# Pyro starts fire at a concert - again



## BillConnerFASTC (Sep 24, 2017)

Paul McCartney concert at in Syracuse. From a friend in attendance: "During “Live and Let Die”, the pyro sets something on fire in the truss just above the SL/HR video screen. Betsy says it burned for a good 5 to 10 minutes before someone when up and extinguished it. She said that all she could think about when it was burning was The Station, but with 34,000+ people.."

I'm trying to get permission to post video.

Once again, the first line of defense - the stagehand - saves the day.

Got it: http://www.syracuse.com/entertainme...l_mccartney_syracuse_carrier_dome_review.html


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## JD (Sep 25, 2017)

Fire codes, safety systems, and professionalism is why this isn't a front-page horror story. Amazing amount of pyro used on that job, but no big flammable sets.


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## MNicolai (Sep 25, 2017)

This video from a different tour a couple years ago gives a better sense just how much pyro they're firing off. It's enough that I wouldn't be surprised if it takes someone a few minutes just to notice something is amiss.


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## gafftaper (Sep 25, 2017)

Uhh... WOW! That's an amazing amount of pyro! @JD nailed it with his comment. Do it the right way with real professionals who know what they are doing and nobody gets hurt. Do it by yourself and on the cheap and you end up with a horrible tragedy. 

We have gotten used to the idea that there is a product for every budget. In lighting and sound equipment there definitely is. Let's say there's a new Clay Packy fixture that you want but can't afford. You can always drop down a little in price, features, and quality to find a product you can afford. You may end up at the bottom buying random Chinese stuff on Ebay to get something in your budget. But there's always something that at least claims to do what you want in your price range. Some compromises are not that big of a deal, some are significant drops, but if you work your way down the long series of tiers from the very best to the barely functional you can eventually find a product that will do what you need in your price range (in some cases that's more "sort of do what you need"). 

When it comes to areas like Pyro, Rigging, and Electrical power. There's no gradual tier system of quality and features. You either pay to do it right or you risk lives. I think this product for every budget way of thinking becomes a trap that we fall into. It's too easy to think, "I can't afford to hire a professional but..." and from there it gets REALLY dangerous. As someone who teaches the next generation of technicians I emphasize over and over that there are some areas where compromise and creativity is fantastic and some areas where compromise and creativity is deadly. We have to learn the difference between the two and stand tall when your director/promoter/designer/etc... tells you, "Hiring a professional isn't in the budget, we need you to figure out a way to ____ "


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## EdSavoie (Sep 25, 2017)

Funny, my first thought watching the first video was "WOW! Oh wait, those flames are just a touch too tall..."


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## BillConnerFASTC (Sep 26, 2017)

The video I saw shows the fire in the truss much more clearly and distinctly, well above the show pyro.

I don't deny pyro can be done safely but it too ofetn n is not. A part of the backstage culture is to emulate what others do, and too often to try that without the resources. That can be said of a lot of activities but most only endanger one or a very few people: sky diving, boating, mountain climbing, and such come to mind. Even someone driving who shouldn't doesn't expose 100s or 1000s to danger. You do it with insufficient resources and it goes bad - your neck or someone close is on the line. On stage, it endangers a lot of people who do not reasonably expect to be exposed to such hazards. One more large loss of life fire and you can probably count on indoor pyro becoming a whole lot harder if not simply banned.


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## Peter Scheu ASTC (Sep 26, 2017)

Here is a link to the video Bill Conner was referring to:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ksf2n0t2imm6wj4/McCartney pyro2.mp4?dl=0

Fire is just above the SL/HR video screen. Taken by my wife... Giving credit where credit is due... ;-)


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## bclighting (Sep 27, 2017)

gafftaper said:


> Uhh... WOW! That's an amazing amount of pyro! @JD nailed it with his comment. Do it the right way with real professionals who know what they are doing and nobody gets hurt. Do it by yourself and on the cheap and you end up with a horrible tragedy.
> 
> We have gotten used to the idea that there is a product for every budget. In lighting and sound equipment there definitely is. Let's say there's a new Clay Packy fixture that you want but can't afford. You can always drop down a little in price, features, and quality to find a product you can afford. You may end up at the bottom buying random Chinese stuff on Ebay to get something in your budget. But there's always something that at least claims to do what you want in your price range. Some compromises are not that big of a deal, some are significant drops, but if you work your way down the long series of tiers from the very best to the barely functional you can eventually find a product that will do what you need in your price range (in some cases that's more "sort of do what you need").
> 
> When it comes to areas like Pyro, Rigging, and Electrical power. There's no gradual tier system of quality and features. You either pay to do it right or you risk lives. I think this product for every budget way of thinking becomes a trap that we fall into. It's too easy to think, "I can't afford to hire a professional but..." and from there it gets REALLY dangerous. As someone who teaches the next generation of technicians I emphasize over and over that there are some areas where compromise and creativity is fantastic and some areas where compromise and creativity is deadly. We have to learn the difference between the two and stand tall when your director/promoter/designer/etc... tells you, "Hiring a professional isn't in the budget, we need you to figure out a way to ____ "




Just so I understand you correctly, are you suggesting that a Paul McCartney tour is not being done by professionals?


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## EdSavoie (Sep 27, 2017)

I think he's insinuating that if it wasn't done by professionals, the fire would have been a LOT worse


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## bclighting (Sep 27, 2017)

Ok, that is what I was hoping to clarify.

I would also suggest that the second part of professionalism is knowing how to respond when a situation like this DOES occur. Even on the massive tour scale with all of the safeguards in place, things like this can still happen. Performing on that level also includes the proper plan in place to act upon these unfortunate occurrences.


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## kendal69 (Sep 27, 2017)

Controlling Pyro is like controlling Mother Nature, no one really knows what will happen once a storm hits, of once Pyro is set off. Doesn't matter how "professional" you are, there are too many variables that no one person or team of people can account for. Use your imagination on the number of things that can go wrong. What is someone left a rag, or paper near the pyro. What if there is a leak in the line, a spark, a gust of wind for the AC etc etc etc. I'm surprised that pyro accidents don't happen more often actually.


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## gafftaper (Sep 27, 2017)

EdSavoie said:


> I think he's insinuating that if it wasn't done by professionals, the fire would have been a LOT worse


Yes Exactly. The point was everything was created, designed, and operated by professionals. So when something went wrong, it was a very minor issue that was easily addressed.


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## bclighting (Sep 27, 2017)

Copy that!

At first glance of this entire thread I was a bit bristled. Now that I go back and look it over again, (JD's comment in particular) I realize it was all in praise of how the situation was handled. Apologize for my potentially perceived argumentative tone, I was prepared to come to the defense of those on the tour as there are a few that I have worked with before


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## BillConnerFASTC (Sep 27, 2017)

It's a great example of why pyro should be restricted to only the very best professionals, and kept out of the hands of anyone but the very best. The bar is too low now.


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## EdSavoie (Sep 27, 2017)

I don't know about your side of the border, but up here you're _supposed _to have your certification from the ministry of natural resources.

Come to think of it, part of why I chose my current program was that it allows you to write into the ministry to receive said license once completed...


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