# Cleaning 36 degree S4 lenses...a conundrum.



## calkew5 (May 20, 2010)

Obviously some Source Four Barrels (the 36, the 14, 70, and 90) have more than one lens. What I've noticed is this makes them very difficult to clean. In a barrel with a single lens, you can just sort of reach in there and dust things off, reaching a reasonably acceptable level of dust removal. But on a barrel like the 36 degree, you have just enough room between the tube and the lenses to catch a lot of dust and grime, but not enough to get in there and get rid of it.

If it were just dust, canned air would be the solution, but the sides of the lenses I can't reach seem to accumulate a lot of brightness-reducing crud. The only other option is to take the barrels apart, which seems to result in a lot of little lost parts (you know what I'm talking about if you've ever done it). And they never seem to go back as easily as they came apart.

Has anyone devised a clever fix for this annoying circumstance? Please share.

Thanks.


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## DELO72 (May 21, 2010)

I'm waiting to hear an answer just for curiousity sake. I had the same issue at my last job and didn't know how to go about it either. One thing- NEVER use windex. S4 lenses have an optical coating on them that it removes. (The manual mentions this). 

Maybe call up ETC? I also bet that Ship could answer this one in seconds. 

I was told that on S4s you never want to crack open the lens train as you are unlikely to get the seal back or the alignment as good as it was before you did it. (Unlike the Colortran 50/50s that were made for that purpose.)


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## HornsOverIthaca (May 21, 2010)

Unfortunately I don't have a very clever fix for this. Cleaning the lenses takes time and care. I use a fairly large rep plot and the fixtures are in the air all year. We use a good amount of fog and haze which tends to create a dusty, sticky mess if the fixtures are in a direct path.

For cleaning 19s and 26s I did not disassemble the lens tubes. I used new painters rags and warm water. I wouldn't use any soap or glass cleaner as the coating may be removed as previously mentioned. However a dilute dish soap may be OK. For some reason I can't remember what that coating does... Anyway for 36s I took the screws out of the lens tube and took it apart, being careful to put the screws into an empty electrical tape container so I didn't misplace them. I took both lenses out, cleaned them, dried them, and put them back in. This was difficult enough and the screws were tight enough that it wasn't feasable to do it from the catwalk. It was necessary to either strike the fixture or remove the lens tube.

I actually wouldn't use canned air. It's kind of pricy and is getting harder to get. I only use it for dusting fiber optic connections. Also in my case it's not a good idea to have it around high school students. Maybe I can't remember what the optical coating is for because I use too much canned air.


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## shiben (May 21, 2010)

Whats those thingies that surgeons use to do surgery on your heard from a hole in your leg? All I ever hear it called on House is a scope, so i assume its something scope, but anyhow, get one of those, swap out some of the surgical instruments for cleaning devices? I mean, it would work, just be really complicated to use and probably require special training.


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## starksk (May 21, 2010)

calkew5 said:


> Obviously some Source Four Barrels (the 36, the 14, 70, and 90) have more than one lens. What I've noticed is this makes them very difficult to clean. In a barrel with a single lens, you can just sort of reach in there and dust things off, reaching a reasonably acceptable level of dust removal. But on a barrel like the 36 degree, you have just enough room between the tube and the lenses to catch a lot of dust and grime, but not enough to get in there and get rid of it.
> 
> ... The only other option is to take the barrels apart, which seems to result in a lot of little lost parts (you know what I'm talking about if you've ever done it). And they never seem to go back as easily as they came apart.
> 
> ...




DELO72 said:


> ... One thing- NEVER use windex. S4 lenses have an optical coating on them that it removes. (The manual mentions this). ....I was told that on S4s you never want to crack open the lens train as you are unlikely to get the seal back or the alignment as good as it was before you did it....




HornsOverIthaca said:


> ... However a dilute dish soap may be OK. For some reason I can't remember what that coating does... Anyway for 36s I took the screws out of the lens tube and took it apart, being careful to put the screws into an empty electrical tape container so I didn't misplace them. I took both lenses out, cleaned them, dried them, and put them back in. This was difficult enough and the screws were tight enough that it wasn't feasable to do it from the catwalk. It was necessary to either strike the fixture or remove the lens tube.....



So I just took two lens barrels apart at my desk because I hadn't thought about this process in a long time. One was a newer revision, one was an older revision. 

The best way to clean both sides of the lenses is to actually take the barrel apart. The Source Four Assembly Guide details how this process works, but basically you are removing the screws and locking nuts that hold each side of the casting together. 

When I did this, I placed the barrel assembly on its side with the screw heads oriented so they were on top. Three of the four screws will have locking nuts. The fourth will not. It doesn't matter what order you remove the screws.

Once the screws are removed, lift the left casting straight up and set it to the side with the interior facing up. You will then see the lenses in their position and may see the rubber lens support pad still attached to the lens. Remove that lens support pad and place it in the correct position on the left casting interior. This will make it easier to put the unit back together. 

Clean the lenses with either Isopropyl alcohol, distilled water, or a 50%-50% mixture of each and a clean lint-free cloth. Do not soak or otherwise leave immersed the lens in any cleaning solution. This can potentially damage the Anti-Reflective coating on the lens.

After you have cleaned the lenses, return them to their correct position with the lens support pads on the bottom of the lens already inserted into the right casting. Then take the left casting and carefully align it so that the lens support pads are making correct contact with the lenses.

I find that it is easiest to insert and tighten the screw that is near the bottom of the color frame holder first as it goes into the threaded part of the casting and does not need to have a nut to retain it. Tighten that screw all the way. That will ensure that your alignment is maintained.

I then go to the opposite corner of the casting furthest from the color frame holder and on the side of the retaining clip next. The casting is the right size to hold the nut from spinning if you get the screw started. Tighten that screw down tight and then move to the one directly across from it still furthest away from the color frame holder.

After those three are tight I set the barrel so the bottom of the color frame holder is on my desk and the retaining clip is up. I then thread and tighten the last screw. At this point, all of the screws should be tight and the sides of the two castings should be together.

This is not something that you will want to do at the fixture while it is hanging. 

And now for the obligatory warnings from the Manual:

Source Four Manual said:


> Do not use ammonia-based or other harsh commercial cleaners. Clean lens
> and reflector only as directed.
> Commercially available glass cleaning agents should be avoided as they
> may contain ammonia, other harsh chemical detergents or abrasive agents.
> ...



Sorry for the novel...


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## SteveB (May 21, 2010)

I will be cutting and pasting Kirks instruction's as summer maintenance is soon approaching and the folks need reminding.

Obviously, you do not need to dis-assemble the lens case if it's a single lens unit (19, 26 & 50 degree, the Enhanced Definition units all have dual lenses, BTW). This document from ETC is useful - http://www.etcconnect.com/docs/docs_downloads/manuals/S4_Lens_Tube_Product_Update.pdf

2 thoughts for folks considering purchases of alternative ellpisoidals to an S4, namely Altman. 

We have roughly 72 Altman 4.5" zooms, 48 fixed degree Shakespeares and 20 Shakespeare zooms (as opposed to nearly 200 S4 ellipspidals facility wide). The Shakespeare zoom has a rear lense as well as the 2 used for the zoom optics. Access to the rear lens requires dis-assembly of the lens assembly from the rear fixture body to gain access for cleaning, which takes significantly longer to accomplish then a comparable S4 zoom fixture. Likewise, unlike the quick release door on the S4 that allows access to the lens door, the Shakespeare has removable thumb screws, which can get lost. 

As to lens accessibility on the fixed lens Shakespeares (as well as the 4.5" zooms - which is a dis-continued item), the Altman design has steel screws threading into the taped aluminum lens body. The S4 uses nylon insert locking nuts. The nuts are more time consuming to assemble but have the huge advantage of not stripping out over time, the way the aluminum tapped screw hole does on Altmans. 

Just some thoughts


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## mstaylor (May 22, 2010)

I would folllow Kirk's advice, sounds like a good system. This is no different than taking any piece of equipment apart. Have a recepticle to place the small screws in to retain them. Anytime you take anything apart you have to be very methodical, if not stuff gets lost. If you are in a school setting and don't think the kids will do it as asked, don't ask. teach them to bench focus and let them do that after you have cleaaned the optics. 
E tape containers have been mentioned, which are good, I prefer foam rubber, the ones out of lamp boxes are good. They have the hollowed out spot and you can lay the screws in there and they are less likely to slide.


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## len (May 22, 2010)

Getting your work area prepped is the key. Get an area 2 - 3 x as big as you think you need. Get a couple towels to lay the project on, and get something to put your parts in. I use aluminum disposable loaf pans lined with towels. And sweep the floor real well before you start the project. If you do drop something it'll be easier to find it.


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## BryanKacz (May 22, 2010)

At our theater (approx 350 source 4s) we put the 36 deg barrels in the dishwasher with no soap. We end up with some small water spots, but they're much better than before we start.


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## cdub260 (May 22, 2010)

calkew5 said:


> The only other option is to take the barrels apart, which seems to result in a lot of little lost parts (you know what I'm talking about if you've ever done it). And they never seem to go back as easily as they came apart.



In ten years of servicing my Source 4's, I have lost one spring from the gel retaining clip, which I promptly replaced. I found it two days later. If you're meticulous about what you're doing, lost parts won't be an issue.

As for the rest, it's very rare that anything goes back together as easily as it comes apart.


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## calkew5 (May 22, 2010)

Let me point out that I've done it the hard way on about 14 barrels now and it's not fun but it's not as bad as it sounds. The parts that I tend to misplace are the nut for the thumbscrew and the spring for the retainer clip. Luckily the nut is a standard size and I have plenty lying around...stupid springs, though...those buggers really get lost easily.

I'm intrigued by the idea of putting the whole lens train in the dishwasher, but I'd be concerned about rust forming.


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## Les (May 22, 2010)

calkew5 said:


> I'm intrigued by the idea of putting the whole lens train in the dishwasher, but I'd be concerned about rust forming.



The barrels themselves are cast aluminum and won't rust, but rust on bolts could definitely be an issue. I would also be concerned about damaging the lens cushions.


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## SteveB (May 22, 2010)

BryanKacz said:


> At our theater (approx 350 source 4s) we put the 36 deg barrels in the dishwasher with no soap. We end up with some small water spots, but they're much better than before we start.



The 36 has dual lenses, so I'm curious as to how clean the inside of the lenses get after the dishwasher routine. 

Which I'm against in concept, but am already to take one home to give it a whirl. 

Won't work on a zoom though....


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## Aaron Bowling (Aug 4, 2017)

I know someone who used to work for a distribution company and would sometimes have to clean hundreds of barrels at a time. Apparently, they used some sort of homemade microfiber cloth/duster attached to a wire bent in an L-shape to reach in between the lenses and clean the inside surfaces. I have yet to try this myself, but I feel like even a modified swiffer duster might work. I will update when I have put this into practice with trial results.


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## gafftapegreenia (Aug 4, 2017)

Compared to some instruments, its a blessing that all it takes is four screws to disassemble the barrel and clean the lenses.


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## soundofsparks (Aug 9, 2017)

This video from ETC Cue talks about this a bit... 

His recommendation is to take apart the ones you have to, that you shouldn't have to take apart most of them.


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## RonHebbard (Aug 10, 2017)

mstaylor said:


> I would follow Kirk's advice, sounds like a good system. This is no different than taking any piece of equipment apart. Have a receptacle to place the small screws in to retain them. Anytime you take anything apart you have to be very methodical, if not stuff gets lost. If you are in a school setting and don't think the kids will do it as asked, don't ask. teach them to bench focus and let them do that after you have cleaned the optics.
> E-tape containers have been mentioned, which are good, I prefer foam rubber, the ones out of lamp boxes are good. They have the hollowed out spot and you can lay the screws in there and they are less likely to slide.


 @mstaylor @steve b. @soundofsparks @gafftapegreenia @BryanKacz @cdub260 @Les
Ice cube trays and / or egg containers can prove useful for sorting / segregating parts in a logical order.
You can set each container down on a used sheet of paper from your printer and use the blank side of the paper to write brief descriptive notes to yourself for ease of reassembly. I found this especially useful when I've disassembled something complex and then had to wait a couple of weeks for a needed part to arrive prior to eventually getting back to reassembly.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.


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## techieman33 (Aug 10, 2017)

RonHebbard said:


> @mstaylor @steve b. @soundofsparks @gafftapegreenia @ BryanKacz @cdub260 @Les
> Ice cube trays and / or egg containers can prove useful for sorting / segregating parts in a logical order.
> You can set each container down on a used sheet of paper from your printer and use the blank side of the paper to write brief descriptive notes to yourself for ease of reassembly. I found this especially useful when I've disassembled something complex and then had to wait a couple of weeks for a needed part to arrive prior to eventually getting back to reassembly.
> Toodleoo!
> Ron Hebbard.



Those are ok for longer term projects, though I usually go to the pile of empty e-tape containers for that. When I'm doing something I like to use magnetic project mats. They're only a few bucks and it's easy to keep screws sorted and labeled.


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## RonHebbard (Aug 10, 2017)

techieman33 said:


> Those are ok for longer term projects, though I usually go to the pile of empty e-tape containers for that. When I'm doing something I like to use magnetic project mats. They're only a few bucks and it's easy to keep screws sorted and labeled.


 @techieman33 Perhaps *not* your best choice *if*: 
*a;* You're dealing with non-ferrous parts.
*b;* You're dealing with parts you don't wish to become magnetized.
In my case, I was disassembling our slide-in gas range / oven / broiler.
A nearby lighting strike brought many items in our home to a halt.
Our stove included an electronic clock / timer / controller which controlled solenoid operated gas valves for the oven's upper and lower jets and an electronic striker for the four stove-top burners.
I soon found myself a-swim amidst a great many seemingly similar parts.
Even the four stove-top burners had three different jet / orifices which, to my eyes, appeared identical except one burner was identified as for "simmering", a second was for "brute force" applications while the remaining two were deemed general purpose. 
By the time I'd dug my way down to the igniter, which I needed to order, I had a great many parts to keep tabs on for a couple of weeks. In my case, stack-able ice-cube trays and egg holders were what came to hand at the time and they served my purposes well. I even succeeded in teaching our cat and dog to leave my carefully sorted parts alone.
BTW; I still speak fluent feline and canine if anyone's in need of a translator. Russian Blue and Affenpincer were my specialty dialects.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.


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## soundofsparks (Aug 10, 2017)

I think the key thing is to only take apart things when you need to. 

I've taken apart moving lights to clean them. Trays and bowls are all helpful. It's not hard to keep track of parts if you're meticulous.

But going back to the OP, I only disassemble lens tubes if there's a need. If you're not running an outdoor theatre and you're cleaning annually, you're not going to need to take apart all of your 36 lens tubes. 

The video I posted is pretty helpful in understanding when you should disassemble and why you don't need to always disassemble.


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