where to shelf things. 

Extensive level of built in EQ'ing and sound refinements that are easy to access and use.

It is also quite compact and takes up little space, useful useful useful. 

Once you learn the interface it really is not all that difficult to access what you want to.

Easy to patch your mixes. 

Finally, an APP for your iPad to work with it.

The bad-
Lack of a full analog controls for certain functions. Yes, you can access up to 16 faders for the pots at once, but you can only access one of High, mid, Mid-low, low frequency alteration at a time and for only one of the pots. Can slow things down a little bit. 

That's about what my thoughts are.


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## bishopthomas

What do you want to know about it? Yamahas are the de facto digital console so if you have guest engineers they'll probably know how to use it. The ability to use a wireless tablet PC is amazing. It's fairly intuitive. The sound is pretty bad. Harsh preamps, unresponsive compressors. We have an LS9-16 and an LS9-32 in inventory and they do the job. We are considering getting something by Soundcraft for kind of a "personal" mixer. We can cross rent the LS9 but we're all getting a little tired of the "Yamaha sound."


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## TimmyP1955

It's a very capable console. But with a firmware upgrade, it could be a lot better. Here's my list (that I passed on to the Yamaha training guy):


Multiple Channel Linking fields. One wants some channels to have every parameter linked (such as stereo keyboard pairs), and others to have only the faders linked (so that one does not need to run the drums to a bus and then switch layers in order to be able to turn all the drum channels up or down at once) (Of course one can create a custom fader layer......)

Mixes: Fixed/Variable: Should be selectable individually, not in pairs.

Channel Library! (It's on the O1V96, why not the LS9?)

Channel Move: Any information stored in scenes should move along with it.

Rack Multi-band Dynamics and Multi-band Compressor: Make the auto makeup gain defeatable. Auto makeup gain makes it impossible to safely adjust these units live - especially the one that has individual thresholds - when one adjusts a threshold, the frequency balance changes even if there is no compression occurring! 

It should be Dynamics 1 that can be a de-esser, not Dynamics 2 (one wants to de-ess before compressing, not after - I think).

When one un-cues a gate's sidechain, the cue should revert to the channel that was being cued. Instead, it clears the cue.

Either Dynamics unit should be usable as a delay (but if only one, I'd say Dynamics 2, so that a gated drum can be delayed so its time signature matches when it is picked up in the overheads).

Rack Delay MIDI note needs a setting labeled "1:1" so that its obvious which setting makes the delay time equal the time tapped into the user defined tap button. (Many of us have no idea what the little musical notes mean.)

Compression problem: The compression threshold marker has to be well below the displayed maximum signal level before the gain reduction meter shows that there is any compression taking place. (I do not yet know if this is also the case in the detailed view.)

De-esser problem: I've not used de-esser, but others have complained that the threshold setting does not seem to match the signal level required to "hit" the de-esser, and that the de-esser seems to do either too little or too much - never the right amount.


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