# Looking for a system that does it all



## dooglax (Jun 19, 2012)

Hi all. First, I want to take to say that I've been a long time reader of this site and finally decided to make an account to ask a question.

I'm currently working on an art installation that is going to need a fairly comprehensive show control of some sort. unfortunately, I can't really get into the the full specifics of the show. Its basically a walk through area where viewers will be able to interact via buttons, pressure sensors, motion sensors, etc that will change the dynamics of the show around them. We're looking for a system that can interpret these sensors to control lighting, audio, video and effects. The manner, order and exact way a guest will go through the area will be different from another persons experience.

As of right now, it seems we will need support of about 32 triggers in the area. 

My questions are: Does anyone know of a system that's designed to handle these aspects in this way? Are any of the aformentioned ideas a good idea? Is this even technically possible?

Thank you anyone who can help or throw out some ideas. If anyone has any questions or would like me to clarify anything, just ask and I'll try to be more specific. I'm not exactly sure what the budget is as I have not been told this. From what I understand, if there is a system that exists to do what we need, we will purchase it.


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## derekleffew (Jun 19, 2012)

While many lighting consoles/systems can be adapted to function as show control systems, there are better and easier alternatives available. I suggest reading on JohnHuntington's blog about The Gravesend Inn, a project that sounds vaguely similar to yours.

I suspect a product from Alcorn McBride, Medialon, or Richmond Sound Design will be more suitable for you. You'll probably still need the Ion, or other lighting controller, however.


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## museav (Jun 19, 2012)

I agree that it sounds like a dedicated control system of some type may be more appropriate. I understand that you don't want to say too much but knowing things like what devices are to be controlled or what type of control input and output is required, what type of logic and/or scheduling is desired and so on might help in determining what may or may not be appropriate.

If there is significant logic required, for example having different combinations of inputs trigger different events or sequences, stepping through multiple different events from the same trigger input, running 'until' loops, etc., then you may even consider an AMX or Crestron type control system.


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## Footer (Jun 19, 2012)

derekleffew said:


> While many lighting consoles/systems can be adapted to function as show control systems, there are better and easier alternatives available. I suggest reading on JohnHuntington's blog about The Gravesend Inn, a project that sounds vaguely similar to yours.
> 
> I suspect a product from Alcorn McBride, Medialon, or Richmond Sound Design will be more suitable for you. You'll probably still need the Ion, or other lighting controller, however.



And on that note, contact John. Hire one of his former students... at least as an adviser. No one knows more about show control than he does.


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## beardedbil (Jun 19, 2012)

I can't say enough good things about an Alcorn McBride system for this type of installation. We are installing something similar but for an interactive mini golf setup. Let me know if you need any assistance.
Bill Rod. 
Dark Tech Effects


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## BobHealey (Jun 20, 2012)

Based on my limited experience, I would not use a lighting console as a master show control device. A lot of them have very limited IO options, most of which are designed to be means of triggering a cue stack on the console, or controlling other lighting devices. As the others have said, you're going to want a dedicated, designed for the purpose show control system to do things such as trigger your lighting effects, sound fx, special fx, etc. My experience with the Express line of ETC consoles is they don't play nice being in the middle of a MIDI daisy chain, and its best to have them as the terminating device. Reacting to a MIDI command causes the Expresses I've used to block on the MIDI Thru port for fractions of a second, causing subsequent packets to be lost unless I delay for .1 s or so.


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## cpf (Jun 20, 2012)

Sounds like a job for Max/MSP, it's quite a learning curve though.


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## dooglax (Jun 21, 2012)

There's been quite a few show control systems shouted out here and I really appreciate everyones input. The gravesend inn used medialon manager . I'm curious if anyone has used this system and would suggested it. Hows the learning curve? Are there better options? what about cost?

also, we will need to control 12 different video screens throughout the area. Could anyone suggest a media manager?

In one thing I read about the gravesend inn, it said something about a custom io controllor to interface all of the sensors with medialon manager. does anyone know how that would work?


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## museav (Jun 22, 2012)

dooglax said:


> also, we will need to control 12 different video screens throughout the area. Could anyone suggest a media manager?


What are you trying to control, is it the content, the sources and/or playback devices, the signal routing, the displays themselves or some combination of these?


dooglax said:


> In one thing I read about the gravesend inn, it said something about a custom io controllor to interface all of the sensors with medialon manager. does anyone know how that would work?


Maybe John will be by to answer that.


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## JohnHuntington (Jun 22, 2012)

Thanks @derek for the heads up on this thread. I don't have a lot of time to respond today, but on a quick read I would say you DEFINITELY need a show control system. The Ion may be able to trigger light cues based on contact closure I/O, but I don't think it can do conditional logic, which you will likely need. 

What you're trying to do sounds pretty straightforward, so any of the systems from Alcorn, Medialon, Wings Platinum, etc should do what you want. I mention those three because each sells an integrated hardware solution that can read sensors, etc, directly. Alcorn and Medialon both have all-in-one rack mount boxes that should work great for what you are trying to do, and don't have OS upgrade/virus/etc issues. Wings would need a computer and their external boxes. I would stay away from AMX/Crestron for show contro --I have an article on my site explaining why. 

Gotta run--heading in now to pick up the final marked up pages from the copy editor for my new book edition! It should be out soon...

John


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## JohnHuntington (Jun 22, 2012)

AMX/Crestron article here: - Articles and Other Work - Showtime-When do you need a show control system?
All the info about the haunted hotel here: - John Huntington's Blog


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