# ETC ColorSource Spot Jr Announced



## dvsDave

We welcome the newest addition to the ColorSource fixture family, the ColorSource Spot jr. At only 12 lb (5.5 kg), you’ll love how lightweight this fixture is. ColorSource Spot jr is nearly half the weight, half the size, and half the price of a full-sized ColorSource Spot. 

Like the other ColorSource fixtures, Spot jr offers stunning colors and precise dimming at an affordable price. Available in both original and Deep Blue arrays, Spot jr has built-in 25-50-degree zoom, great for small stages, club spaces, and retail with both longer and shorter throws.

With over 5,700 lumens of brightness ColorSource Spot jr gives you more of what you love at a fraction of the cost AND a fraction of the size.










ColorSource Spot jr





www.etcconnect.com


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## Footer

Exciting. Any news on the ability to have something to point it at?

*I'm legit surprised anyone is releasing anything new right now*.


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## dvsDave

Footer said:


> Exciting. Any news on the ability to have something to point it at?
> 
> *I'm legit surprised anyone is releasing anything new right now*.


Well, if you are going to release something, a Jr/smaller/cheaper version would be the right move. Suitable for small rooms/venues/small HoW, I think those places will be the first to recover. It's going to be the large venues that will suffer the longest.


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## gafftaper

Yeah schools and churches will continue to have budgets...perhaps reduced, but lots of schools are still being built and people like me still have budget money .


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## rsmentele

Im just gonna say... I've never really loved the Jr series... But they have their place I guess. Will be interesting to see what kind of output this can provide.


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## cbrandt

This is a pretty phenomenal light when you compare quality of light, output, and price. Sure, it isn't really going to have a place on huge stages, and no one likes a zoom for gobos, but how many streetfront or community theaters have been using their S4 Jr Zooms as their only source of light for a couple of decades?


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## SteveB

Footer said:


> Exciting. Any news on the ability to have something to point it at?
> 
> *I'm legit surprised anyone is releasing anything new right now*.



And for whenever they/we open, ain't no money no how.


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## sk8rsdad

SteveB said:


> And for whenever they/we open, ain't no money no how.


There might be money if some infrastructure programs are created to kickstart the economy. It doesn't hurt to dream.


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## JohnD

(how about a swerve smiley?)
I was curious back when ETC created the ColorSource CYC. They got away with the original and deep blue versions of other fixtures in the line by using two blues.. I wondered if they would be able to stuff all that blue goodness into perhaps a Version 2 of the other ColorSource fixtures. I wonder if there isn't enough room in the fixtures to do so. It would sure simplify choosing which one is best..


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## MNicolai

@JohnD, General consensus from everyone I've spoken to is that deep blue is the only one worth using except for those who already bought into the standard blue.

@sk8rsdad, Project funding will be very interesting coming up. I've had a number of existing K12 projects hit the fast forward button while commercial projects have slowed or paused. The greatest risk factor for public projects is the inevitable state budget shortages. In FL, we have an annual budget of around $93 Bn, and a monthly tax revenue shortfall right now of $800-900M. In a 12-month cycle, could see a full 10% shortage on the budget. Not only will future projects lose funding but current projects on the books may have funding withdrawn. Like the other critical areas of stimulus, largely comes down to how the federal gov't chooses to step in -- or not.

Infrastructure projects would definitely be the way to go though. Many of those projects can be executed in a social distancing-friendly manner, especially the outdoor bridges/tunnels/highways type projects and the first 9-12 months of vertical construction on typical new construction projects. Better to employ people in that manner than through unemployment, and from a social distancing perspective better than having them work in retail/hospitality or a cube farm. I think most of the WPA-era theaters have fallen out of style finally but there were a few generations of people who grew up in theaters built by the WPA to help crawl out of the Great Depression. Wouldn't shock me to see a similar initiative again.

@rsmentele, Not sure if 5700lm is max output or based on 3200/5600K or such, but doesn't look too far off from Colorsource Spot -- maybe 10-15% less. Wonder where they peeled all of the cost out of aside from the body. Particularly if there's something compromised in the optics that would be noticeable or not to the average viewer.


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## dvsDave

MNicolai said:


> @rsmentele, Not sure if 5700lm is max output or based on 3200/5600K or such, but doesn't look too far off from Colorsource Spot -- maybe 10-15% less. Wonder where they peeled all of the cost out of aside from the body. Particularly if there's something compromised in the optics that would be noticeable or not to the average viewer.



ETC has said it's about 80% as bright as the regular Colorsource spot.


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## TuckerD

I really like the direction that ETC's industrial design is going the last few years. And I really like the color source line. Looks like another great product.


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## derekleffew

Where's the colorframe / tophat holder?

How much weight did they save (if that's the reason) by cutting out parts of the yoke? How much does this add to cost to manufacture?

Rotating barrel?


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## Jim Uphoff

derekleffew said:


> Where's the colorframe / tophat holder?
> 
> How much weight did they save (if that's the reason) by cutting out parts of the yoke? How much does this add to cost to manufacture?
> 
> Rotating barrel?


The accessories can be added to the fixture via an accessory holder that is mounted using 4 screws. 

The yoke design was done mostly for aesthetics but I guess it did save some weight as well. 

This fixture does not have a rotating barrel.


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## egilson1

MSRP?


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## Jim Uphoff

egilson1 said:


> MSRP?


It has a list price of $1100 USD and carries the same 5/10 year warranty as the rest of the ColorSource family.


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## TimMc

Footer said:


> Exciting. Any news on the ability to have something to point it at?
> 
> *I'm legit surprised anyone is releasing anything new right now*.



They've got a new product that has been months (or more) in development and it's ready for market. Not introducing it would mean NONE would sell. ETC made the right move.


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## theatricalmatt

$1100 MSRP? That, ahem, is not less than half the cost of a ColorSource Spot. I was hoping it'd be around the same cost as a ColorSource PAR.

I can forgive the lack of a rotating barrel -- conventional S4 juniors don't have that feature, either. The gel frame is still useful in theatrical settings. I bet this will find a home in architural and museum settings, and probably quite a few storefront / basement theaters, too.

EDIT: I wonder if there will be a Pearl (variable white) version released later.


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## dvsDave

theatricalmatt said:


> $1100 MSRP? That, ahem, is not less than half the cost of a ColorSource Spot. I was hoping it'd be around the same cost as a ColorSource PAR.
> 
> I can forgive the lack of a rotating barrel -- conventional S4 juniors don't have that feature, either. The gel frame is still useful in theatrical settings. I bet this will find a home in architural and museum settings, and probably quite a few storefront / basement theaters, too.
> 
> EDIT: I wonder if there will be a Pearl (variable white) version released later.


MSRP isn't what the dealers will charge you, you are probably looking just unde $900 and ETC has said that the pearl isn't gonna happen.


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## JohnD

As far as pricing, it looks like the list price for the ColorSource engine and shutter barrel is $ 1655, and the list price for the 25-50 zoom lens tube is $ 600.........


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## rsmentele

Yea, You have to take into account cost of engine AND lens, so $1100 is pretty spot on. Just about 1/2 the price.


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## theatricalmatt

Okay, since people are starting to dogpile me, I don't mind defending myself.

A quick Google search yields several dozen advertisements for CS Spots, with lens, for $1500 - 1650. That's a catalog price, and I'm certain that installations and other high-volume sales will be getting better prices. 

The CS Spot Engine (no lens) goes for less, and established venues are likely to already have lenses to swap into them ... so that's also a false comparison.

Either way, no, the CS Spot jr isn't half the price of a ColorSource Spot. Maybe a Lustr.


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## MNicolai

List price on the CS Spot is $1655, and the 25/50 Zoom is $640, which is $2295. Cut that in half and you're at about $1150. For all intents and purposes, ETC's advertising of 50% the cost is accurate.

Yes, there will be people who already own lenses but it starts to become hair splitting to consider how any particular venue might be situated already on a scrapyard of leftover tubes and bodies.

Aside from that, I imagine most of the markets this is targeted toward will have additional savings over the lifetime of the fixtures. They won't buy into extra tubes that'll be sitting around somewhere, the zoom knob allows for wider "frosting" without having to drop a filter in every fixture in the install, and if you can largely standardize on this fixture in a rep plot type scenario, you will save quite a bit on labor not having to rehang fixtures as often, swap between on-stage and catwalk positions, and all the associated time readdressing and recabling fixtures. The makes this fixture a pretty good multipurpose screwdriver -- especially for small theaters, ballrooms, houses of worship, museums, and such. It also avoids having a graveyard of extra lens tubes stashed in a closet somewhere. Not to mention it's half the weight which is both cheaper shipping for first-time purchase and safer/easier to work with on a ladder.

As with the original Jr lineup or with any other product, it will not be the perfect fixture for everyone and others may have good reason to spend the extra money to have the full-size CSSPOTS or S2's, but for those people for whom it's appropriate or who otherwise couldn't afford ETC, it's a very price competitive product with low cost of ownership.

Ultimately this puts it in a price bracket event at _list price_ it competes with reputable vendors like Blizzard and American DJ. That's nothing to scoff at for something that comes with the ETC build quality and warranty.


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## JohnD

I don't want to sound like a Joe Pesci wiseguy, and I do mean this in the nicest possible way but there is a problem with Google shopping.


Since there is a drop down box for lens tube, you have to go to the website to see the actual price.


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## Mac Hosehead

I look forward to see a shootout between an incandescent S4 Jr Zoom and this Colorsource. I am sure I'll get to see it when things open up more.

Good thing it's half the weight. I think I said "Holy Moly" the first time I picked up a Colorsource spot or something to that effect.


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## almorton

Is there any likelihood of a (proper) fresnel in the line up? With the full size colorsource and lustr there is a fresnel adapter, of course, but it makes for a very large fixture. A small colorssource F would be a game changer for smaller venues (such as our own) where on stage we mainly use Strand Quartet F and Prelude F, with some Patt 123 still doing loyal service and even the occasional Minim to fill in. Larger fixtures (such as Cantata and Patt. 743) get used for bigger washes, but the 650W small fixture is our workhorse, and fits in well with our limited grid space. We can _just about_ fit colorsource+fresnel adapter into our stage grid, but it's tight, and it's making us look to other manufacturer's alternatives.


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## gafftaper

almorton said:


> Is there any likelihood of a (proper) fresnel in the line up?



I've got you covered @Jim Uphoff... Take the weekend off. 

"ETC is always working on new and interesting products"


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## tjrobb

gafftaper said:


> I've got you covered @Jim Uphoff... Take the weekend off.
> 
> "ETC is always working on new and interesting products"


I'm holding out for a PC spot...


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## gafftaper

tjrobb said:


> I'm holding out for a PC spot...


ETC is always working on new and interesting products... But personally I kind of doubt that one.


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## macsound

Not that it's an everyday usecase, but as we've seen with the uptick in any product you could possibly use at home or in a small studio, I presume smaller fixtures will become more and more prevalent. 
When all the latenight crew went home, they went home to quarantine with their favorite techs because they had to do the show and they couldn't do it alone. 

Kind of like how news anchors are given a broadcast camera and tripod that they're required to keep locked in their car in case there's relevant news, I'm predicting more entertainers, executives, pastors, motivational speakers, highbrow educators and political figures will build at-home studios in the next year or so. 

I've seen people like the Bon Appetit test kitchen ship lights, cameras, iPhones, iPads and wireless lavs to their tv hosts so the show can continue working from home while the producers are remote via a zoom call. I've heard my local morning show radio station broadcasting from home after ripping out tons of equipment from the studio so they sound exactly the same while broadcasting from home. I predict that will all stay at their home. Little ol' me has also been doing it too. Filming at least one 5 minute video for an educational kids museum every week. I'm getting good at cutting gel to fit MR16s.

In any case, smaller lighting accommodates lower ceilings, pretty much something that all of us at home have and, in some of these cases, you might need to make a whole late-night set in someone's spare bedroom. Kino-flos fit and work perfectly in 8-9' ceilings but getting those amazing colors and gobos are rough when a source4 is 1/5 the height of your room.


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## MNicolai

@macsound, not probably at the price point you were hoping, but I think that niche of small/portable film lighting fixtures in ETC's catalog is filled by ETC's fos/4 fixture. Though, in ETC fashion, they went the most expensive way possible with a premium set of features. Intended to compete with the other top color calibrated LED soft light sources by MFR's like Arri-- not the "here's a panel of LED's behind a diffusion filter with an intensity knob and a barn door" market.


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## macsound

Oh of course not at the price points I want but there are lights out there that fit my scenario (fictional or not) that I think will see so much action, the distributors will wonder why and eventually that will trickle up to the manufacturers.
Not sure about that fos/4. For the price, industry people would stick to skypanels.
Or like my friend Alex here, Nanlite for $800. This is his home zoom setup.

edit to make photo thumbnail instead of massive...


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## ScottT

gafftaper said:


> ETC is always working on new and interesting products



I say "new and exciting things" when asked if I know anything because there are always fun non-product things happening (educational materials, anyone?).


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## gafftaper

ScottT said:


> I say "new and exciting things" when asked if I know anything because there are always fun non-product things happening (educational materials, anyone?).


I went with the classic that I heard directly from Fred Foster when I was asking about the lack of a low end product (which was filled by Element).


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## techteama

Was looking at the spec sheet for Colorsource Jr and I notice it’s tested to UL1598, which I recall specifically says that it can’t be applied to “Stage and Studio Luminaries”, or “Amateur Movie Lights”. What is the intended application for them if not on stage, studio, or movies?

Also I took a look at the CRI and TM-30 scores and they are a bit low. Where do you think these would work well?


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## STEVETERRY

techteama said:


> Was looking at the spec sheet for Colorsource Jr and I notice it’s tested to UL1598, which I recall specifically says that it can’t be applied to “Stage and Studio Luminaries”, or “Amateur Movie Lights”. What is the intended application for them if not on stage, studio, or movies?
> 
> Also I took a look at the CRI and TM-30 scores and they are a bit low. Where do you think these would work well?



There is no prohibition to using cord-and-plug connected UL1598-listed luminaires in stage or studio applications. However, certain AHJ's may object to using UL1573-listed stage and studio luminaires in architectural applications. The main reason for this is now in the past: high surface temperatures on stage luminaires caused by high wattage tungsten lamps.

ST


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## macsound

STEVETERRY said:


> There is no prohibition to using cord-and-plug connected UL1598-listed luminaires in stage or studio applications. However, certain AHJ's may object to using UL1573-listed stage and studio luminaires in architectural applications. The main reason for this is now in the past: high surface temperatures on stage luminaires caused by high wattage tungsten lamps.
> 
> ST


Would this have been a limitation, for example, of using tungsten source fours for store retail lighting because of of the drop ceiling proximity?


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## STEVETERRY

macsound said:


> Would this have been a limitation, for example, of using tungsten source fours for store retail lighting because of of the drop ceiling proximity?


That could be one example. Another would be possible injury to unqualified personnel who might grab a hot fixture to focus it.

ST


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## JohnD

This is sort of a question for @Kelite but I wonder if the Smart-Move Jr. would work with this fixture?


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## Kelite

Great question! If the accessory gate/slot of the ColorSource Jr is the same size and shape as that of the S4 Jr, then the Smart Move Jr should work just fine. 
I haven't yet seen the ColorSource Jr so I can't be sure-


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## theatricalmatt

Kelite said:


> Great question! If the accessory gate/slot of the ColorSource Jr is the same size and shape as that of the S4 Jr, then the Smart Move Jr should work just fine.
> I haven't yet seen the ColorSource Jr so I can't be sure-



The tech sheet lists just an M-size gobo slot, not an accessory slot. Sure would be nice, though!


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## Darin

The ColorSource series just completely prices so many theatres out


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## dvsDave

Darin said:


> The ColorSource series just completely prices so many theatres out



It's retailing for $880 at all the dealer sites, and that's the whole package, minus a clamp and safety cable. It's a lot of versatility for the money, but for many places, yes, LED's are an expensive proposition. However, there are grants to help with going green, tax incentives, and other potentially cost offsetting programs. It's definitely something that needs to be researched thoroughly to see what resources your venue may have available to it in your city, county, state, etc. And fundraising is always an option. Where there's a will, there's a way.


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## cbrandt

You can't argue with a dimming system that is already installed, of course. But when you compare numbers for reasonably priced LEDs versus new dimmable fixtures and dimmers, you'll find those prices aren't so far apart. A lot of spaces compare fixture price to fixture price without taking the entire system into account. That doesn't help all the existing theaters with existing systems, unfortunately.


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## JohnD

Another thing to consider is that with color changing fixtures, you don't have to double or triple hang fixtures to have different colored lights per scene. I did read of one LD however who still insisted on double hanging for more perfect crossfades.


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## DrewE

cbrandt said:


> But when you compare numbers for reasonably priced LEDs versus new dimmable fixtures and dimmers, you'll find those prices aren't so far apart. A lot of spaces compare fixture price to fixture price without taking the entire system into account.



There's also likely to be savings in new installations due to needing fewer circuits for the lights (as LEDs use less power than conventional fixtures), and lower air conditioning requirements allowing for smaller units to be selected. And, as was mentioned, these aren't really applicable to existing venues where the infrastructure is already in place.


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## macsound

JohnD said:


> Another thing to consider is that with color changing fixtures, you don't have to double or triple hang fixtures to have different colored lights per scene. I did read of one LD however who still insisted on double hanging for more perfect crossfades.


The crossfade thing is real and something to be careful in programming. The colors that are created when fading up two distinct colors are very different than when fading between two colors with LEDs or CMY on a moving light. 

About a year ago I worked with a church leaving one building that had dimmers and moving into a space without them. Saved a bunch of money because the new building didn't have enough power for the dimmer rack, so we did distributed 20A circuits for Source4WRDS and moving lights and a couple 3phase circuits for smartbars to reuse a limited portion of the conventionals.
I think just the electrical install saved them about $30k so they just spent what they made on selling the old sensor rack and conventionals on some LEDs and were good to go.


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## Darin

cbrandt said:


> You can't argue with a dimming system that is already installed, of course. But when you compare numbers for reasonably priced LEDs versus new dimmable fixtures and dimmers, you'll find those prices aren't so far apart. A lot of spaces compare fixture price to fixture price without taking the entire system into account. That doesn't help all the existing theaters with existing systems, unfortunately.



Most of us are working within existing systems, and a conversion from dimmer-based conventionals to LED's involves not only the cost of the fixtures, but some infrastructure changes as well (i.e. swapping to non-dim modules and/or running AC all over your space)


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## rsmentele

Crossfade mixing would also happen with a double hung system.... It would just mix a different color than an LED perhaps. Only way to TRULY avoid it would be a blackout to lights up.


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## ScottT

macsound said:


> The crossfade thing is real and something to be careful in programming. The colors that are created when fading up two distinct colors are very different than when fading between two colors with LEDs or CMY on a moving light.



Funnily enough there's an Eos tool that approximates this (fading between two gel fixtures). Obviously it's better with ETC fixtures, as the Eos knows much more about that fixture than one that isn't one of theirs...


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## almorton

almorton said:


> Is there any likelihood of a (proper) fresnel in the line up?



Well *Hello* fos/4 

Although I get the impression these are aimed more at TV and film than theatre, is that right?


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