# One More Reason Not To Buy Behringer



## mbenonis (Feb 20, 2006)

Behringer is finally getting what they had coming for what seems like forever:

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-263862A1.doc

One more reason not to buy anything Behringer...


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## Mayhem (Feb 20, 2006)

So does this mean that we will now see even cheaper units hit the marked with lower quality components and little (if any) quality control (a good way to cut costs is to remove quality control) so that they can pay their fine and still retain a market share?


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## AVGuyAndy (Feb 20, 2006)

One million dollars is nothing.


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## soundlight (Feb 20, 2006)

And while we're on the topic of Behringer, they might have Mackie breathing down their neck again soon...Behri's new preamps are called "XENYX", comparable in name to the "ONYX" preamps of Mackie.

http://www.behringer.com/XENYX-SERIES/index.cfm?lang=ENG


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## mbenonis (Feb 20, 2006)

Gee, why am I not surprised one bit? What the FCC really needs to do is request an injunction against Behringer to prevent them from selling their products in the US, period. Then again, IANAL, I are an engineer. But something needs to be done. I'll step off of my soapbox now.


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## AVGuyAndy (Feb 20, 2006)

mbenonis said:


> What the FCC really needs to do is request an injunction against Behringer to prevent them from selling their products in the US, period



Why? Behringer does have some good products.


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## Mayhem (Feb 20, 2006)

Trouble is that in many cases the products are made off shore, where the labour is cheaper. Well, a lot of the time you can actually get them to produce the same products for you, with your brand name on them.

They cost you the same but you can then afford to sell them cheaper, as you do not have the R&D costs to try and recoup. After the cost of the unit and shipping are covered, the rest is profit!

Also - who said that a million was nothing? PM me for my postal address and I will gladly accept a bank cheque for 1 million


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## BillESC (Feb 21, 2006)

Here's a link to the entire FCC document, it makes for interesting reading. The affected models are on the last two pages.

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-06-13A1.pdf


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## avkid (Feb 21, 2006)

AVGuyAndy said:


> Why? Behringer does have some good products.


Yes they do have some good products like guitar amps and that genius battery field mixer you see everywhere, but they also make some almost outright copies of patented and trademarked products )witness the Xenyx mentioned earlier.)


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## avkid (Feb 21, 2006)

From my understanding of patents and infringements of said patents shouldn't the FTC(Federal Trade Commission) rather that the FCC(Federal Communcations Commission)be handling the situation?


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## AVGuyAndy (Feb 21, 2006)

The FCC is fining them because several of their products are not FCC certified, not because of copyright infringement.


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## BillESC (Feb 22, 2006)

Behringers history of copyright infringement and the stealing of intellectual property is well known and indisputable.

This is just another example of Behringers perchant for cutting corners to maximize profit.


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## Andy_Leviss (Feb 24, 2006)

avkid said:


> Yes they do have some good products like guitar amps and that genius battery field mixer you see everywhere, but they also make some almost outright copies of patented and trademarked products )witness the Xenyx mentioned earlier.)



Actually, if you're talking about the model that takes a couple 9V batteries and saves space by putting the channel fader next to rotary pots for the auxes (or is it the EQ knobs? can't remember of the top of my head), that's not an original. It's a copy of a Peavey design.


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## fosstech (Feb 24, 2006)

soundlight said:


> And while we're on the topic of Behringer, they might have Mackie breathing down their neck again soon...Behri's new preamps are called "XENYX", comparable in name to the "ONYX" preamps of Mackie.
> http://www.behringer.com/XENYX-SERIES/index.cfm?lang=ENG



It's not the first time Behringer ripped off a design from Mackie. Look at a lot of their older small mixers, almost everything looks the same. A while back Mackie sued Behringer over the same issue. Behringer made a copy of the Mackie 8-Bus series years ago, and it was a little too much like the Mackie. Mackie won, and Behringer was forced to stop production of their version of the 8-Bus. I wouldn't be surprised if we see another lawsuit from Mackie here in the near future.


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## mbenonis (Feb 24, 2006)

I've heard that Behringer even duplicates the user manuals, so well in fact that in some cases they even included the original manufacturer's contact information. However, I have never seen this for myself so I can't say for sure whether this is true or not.


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## Mayhem (Feb 24, 2006)

mbenonis said:


> I've heard that Behringer even duplicates the user manuals, so well in fact that in some cases they even included the original manufacturer's contact information. However, I have never seen this for myself so I can't say for sure whether this is true or not.



If Behringer were smart, they would include the original manufacturers warranty card as well. Just think how much money they could save. 

No R&D costs, no writers to create manuals and no warranty costs either, boy they will rake it in. Wonder if it is too late to buy shares!


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## DMX512 (Feb 27, 2006)

I have used alot of there products and all of them have been great. There also alot cheaper than other companies. o wel i dont hold a grudge against them.

only my opinion


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## gafftaper (Mar 8, 2006)

BillESC said:


> Here's a link to the entire FCC document, it makes for interesting reading. The affected models are on the last two pages.
> 
> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-06-13A1.pdf



Wow that was fun reading!! I have to agree that they are running a massive knock off operation... I also have to admit purchasing some of their products. No it's not the best stuff out there but when you are running a High School theater on $600 a year you have to make do with what you can.


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## MircleWorker (Mar 17, 2006)

AVGuyAndy said:


> One million dollars is nothing.


1 Million Pesos, is nothing.


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## Austinro (Mar 25, 2006)

I'm not sure where I read this, but apparently Behringer got sued by a company (Roland?) for blatantly copying a guitar pedal. The company proved that Behringer stole the product because Behringer copied a flaw in the circuit board.


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## soundlight (Mar 25, 2006)

For some strange reason, _I'm not surprised!_


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## Eboy87 (Mar 26, 2006)

Austinro said:


> I'm not sure where I read this, but apparently Behringer got sued by a company (Roland?) for blatantly copying a guitar pedal. The company proved that Behringer stole the product because Behringer copied a flaw in the circuit board.


 
Yep, that was Roland that sued. Behringer's pedals also looked exactly like Roland's Boss pedals (guitarists here, you know what they look like), the only difference being that they said Behringer on them instead of Boss. Do a search on ProSoundWeb's forums (the basement) and somebody posted pics. There's a few threads on the topic.


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## Mayhem (Mar 27, 2006)

Was speaking to a friend the other day about our friends at Bhringer and how they were recently in hot water with the FCC. His comment was that we can expect to see these units discounted and sold of quickly. 

He told me about them loosing a court case some time ago in which they were prohibited from manufacturing any more of the item in question (EQ or compressor – I can’t quite remember) but the court ruling didn’t stop them from selling their existing stock.

What they did was reduce the sale price on this item dramatically to clear their stock, which paid off the fine and legal costs and still gave them money to bank.

On a side line to this, he told me about a documentary he once saw that showed how big businesses can get away without paying their taxes. Apparently, when they are ordered to produce their financial records etc, they literally pack up every item of paper and send it to the IRS. 

By law, the IRS has to stamp each individual page as being recorded and logged and then has to provide secure storage for the duration of the investigation/audit. Apparently, when you send a couple of truck loads of financial documents, the IRS is unable to provide the man hours and storage to complete the job. As such, they withdraw the order.

Oh to be rich and powerful!


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