# Hazers for Arena



## Outlanderfrog (Feb 4, 2017)

Hey all!

A university I freelance for is building a new sports arena and I'm looking for hazer recommendations, having never spec'ed a venue of that size. Almost every tour that comes thru my home venue recently has had the base hazer pro, but I have no experience with it. Price isn't a huge consideration. Any suggestions?

A secondary, but related question: even though I much prefer the look of oil based haze, is it better to go water based in a venue that will be used daily, and has a brand new basketball court? Or is the difference negligible?


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## porkchop (Feb 4, 2017)

The good old fashioned Radiance hazer from Ultratec served me well when arena touring. Two at floor level were more than enough for us and we usually turned them down quite a ways. I believe MDG makes a fluid that hangs even longer if that's desired.


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## EdSavoie (Feb 4, 2017)

+1 the MDG fluid, we've had to pull out the industrial fans and open the doors to vent our theatre after using it.

I can recall my predecessor flooding the entire stage and house with a thick cloud of haze with very little fluid used after the initial setup, mind you this was before they replaced the rate of rise alarms with the most sensitive optical units I've ever seen.


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## DuckJordan (Feb 10, 2017)

Is the university planning on doing their own concerts in the venue? Or are they going to bring outside shows in? I question the use of a hazer in a sports arena except for concert use.


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## BillESC (Feb 11, 2017)

Plus one on the Radiance. Best hazer under $ 1200


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## np18358 (Feb 11, 2017)

IMHO the MDG Atmosphere is head and shoulders the best hazer. Can't recommend it highly enough. For a arena size venue, the Atmosphere H.O. would be more appropriate. They are definitely expensive, but if cost isn't an issue, they are the choice.


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## Outlanderfrog (Feb 11, 2017)

DuckJordan said:


> Is the university planning on doing their own concerts in the venue? Or are they going to bring outside shows in? I question the use of a hazer in a sports arena except for concert use.



They plan on holding daily chapels as well as concerts in the venue, yes.


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## MikeJ (Feb 12, 2017)

The Base Hazer Pro is the current standard in touring for water based haze. It gives a thicker more smokey haze. It does not have really long hang time though, and if you like a lot of atmosphere, it can go through a gallon and a half running all day. The DF-50 is still the standard for oil based haze. One DF-50, can provide enough haze for a 12,000 seat arena, and only use a few ounces of fluid running all day. The hang time is very long, so you don't need to run the thing constantly to keep the room hazed. Plus DF50 fluid is mineral oil, and has no scent. 
most are
Oil vs Water(glycol) is probably negligible. It becomes more of an issue with oil buildup in moving lights and projectors with long term use. There will be no long term effects on the building or the infrastructure itself. Many areas that do concerts have had decades of tours coming through using DF-50s and other hazers.

My recommendation would be one or two DF-50s with DMX control. IMO they give the best quality haze for most uses, sip fluid, and provided incredibly consistent haze. I do like the base hazer when I want more aggressive atmosphere, and for outdoor shows, with some big fans to direct the haze where it needs to go, before being blown away by the wind. But some do not like the smell(like all 'water' based haze) and fluid consumption and cost are higher. Indoors it does not fill the room the way a DF-50 does.

I have also been impressed with the AMHAZE II from Chauvet. It is very similar to the Base Hazer. There is an AMHAZE Whisper, that is new. I have not used it but from the specs, it is twice the output, and quieter.


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## porkchop (Feb 12, 2017)

Perhaps it's just my mental image, but I would assume that any venue that holds daily chapels is going to want to be pretty clean. Oil based has some advantages, but it does get everywhere and build up over time.


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## MikeJ (Feb 13, 2017)

porkchop said:


> Perhaps it's just my mental image, but I would assume that any venue that holds daily chapels is going to want to be pretty clean. Oil based has some advantages, but it does get everywhere and build up over time.


It depends on the frequency of use, I guess. All hazers will leave some degree of residue, regardless of what is made out from. Particles have to go somewhere. It's either going to be food grade mineral oil, or some form of antifreeze(probably also food grade). I can tell you for a fact, that deposits of mineral oil from DF-50 hazers are a real thing, and your fans and shrouds in moving lights will need to be cleaned every few months with regular use. If you have projectors, this may be a major concern, possibly requiring expensive filters. With water(glycol) haze it may be less or none, but may still require smoke filters for projectors. I have not used water based haze extensively enough and exclusively to know for sure, how much less the residue will be, but I would guess it is less and less gross.


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## Jason Stephenson (Feb 20, 2017)

Hey everyone! I am the one making this hazer purchase and one of my main concerns is immediate residue on the court surface. We are going to do some light shows for player entrances and I want the haze, but I need to make sure that the court is not noticeably slippery after use. Also, I want it to dissipate in 5 minutes or so, that way it does not linger too long into the start of the game or look too noticeable on the production or TV cameras. I have about 10k for this entire purchase including all needed accessories so right now I am thinking either...

1 or 2 MDG ATMe
or
2 CITC AquaMax MP Organic Hazer
or
2 DF-50s

These will also serve as a hazer for our chapel services and the occasional concert. For those who asked. We will not have any projectors installed, everything will be Daktroncs LED displays. But might do projector mapping on the court eventually...

Thanks for your input guys, I have only had the opportunity to use smaller hazers and nothing at this price point.


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## MNicolai (Feb 20, 2017)

How often does the court get scrubbed?

If the court is scrubbed before every event, I don't expect you'll see any residue build-up after a few minutes of use at the top of an event. If it's scrubbed twice a year, that's another story.

I've only worked with the DF-50, which I can say will have a build-up in immediate proximity to it on the floor (10' radius from hazer kind of thing). Beyond that, I can't say I've ever noticed a slick residue on a dance floor after a smokin' the room out several times over a 2-hour show. If immediate proximity to the hazer is an issue for you, I would get the hazer elevated up off of the floor and park a fan under it pointed upward. Same as before though -- I'm not sure you'll see any noticeable build-up after a few minutes. Run it for 20 minutes straight and you might though.

By the way, if you have projectors in the same room check the filters. Some require a special fog/haze filter. If haze regularly without fog filters in place, you'll build up a residue on your projectors' light engines that'll burn into a splotchy cake. Only fix is to replace the light engines.


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## techieman33 (Feb 20, 2017)

Wanting quick dissipating haze changes the situation quite a bit. I don't have enough experience with the other hazers to say for sure but I would take the DF-50 off your list. The haze from those can hang around for hours.


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## derekleffew (Feb 20, 2017)

techieman33 said:


> ...take the DF-50 off your list. The haze from those can hang around for hours.


Except when using Reel Oil-Less fluid. Then the complaint is the LACK of hang time. Which might be perfect for this application.


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## MikeJ (Feb 20, 2017)

derekleffew said:


> Except when using Reel Oil-Less fluid. Then the complaint is the LACK of hang time. Which might be perfect for this application.



True. The quality of the oil-less fluid haze is still finer and more df-50 like than most "water" based haze. You also CAN mix oil-less DF-50 fluid with standard DF-50 fluid, so you can switch fluids for different applications, but trying to pour fluid out of a DF50 is not fun, and can be very messy. NEVER mix or use any other type of fluid in a df-50.

I'd say If you want minimal hang time, you are better off just getting a pair of water based hazers, more output when you need it, quicker dissipation. There are timed fluids now from CITC and Elation, as well as others. You can get very specific hang times. 3 second, 1 minute, 15 minutes, etc.


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