# LDI Las Vegas show for newbie?



## hemismith (Sep 22, 2010)

Hi all,

I just discovered this forum; I've frequented live sound forums for a few years, but I've been doing more theater-oriented things lately. My wife sings at weddings and such so a dozen years ago we bought some equipment. Over the years I've used it a lot for school and church events such as talent shows and plays/musicals. I recently got a little into lighting as well, and now I'm in charge of lighting and sound for my church. It's not a contemporary church though, and we only do this for choir concerts and plays/musicals, which only occur a couple times a year. The largest I've done sound for had 9 wireless mics, 5 hanging choir mics, a few other wired mics, and a live band with 8 inputs. Lighting-wise the biggest show was 21 lights with 115+ cues. An upcoming play will need 12 mics and 26+ lights as currently planned.

My church doesn't own much equipment. Some of it is mine and some is rented. I am in the process of upgrading my equipment, and also putting together proposals for my church to gradually acquire some things. I have not had good luck with renting. But we're both on pretty tight budgets. 

I was planning on going to the LDI Show in Las Vegas next month, mainly for the classes but also to look at equipment. But it seems geared towards high-end shows. What are your opinions on the value of that show for someone in my situation?

Thanks,

Craig


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## DaveySimps (Sep 22, 2010)

Welcome to CB! Great to have you here. Conferences such as LDI and USITT can be great learning opportunity, and I would highly recommend you attending if you can afford the time and expense. Several members here on CB are planning to attend LDI this year so, if you do go, keep your eye out for a post about a meet up for CB members. 

~Dave


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## Footer (Sep 22, 2010)

LDI might be a bit over-kill for what you need. However, there are some conferances made exactly for your demographic. There are a handful of church media conferences out there, just google it and it should help you a bit. Be aware though as with anything, the conferences that are mainly funded by manufactures are going to be geared towards the larger groups that spend the most cash. Being a "church sound guy" or "church lighting guy" is actually a big enough niche that manufactures are now paying strong attention to that market and those people. LDI would be great, however I think you money could be spent better at a conference geared more towards church/worship media. We have some church technicians around here, I am sure they will chime in with a good one. No one wants to see you spend a good amount of cash on a conference that is not going to give you what you need.


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## hemismith (Sep 23, 2010)

Thanks very much for the replies. It would definitely be fun, and it's within driving distance, but I guess I could probably make better use of the money. And time is always valuable. I think my dreams are higher than my budget. They have a class in inexpensive lighting (by WFX actually), but I could buy a couple lights for the cost of attending it. And I don't know if the expo will have anything in my price range to even look at. I hadn't looked at the WFX conferences in the past, as I'm not really their typical demographic (this isn't for worship services), but I see they do have some good classes. Not sure when they'll have anything near me though.

Thanks. I look forward to reading this forum!


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## Footer (Sep 23, 2010)

hemismith said:


> Thanks very much for the replies. It would definitely be fun, and it's within driving distance, but I guess I could probably make better use of the money. And time is always valuable. I think my dreams are higher than my budget. They have a class in inexpensive lighting (by WFX actually), but I could buy a couple lights for the cost of attending it. And I don't know if the expo will have anything in my price range to even look at. I hadn't looked at the WFX conferences in the past, as I'm not really their typical demographic (this isn't for worship services), but I see they do have some good classes. Not sure when they'll have anything near me though.
> 
> Thanks. I look forward to reading this forum!



There are plenty of things in your price range, however they are usually on the cheaper chinese LED or knockoff moving/conventional lighting. You might actually find 99% of your answers that you are looking for at LDI around here, so ask away!


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## Pie4Weebl (Sep 23, 2010)

Perhaps a nice soft way to start would be a book?

A Practical Guide to Stage Lighting, (9780240811413), Steven Louis Shelley, Textbooks - Barnes & Noble


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## hemismith (Sep 23, 2010)

Yes, I will be relying primarily on the advice of people in this forum for equipment choices. Even if they had stuff in my range at the show, I probably wouldn't be able to properly evaluate it. I'm going to do some searches to try to glean as much as I can before asking questions.

That looks like a good book. I have one book, Technical Theater for Nontechnical People, and my wife has a lighting book from college, but it's less practical.

Thanks again.


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## ruinexplorer (Sep 23, 2010)

Another thing is at LDI, Technologies for Worship Magazine has a rather large space and offer some free instruction as well as the courses for a fee. Sure, some of the classes will be for equipment that you don't need at the moment, but some of it will. I'm not sure when WFX will be within driving distance for you since it moves regularly.
LDI does have a lot of higher end gear (especially in this economy, they are the ones that can afford to exhibit) but there are also exhibitors who are looking for the church market (sure it may be Lightronics, but it could be worse). 
Are you looking to buy right now or just to learn? You can buy textbooks (see Theatre Books) or subscribe to industry magazines (see Industry Periodicals), but sometimes hands on experience is of a greater value and manufacturers love to show you how to use their equipment (free education). By the way, the last day gives you the most opportunity to speak with manufacturers as most people leave early. Two days is best to spend if you do plan on going.


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## gafftaper (Sep 23, 2010)

It's close to home and the Technology for worship track of the conference could be very useful training for you. USITT is probably more appropriate for you, but it's not in your back yard. The trade show is a lot of fun and it can be useful to talk to the manufacturers, but the key for you is if you feel the conference is worthwhile.


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## hemismith (Sep 24, 2010)

Thanks everyone. Yes, I am looking to buy some equipment in the near future, although I could postpone the purchase of some of it for a while. Specifically:
- I need some boundary or choir mics pretty soon. 
- I was also planning on getting a new mixer and have been leaning towards either the Yamaha 01V or Presonus Studiolive. But I'm not real happy with either. The problem is I already sold all my outboard effects. But I may be able to get by without any for the near future, and my current mixer would suffice as well if necessary. 
- I would like to get a better lighting controller. I'm leaning towards a PC-based solution.
- And finally, lighting fixtures. I need to put together a plan for my church so they can budget, and I also want to get a few of my own. The problem here is money. I currently only have PARs. I even got some NSP bulbs, but they still don't compare to ellipsoidals. But it would be a long time before we can amass a full suite of those. And even with those, I often need to light just a small area from a pretty good distance, so I need narrow beams. Or I just shutter it down but it wastes light. So I need to figure out what my best options are, and how to get the most for my money.

Anyway, I will look for specific advice on these issues in the forums and post specific questions. As far as the show goes, it's not often that something is within driving distance, but I'll wait and see how things are going in a week or two.

Thanks very much for all the advice, I really appreciate it!


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## gafftaper (Sep 24, 2010)

I went to LDI several years ago when we were setting up a new theater at the college. It was great to have all the manufacturer's reps in one place so I could ask detailed questions about the equipment without getting the spin from a salesman. While you can get a lot of great advice here from people who know their stuff, it was great to get a hands on tour of things like consoles from the creators. For most things I just confirmed that I wanted products already at the top of my list. However, there were some items that I changed my mind on seeing them in person. Also remember that LDI will be back in Vegas in 2012. Plus it's just a lot of fun!


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## derekleffew (Sep 24, 2010)

hemismith said:


> ...As far as the show goes, it's not often that something is within driving distance, but I'll wait and see how things are going in a week or two. ...


How about a compromise? Attend the trade show, but not the training sessions. Free passes for the exhibit hall are available from many manufacturers and other sources. Many attendees have been known to drive in from Phoenix, LA, or SLC just for one day.


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## hemismith (Sep 24, 2010)

derekleffew said:


> How about a compromise? Attend the trade show, but not the training sessions. Free passes for the exhibit hall are available from many manufacturers and other sources. Many attendees have been known to drive in from Phoenix, LA, or SLC just for one day.


 Yeah, actually I've been thinking about that. An exhibit pass isn't too expensive anyway, but free is better if I can get one. I have a couple free hotel nights I can use as well. I'm actually in the market for new speakers too, but ET Live is only demo-ing line arrays, which are out of my budget. That's the problem, all the good stuff is out of my budget.

I apologize, I was thinking TFWM and WFX were one and the same organization, but I guess not. I don't see any free classes though, but I'll check again.

Thanks everyone; really nice people on this board!


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## gafftaper (Sep 24, 2010)

Yeah I don't think there are any free classes at LDI. I posted a link to free exhibit hall passes a while back in the other LDI thread. If that no longer works let us know. I'm sure someone here would be happy to help hook you up with a pass. It's interesting and you'll learn a lot just going to the exhibit hall. You may not be able to hear the actual speakers you are looking for, but you can talk with their manufacturers which is cool. It's also a good chance to talk with some national dealers.

Wandering the exhibit hall talking with dealers and manufacturers saying this is what I can afford how can you help me, could be very helpful.


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## ruinexplorer (Sep 24, 2010)

For more info on TFWM pavillion workshops, go here. The workshops are on the exhibit floor, not in the classrooms. There are other classes offered by TFWM that are for a fee.

The other good thing to do is go to the free technology breakfasts. Each presenter gets 5-10 minutes to show off why you should stop by their booth. There have been a few times that I learned something and even made purchases because of this presentation. It can also be a great way to network as I made contacts with vendors and future job prospects from whom I happened to sit with during the presentation. Plus it's a great place to get swag!

When going to register, try source code GP21 for free admission to the exhibit hall.


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## hemismith (Sep 26, 2010)

Cool, thanks to both. I was planning on the breakfasts initially; hopefully I can fit at least one in. I'm anxious to see what workshops TFWM has; hopefully they'll post that soon.


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## gafftaper (Sep 26, 2010)

New technology breakfasts are really fun and interesting, but don't depend on the breakfast part of it. As I recall there is a room with 500 people and 4 or 5 boxes of donuts.


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## hemismith (Sep 28, 2010)

gafftaper said:


> New technology breakfasts are really fun and interesting, but don't depend on the breakfast part of it. As I recall there is a room with 500 people and 4 or 5 boxes of donuts.


 Good to know!


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## Kelite (Sep 28, 2010)

gafftaper said:


> New technology breakfasts are really fun and interesting, but don't depend on the breakfast part of it. As I recall there is a room with 500 people and 4 or 5 boxes of donuts.


 
The new technology breakfast is a really good idea, for all reasons mentioned. Bear in mind that most people show up late after several manufacturers have shown their gear/expendables and the better breakfast eats are gone. If you don't hit the strip and prefer to get up early, a front row seat and a decent breakfast of pastries, fruit, juice & coffee await you.

I look forward to meeting you hemismith, if you do decide to come to LDI!


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## hemismith (Oct 3, 2010)

Kelite said:


> The new technology breakfast is a really good idea, for all reasons mentioned. Bear in mind that most people show up late after several manufacturers have shown their gear/expendables and the better breakfast eats are gone. If you don't hit the strip and prefer to get up early, a front row seat and a decent breakfast of pastries, fruit, juice & coffee await you.
> 
> I look forward to meeting you hemismith, if you do decide to come to LDI!


 Thanks. I am not a morning person so we'll see how early I get there. But for something like this I might have a little more motivation. Right now I'm planning on arriving Thursday night, and I'm not sure if I'll have to come home Friday night or Saturday.

I see that TFWM finally posted their free workshops.


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## ColbyAtTroy (Oct 3, 2010)

In my opinion, getting the chance to learn anything theatre related is a go. I wouldn't go as far as to say it would be overkill, because lighting, regardless of the play or place, still has the same concept of warm and cool lighting, along with effects and such. Granted, you could probably learn the basics for what you need by yourself and a few YouTube videos, but if you get that chance/funds to go see it, I would say go.

Theatrical Lighting Design Interactive


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## gafftaper (Oct 4, 2010)

Hey Hemi, I wanted to make sure you saw that ETLive has been canceled.


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## hemismith (Oct 4, 2010)

gafftaper said:


> I wanted to make sure you saw that ETLive has been canceled.


 Wow, I hadn't seen that, thanks. I initially was really excited about it, but then I realized it was all line arrays, which are out of my budget. But it would have been good to hear and compare regardless.


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## hemismith (Oct 4, 2010)

ColbyAtTroy said:


> In my opinion, getting the chance to learn anything theatre related is a go. I wouldn't go as far as to say it would be overkill, because lighting, regardless of the play or place, still has the same concept of warm and cool lighting, along with effects and such. Granted, you could probably learn the basics for what you need by yourself and a few YouTube videos, but if you get that chance/funds to go see it, I would say go.


 Thanks for the encouragement. I initially was going to go for SMAART training, but then balked at the cost. There aren't a lot of other courses I'm really interested in:

Thurs: Inexpensive Lighting (not sure if I can go then)
Fri: Power for Lights, LEDs, and Drawing Light Plots (not sure if I really need this)

At $325/4 sessions I'm not sure if it's worth it. And the workshops I'm interested in are on Saturday, which I may not be able to stay for. But I still think it's worth going for the exhibit hall and breakfasts. I'll be driving instead of flying though so I can be flexible.


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## ColbyAtTroy (Oct 5, 2010)

Check that link I posted about the Theatrical Lighting Design Interactive. It's a really useful CD. If you want to learn a little, that would be something to look forward to. Also, I imagine SETC would have tons of things to look at, not just lighting, for cheaper, it seems. I'm hoping to go down myself this year and submerse myself into the pure world of Theatre.


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## hemismith (Oct 7, 2010)

ColbyAtTroy said:


> Check that link I posted about the Theatrical Lighting Design Interactive. It's a really useful CD. If you want to learn a little, that would be something to look forward to. Also, I imagine SETC would have tons of things to look at, not just lighting, for cheaper, it seems.


Thanks, that does look interesting, I'll check it out.


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